Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    I woke up to the somewhat surprising news that Pope Benedict, the head of the Catholic Church for just under 8 years..is resigining effective February 28th.  Surprising news primarily because he is stepping down during Lent.

    I remember following the last papal conclave with my son and being quite surprised at the brevity of a process that has been known to go for many days in  modern times...many months in ancient times. Benedict ( Joseph Ratzinger) was elected after only four ballots.

    Benedict XVI has ruled the Catholic Church from a much more conservatiive theological view than did Pope John Paul II.  Pope John Paul II was second longest serving pope of all time and was therefore much more influential leader of the Catholic Church. He was also very charismatic and although critized by progressives for his tough stands against modern ideals such as contraception and women clergy..Pope John Paull II was able bridge the gap between Catholics and non-catholics and forge relationships with other faiths.

    Benedict XVI was never going to be as influential as John Paul II and he himself hinted upon his election that he saw his role as Pope as a temporary...interim one.

    It will be interesting the see what kind of leader the next Papal Conclave elects. Will it be someone more conservative , like Benedict? Or will there be a recognition..especially among the younger members..that a leader is needed who will bridge the gap and while working to promote the Catholic Church doctrine..understand that creative ways are necessary that result in more inclusion than exclusion.

    I wish Pope Benedict XVI well. I respect him for recognizing that he his no longer able to carry out the duties of the leader of the Catholic Church. I wish more people in leadership positions would display such humility.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from UserName99. Show UserName99's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    Probably as good a time as any for the Catholic Church to close its doors for good.

    Man made Christianity has abused and defrauded enough people already.  Its time for facts and reality to rule the lands.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to UserName99's comment:

    Probably as good a time as any for the Catholic Church to close its doors for good.

    Man made Christianity has abused and defrauded enough people already.  Its time for facts and reality to rule the lands.




    "Facts and reality" aka atheism's record in the 20th century isnt so appealing. Avowedly atheistic regimes killed 250 million of their own people, never mind the casualties from wars...

     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from UserName99. Show UserName99's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to WhichOnesPink2's comment:

    In response to UserName99's comment:

     

    Probably as good a time as any for the Catholic Church to close its doors for good.

    Man made Christianity has abused and defrauded enough people already.  Its time for facts and reality to rule the lands.

     



    You good with Jewish and Muslim "church's" closing their doors too? Or is it only Catholic Church you don't like?

     

     



    Preferably all. 

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from WhatDoYouWantNow. Show WhatDoYouWantNow's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    "Facts and reality" aka atheism's record in the 20th century isnt so appealing. Avowedly atheistic regimes killed 250 million of their own people, never mind the casualties from wars..


    Quite the mean-spirited fellow, aren't you?

     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from GreginMeffa. Show GreginMeffa's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to UserName99's comment:

    In response to WhichOnesPink2's comment:

     

    In response to UserName99's comment:

     

    Probably as good a time as any for the Catholic Church to close its doors for good.

    Man made Christianity has abused and defrauded enough people already.  Its time for facts and reality to rule the lands.

     



    You good with Jewish and Muslim "church's" closing their doors too? Or is it only Catholic Church you don't like?

     

     

     



     

    Preferably all. 

     




    Nuff said.

     

    Why not outlaw them all.  I mean, what's the problem?

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    "Facts and reality" aka atheism's record in the 20th century isnt so appealing. Avowedly atheistic regimes killed 250 million of their own people, never mind the casualties from wars..



    Quite the mean-spirited fellow, aren't you?

     



    Of your 12,000 posts, probably 6,000 are of the caliber of the above...

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    Gee, just the other day you were condemning him for the actions for some backward 55 bed hospital and accusing him for being all about business. Sure you did not mention his name but you said Catholic Church and who would be more in charge of the catholic church then the Pope? I guess your views change like the New England weather or whoever's personal email you are trying to get.

     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from WhatDoYouWantNow. Show WhatDoYouWantNow's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

     

    By the late Christopher Hitchens

    On March 10, the chief exorcist of the Vatican, the Rev. Gabriele Amorth (who has held this demanding post for 25 years), was quoted as saying that "the Devil is at work inside the Vatican," and that "when one speaks of 'the smoke of Satan' in the holy rooms, it is all true—including these latest stories of violence and pedophilia." This can perhaps be taken as confirmation that something horrible has indeed been going on in the holy precincts, though most inquiries show it to have a perfectly good material explanation.

    Concerning the most recent revelations about the steady complicity of the Vatican in the ongoing—indeed endless—scandal of child rape, a few days later a spokesman for the Holy See made a concession in the guise of a denial. It was clear, said the Rev. Federico Lombardi, that an attempt was being made "to find elements to involve the Holy Father personally in issues of abuse." He stupidly went on to say that "those efforts have failed."

    He was wrong twice. In the first place, nobody has had to strive to find such evidence: It has surfaced, as it was bound to do. In the second place, this extension of the awful scandal to the topmost level of the Roman Catholic Church is a process that has only just begun. Yet it became in a sense inevitable when the College of Cardinals elected, as the vicar of Christ on Earth, the man chiefly responsible for the original cover-up. (One of the sanctified voters in that "election" was Cardinal Bernard Law of Boston, a man who had already found the jurisdiction of Massachusetts a bit too warm for his liking.)

    There are two separate but related matters here: First, the individual responsibility of the pope in one instance of this moral nightmare and, second, his more general and institutional responsibility for the wider lawbreaking and for the shame and disgrace that goes with it. The first story is easily told, and it is not denied by anybody. In 1979, an 11-year-old German boy identified as Wilfried F. was taken on a vacation trip to the mountains by a priest. After that, he was administered alcohol, locked in his bedroom, stripped naked, and forced to suck the pen!s of his confessor. (Why do we limit ourselves to calling this sort of thing "abuse"?) The offending cleric was transferred from Essen to Munich for "therapy" by a decision of then-Archbishop Joseph Ratzinger, and assurances were given that he would no longer have children in his care. But it took no time for Ratzinger's deputy, Vicar General Gerhard Gruber, to return him to "pastoral" work, where he soon enough resumed his career of sexual assault.

    It is, of course, claimed, and it will no doubt later be partially un-claimed, that Ratzinger himself knew nothing of this second outrage. I quote, here, from the Rev. Thomas Doyle, a former employee of the Vatican Embassy in Washington and an early critic of the Catholic Church's sloth in responding to child-rape allegations. "Nonsense," he says. "Pope Benedict is a micromanager. He's the old style. Anything like that would necessarily have been brought to his attention. Tell the vicar general to find a better line. What he's trying to do, obviously, is protect the pope."

    This is common or garden stuff, very familiar to American and Australian and Irish Catholics whose children's rape and torture, and the cover-up of same by the tactic of moving rapists and torturers from parish to parish, has been painstakingly and comprehensively exposed. It's on a level with the recent belated admission by the pope's brother, Monsignor Georg Ratzinger, that while he knew nothing about sexual assault at the choir school he ran between 1964 and 1994, now that he remembers it, he is sorry for his practice of slapping the boys around.

    Very much more serious is the role of Joseph Ratzinger, before the church decided to make him supreme leader, in obstructing justice on a global scale. After his promotion to cardinal, he was put in charge of the so-called "Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith" (formerly known as the Inquisition). In 2001, Pope John Paul II placed this department in charge of the investigation of child rape and torture by Catholic priests. In May of that year, Ratzinger issued a confidential letter to every bishop. In it, he reminded them of the extreme gravity of a certain crime. But that crime was the reporting of the rape and torture. The accusations, intoned Ratzinger, were only treatable within the church's own exclusive jurisdiction. Any sharing of the evidence with legal authorities or the press was utterly forbidden. Charges were to be investigated "in the most secretive way ... restrained by a perpetual silence ... and everyone ... is to observe the strictest secret which is commonly regarded as a secret of the Holy Office … under the penalty of excommunication." (My italics). Nobody has yet been excommunicated for the rape and torture of children, but exposing the offense could get you into serious trouble. And this is the church that warns us against moral relativism! (See, for more on this appalling document, two reports in the London Observer of April 24, 2005, by Jamie Doward.)

    Not content with shielding its own priests from the law, Ratzinger's office even wrote its own private statute of limitations. The church's jurisdiction, claimed Ratzinger, "begins to run from the day when the minor has completed the 18th year of age" and then lasts for 10 more years. Daniel Shea, the attorney for two victims who sued Ratzinger and a church in Texas, correctly describes that latter stipulation as an obstruction of justice. "You can't investigate a case if you never find out about it. If you can manage to keep it secret for 18 years plus 10, the priest will get away with it."

    The next item on this grisly docket will be the revival of the long-standing allegations against the Rev. Marcial Maciel, founder of the ultra-reactionary Legion of Christ, in which sexual assault seems to have been almost part of the liturgy. Senior ex-members of this secretive order found their complaints ignored and overridden by Ratzinger during the 1990s, if only because Father Maciel had been praised by the then-Pope John Paul II as an "efficacious guide to youth." And now behold the harvest of this long campaign of obfuscation. The Roman Catholic Church is headed by a mediocre Bavarian bureaucrat once tasked with the concealment of the foulest iniquity, whose ineptitude in that job now shows him to us as a man personally and professionally responsible for enabling a filthy wave of crime. Ratzinger himself may be banal, but his whole career has the stench of evil—a clinging and systematic evil that is beyond the power of exorcism to dispel. What is needed is not medieval incantation but the application of justice—and speedily at that.

     

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2010/03/the_great_catholic_coverup.html

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to airborne-rgr's comment:

    In response to jackbu's comment:

     

    Gee, just the other day you were condemning him for the actions for some backward 55 bed hospital and accusing him for being all about business. Sure you did not mention his name but you said Catholic Church and who would be more in charge of the catholic church then the Pope? I guess your views change like the New England weather or whoever's personal email you are trying to get.

     




    To whom is your post directed?

     




    The OP, sorry

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from yogafriend. Show yogafriend's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to airborne-rgr's comment:

    What would make a pope resign?

    Doesn't like the hours? Has to work on Sundays.

    Too many voices in his head? God calls at all hours of the night.



    Sounds like an emergency room physician and the Pope have lots in common.  :)

    Additionally, he was plagued by the sexual abuse scandal -- speaking of the "voices in his head" -- it's a bummer to have to clean up a mess that others have caused.   However, you never heard Pope Benedict say that it was Pope John Paul's fault.  

    Incidentally, there are well over 400 posts (and growing) on BDC re: the Pope's intended resignation, and it looks as though 50% of them have been removed.  

    While a mere fraction in number, this thread is doing quite well -- although the day is young.  :)   

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    "Facts and reality" aka atheism's record in the 20th century isnt so appealing. Avowedly atheistic regimes killed 250 million of their own people, never mind the casualties from wars..



    Quite the mean-spirited fellow, aren't you?

     



    What is mean-spirited abot pointing out the inherent evil in athiestic regimes as they manifested themselves in the 20th century?

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackbu. Show jackbu's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to yogafriend's comment:

    In response to airborne-rgr's comment:

     

    What would make a pope resign?

    Doesn't like the hours? Has to work on Sundays.

    Too many voices in his head? God calls at all hours of the night.

     



     

    Sounds like an emergency room physician and the Pope have lots in common.  :)

    Additionally, he was plagued by the sexual abuse scandal -- speaking of the "voices in his head" -- it's a bummer to have to clean up a mess that others have caused.   However, you never heard Pope Benedict say that it was Pope John Paul's fault.  

    Incidentally, there are well over 400 posts (and growing) on BDC re: the Pope's intended resignation, and it looks as though 50% of them have been removed.  

    While a mere fraction in number, this thread is doing quite well -- although the day is young.  :)   




    I was trying to expalin to the poster miscricket the other day that the catholic church cannot control what doctors do in delivery room, but she seemed bent on the idea that the catholic church was responsible, even thought their policy is to save the child first when a problem arises.

    There were many who thought this Pope would resign and not make the mistake of getting to ill before he could make the decision.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from WhatDoYouWantNow. Show WhatDoYouWantNow's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to yogafriend's comment:

    plagued by the sexual abuse scandal


     I daresay he bears a large degree of responsibility for it if even a tenth of what Hitchens alleges is true.


    He paints a piture of Ratzinger as an evil man who proteted child rapists on an individual level (moving priests around) and structurally (secretive internal investigations, urging policy of not sharing info with police, etc).


    Agree or disagree with the man generally, but the sense I got from his writing and his life is that he was very conscientious about his positions and wouldn't fudge to make a point. He'll also do a 180 on prior positions or ideologies if he concluded he was mistaken in the past (ie, despite starting out as an avowed new communist early on, then turning hard away from the left generally in the lead up to, and aftermath of, the Iraq invasion).

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    I woke up to the somewhat surprising news that Pope Benedict, the head of the Catholic Church for just under 8 years..is resigining effective February 28th.  Surprising news primarily because he is stepping down during Lent.

    I remember following the last papal conclave with my son and being quite surprised at the brevity of a process that has been known to go for many days in  modern times...many months in ancient times. Benedict ( Joseph Ratzinger) was elected after only four ballots.

    Benedict XVI has ruled the Catholic Church from a much more conservatiive theological view than did Pope John Paul II.  Pope John Paul II was second longest serving pope of all time and was therefore much more influential leader of the Catholic Church. He was also very charismatic and although critized by progressives for his tough stands against modern ideals such as contraception and women clergy..Pope John Paull II was able bridge the gap between Catholics and non-catholics and forge relationships with other faiths.

    Benedict XVI was never going to be as influential as John Paul II and he himself hinted upon his election that he saw his role as Pope as a temporary...interim one.

    It will be interesting the see what kind of leader the next Papal Conclave elects. Will it be someone more conservative , like Benedict? Or will there be a recognition..especially among the younger members..that a leader is needed who will bridge the gap and while working to promote the Catholic Church doctrine..understand that creative ways are necessary that result in more inclusion than exclusion.

    I wish Pope Benedict XVI well. I respect him for recognizing that he his no longer able to carry out the duties of the leader of the Catholic Church. I wish more people in leadership positions would display such humility.



    Good question.  Who will they install as pope?

    I bet you are hoping for an inexperienced athiestic woman who is a member of the cherokee nation, who shakes her fist at God while saying "you didn't build that".

    How close am I?

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Pope Benedict XVI to resign..!

    In response to jackbu's comment:

     

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

     

    In response to jackbu's comment:

     

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

     

    In response to jackbu's comment:

     

    Gee, just the other day you were condemning him for the actions for some backward 55 bed hospital and accusing him for being all about business. Sure you did not mention his name but you said Catholic Church and who would be more in charge of the catholic church then the Pope? I guess your views change like the New England weather or whoever's personal email you are trying to get.

     




     

    Miscricket and msobstinate are right. You have a comprehension problem. Give it up pal. Your making a fool out of yourself.

     




     

    amazing, first time I have posted since thursday and poof, there you are.

     




    Don't flatter yourself. You are one strange  and passive agressive dude. A few of us are still waitin for you to post that tuition proof.

     

     




     

    I have not revisited that thread, but usually when someone wants to disprove another's statement, it is up to that person to post such info. Or did not your mommy tell you this.  I told you my data was solid for Boston area schools. I guess your reading comprehension needs work because I told you I wasn't privy to schools outside the Boston diocese and your school seems to fall outside. Boston was flooded with catholic schools in those days, one reason why tuituon was low.  I am sure a wealthy community likes yours did not have catholic schools on every corner and public education was fine. Thus a reason why your catholic school was higher in price.

    You seem to have the luxury of being on the computer all day.  Take care.  I hope your mommy makes you a nice dinner.

     




    Bupkus you have not revisited that thread. You got owned and like a typical passive agressinve loser you ran away with your tail between your legs . I have dinner with my mum several times a week and she is quite the cook. Again, sounds like you have mommy issues.


    And now I'm going to take the advice miscrickit gave me the other day and put you on ignore.