The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own "plan B" bill.

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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    "In a stinging setback for Republican House Speaker John Boehner, a lack of support from inside his own party for his fall-back plan forced him late Thursday to cancel a much-trumpeted vote on the measure."

    http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/house-republicans-pushing-doomed-fiscal-cliff-plan-b-004700686--politics.html

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

     Not for nothing but from a rep standpoint this move doesn't surprise me at all.

     Remember, there has been no change since last election. Same pres, same senate, same house. Why would anyone think that they could agree on a budget now when they couldn't before?

     

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    In response to undead's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     Not for nothing but from a rep standpoint this move doesn't surprise me at all.

     Remember, there has been no change since last election. Same pres, same senate, same house. Why would anyone think that they could agree on a budget now when they couldn't before?

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Just a thought: patriotism.  We are a nation built on the idea of compromise.  It started with the Constitutional Convention and continued until quite recently.  Extremism will kill this country.  Only mindless ideological zealots would expose the country to an economic crash so as to protect a small tax increase on millionaires. But that is what we have...

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

     I don't see why the Democrats should yield to any of the GOP's demands. If no bill gets passed, the Bush tax cuts will expire and the military gets trimmed downed. Social Security and Medicaid are spared from the budget sequestration, so are veteran benefits and federal pensions.

    The only risk is that of the recession. The CBO says there is a chance that the budget cuts could cause a mild recession in early 2013. Solution: Senate Dems open the new year by introducing a tax cut for everyone who makes under $250,000. Kick it to the House and watch Boehner squirm as tries to block a tax cut without appearing to do so.

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    Speaker Boehner tried to make it happen. He was done in by the entrenched 2010 Freshmen Tea Party congressmen.  A number of them were broomed out in 2012, look for more in 2014.  These entrenched idiots think they are in charge because they can prevent conservative leaning ideas from passing, that aren't pure enough.  These guys will have no say in the solutions that will end up being Dem ideas moderated a little by Boehner to win approval.

    These ideologue zealots hurt conservatism action over some bogus purity test.  These are the same idiots who I listened to on Howie Carr yesterday who were PO'd with Brown and won't support him anymore.   One nut case said he didn't cast a vote for Senate last month because Brown wasn't a real conservative, so this idiot's non-vote gave further traction to Warren.  Talk about biting ones nose to spite their face.

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    In response to WhichOnesPink2's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    So it's ok if Dems play politics.....gotcha....

    [/QUOTE]

    Playing politics?  Seriously?  I guess to avoid that accusation the Democrats should just become Republicans and accept the plan without complaint.

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    In response to jmel's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Speaker Boehner tried to make it happen. He was done in by the entrenched 2010 Freshmen Tea Party congressmen.  A number of them were broomed out in 2012, look for more in 2014.  These entrenched idiots think they are in charge because they can prevent conservative leaning ideas from passing, that aren't pure enough.  These guys will have no say in the solutions that will end up being Dem ideas moderated a little by Boehner to win approval.

    These ideologue zealots hurt conservatism action over some bogus purity test.  These are the same idiots who I listened to on Howie Carr yesterday who were PO'd with Brown and won't support him anymore.   One nut case said he didn't cast a vote for Senate last month because Brown wasn't a real conservative, so this idiot's non-vote gave further traction to Warren.  Talk about biting ones nose to spite their face.

    [/QUOTE]


    Agreed.  We know that taxing people making over $250k will only raise $65 billion per year. We also know that our DEBT is $9 billion per day, so this tax increase pays our debt for approximately 1 week.  This entire debacle is a show for the uninformed, morons that voted for the incompetent.  It does NOTHING to help the deficit/debt problem.  It is literally like "spitting in the ocean". 

    Also, the "$250k is rich" thing is deeply disturbing.  I know many people at that income level (me included) and it took 25 years to get there.  It`s not rich.....period.  An increase to appease the incompetent supporters, a symbolic gesture, should have been unanimously agreed to at $1,000,000 and up incomes, by ALL in the House.  R-congressman that did not support Plan-B need to explain themselves. The incompetent and his useless underlings campaigned on "millionaires and billionaires", Boehner gives Plan-B, a tax increase on true "millionaires", and the House doesn`t have the votes???  A Y K M?  This could have been stuck in the incompetent`s face. 

    Tax increases will NEVER address the debt and deficit.  Spending must be cut. 

    [/QUOTE]

    The vast majority of the country wants a balanced approach to the deficit.  The vast majority want a compromise.  

    Further, the government is split so you have to have a compromise to get this thing done.

    And it is just plain stupid to say that tax increases wont decrease the deficit.  Go back to school and bone up on subtraction exercises.  

    Now that is "incompetent".

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    In response to jmel's comment:
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    In response to Reubenhop's comment:
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    In response to jmel's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Speaker Boehner tried to make it happen. He was done in by the entrenched 2010 Freshmen Tea Party congressmen.  A number of them were broomed out in 2012, look for more in 2014.  These entrenched idiots think they are in charge because they can prevent conservative leaning ideas from passing, that aren't pure enough.  These guys will have no say in the solutions that will end up being Dem ideas moderated a little by Boehner to win approval.

    These ideologue zealots hurt conservatism action over some bogus purity test.  These are the same idiots who I listened to on Howie Carr yesterday who were PO'd with Brown and won't support him anymore.   One nut case said he didn't cast a vote for Senate last month because Brown wasn't a real conservative, so this idiot's non-vote gave further traction to Warren.  Talk about biting ones nose to spite their face.

    [/QUOTE]


    Agreed.  We know that taxing people making over $250k will only raise $65 billion per year. We also know that our DEBT is $9 billion per day, so this tax increase pays our debt for approximately 1 week.  This entire debacle is a show for the uninformed, morons that voted for the incompetent.  It does NOTHING to help the deficit/debt problem.  It is literally like "spitting in the ocean". 

    Also, the "$250k is rich" thing is deeply disturbing.  I know many people at that income level (me included) and it took 25 years to get there.  It`s not rich.....period.  An increase to appease the incompetent supporters, a symbolic gesture, should have been unanimously agreed to at $1,000,000 and up incomes, by ALL in the House.  R-congressman that did not support Plan-B need to explain themselves. The incompetent and his useless underlings campaigned on "millionaires and billionaires", Boehner gives Plan-B, a tax increase on true "millionaires", and the House doesn`t have the votes???  A Y K M?  This could have been stuck in the incompetent`s face. 

    Tax increases will NEVER address the debt and deficit.  Spending must be cut. 

    [/QUOTE]

    The vast majority of the country wants a balanced approach to the deficit.  The vast majority want a compromise.  

    Further, the government is split so you have to have a compromise to get this thing done.

    And it is just plain stupid to say that tax increases wont decrease the deficit.  Go back to school and bone up on subtraction exercises.  

    Now that is "incompetent".

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree with your thoughts on compromise.  The incompetent should try it. 

    Perhaps you are the one that needs to go back to school and "bone up"?  Might I suggest you start with Mathematics.  I was wrong about $65 billion being raised through tax increases.  It is actually only $58 billion.  We go $9 billion more in debt every day.  That`s DEBT!  It`s not money we spend every day, it`s money we owe every day.  A tax increase will pay 9 days of DEBT per year, that`s it!  What happens the other 356 days?

    I also agree that a "vast majority of Americans want a balanced approach".  Unfortunately, the vast majority (51%) that voted for an incompetent fool, are like you and need to go back to Math class.  They believed the "millionaires-billionaires" bullsh!t.  Why wouldn`t the misinformed, uneducated, incompetent supporters, vote for higher taxes?  They don`t freakin pay them. What the heck do they care?  They just want more EBT, more food stamps, and more Obama-phones.

    Tax increases will not reduce this debt.  There has to be large spending cuts. 

    [/QUOTE]

    You are making a pretty good argument that we need even more revenue to address the deficit.  Thanks much.  

    And you (like far too many conservatives) don't like democracy much.  Maybe people are not as stupid as you think.  Maybe the conservatives should get better ideas next time, ideas that benefit more than a minority of the population.  You are not nearly as smart as you think, that is what ideology does to you.

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Speaker Boehner tried to make it happen. He was done in by the entrenched 2010 Freshmen Tea Party congressmen.  A number of them were broomed out in 2012, look for more in 2014.  These entrenched idiots think they are in charge because they can prevent conservative leaning ideas from passing, that aren't pure enough.  These guys will have no say in the solutions that will end up being Dem ideas moderated a little by Boehner to win approval.

    These ideologue zealots hurt conservatism action over some bogus purity test.  These are the same idiots who I listened to on Howie Carr yesterday who were PO'd with Brown and won't support him anymore.   One nut case said he didn't cast a vote for Senate last month because Brown wasn't a real conservative, so this idiot's non-vote gave further traction to Warren.  Talk about biting ones nose to spite their face.

    [/QUOTE]


    I appreciate that you have this view.

    Not to be childish....but...   that is rather what "we" were predicting of them in 2010. It may have felt good for voters to "take a stand" by voting for rigid idealogues, people you could believe really wouldn't compromise. But that's exactly what voters got.

    Of course some of them are being downright childish and opposing the plan because big mean Boehner kicked their extremist @sses off committees.

     

     

    “The speaker should be meeting with us to get our views on things rather than just presenting his,” said Representative Justin Amash of Michigan, who recently lost a committee post for routinely crossing the leadership.

    Cry me a river, Justin. But don't send me the bill.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I agree, you do see the parallells to an empowered Dem congress under Pelosi that pushed through ACA instead of building a coalitioned bi-partisan plan, don't you.

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

     

    [/QUOTE]


    You are making a pretty good argument that we need even more revenue to address the deficit.  Thanks much.  

    And you (like far too many conservatives) don't like democracy much.  Maybe people are not as stupid as you think.  Maybe the conservatives should get better ideas next time, ideas that benefit more than a minority of the population.  You are not nearly as smart as you think, that is what ideology does to you.

    [/QUOTE]

    But....but....but....you`re a real smart guy (eye roll).  How about addressing the numbers?  Or, will you keep slinging back-handed insults?  I guess you have some other information, maybe some fuzzy math that explains how $58 billion in tax increase reciepts can bring down $1.04 TRILLION in debt per year?  Have you seen the incompetent`s plan?  MORE SPENDING!!!  People ARE as stupid as I think.........51% of them.

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes, I am a smart guy and frankly smarter than you in this regard: I know BOTH sides have a point on the matter and they need to compromise for the good of the country.  You are stuck with ideological blinders on from seeing this reality.  

     

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    In response to 12-Angry-Men's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The President's counter-proposal include:

    • $1.2 trillion in new income tax revenuewith a 39.6 percent (up from 35 percent) on income of $400,000 or more.
    • $1.2 trillion in spending cutsdivided this way: $800 billion in cuts; $290 billion in interest savings due to lower deficits; $130 billion in cost-of-living adjustments - - with specific protections to preserve increases for economically disadvantaged beneficiaries. Because changing cost-of-living adjustments would also affect where people fell in various tax brackets, this move would raise $90 billion
    • The $800 billion in cuts would come from $400 billion in savings to health care entitlements like Medicare and Medicaid; $200 billion in better tax revenue collection, increased financial transaction fees and reduced federal employee benefits.
    • $200 billion in domestic discretionary -- annual spending on basic government functions - divided equally between defense and non-defense programs.
    • At least $50 billion devoted next year to infrastructure spending and more in latter years - figures still subject to negotiation.
    • A one-year extension of unemployment insurance benefits.

    [/QUOTE]

    The President is not proposing to cut spending. He’s only proposing to reduce future spending growth . In other words, his “spending cut” is only a cut if you play the dishonest DC game of measuring “cuts” against a baseline of ever-expanding government.

    Same as the phony numbers on Obamacare. Raise taxes immediately, then in year 9 of a mythical 10 year budget you supposedly trim a tiny bit of the massive expansion...

    If a private sector accountant tried to fudge numbers like that he or she would be arrested.


    For another laugh, get this: "$200 billion in better tax revenue collection"....

    He has been in office 4 years, why didnt he get "better" collection already? Sounds like an excuse to hire tens of thousands of new IRS agents to harass citizens.

    And $50 billion in stimulus...worked great in 2009 and '10, huh? Guess his crooked unions ordered him to hand over more public boodle...

     
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    Re: The wingnuts fail... again. They can't even pass their own

    All you need to know is that the burden of government spending will climb by about $2 trillion over the next 10 years without Obama’s budget plan.

    But if we enact Obama’s plan, the burden of spending will climb by…drum roll please…about $2 trillion over the next 10 years. In other words, it’s not much more than a rounding error.

    P.S. Don’t forget that revenues also are projected to rise dramatically over the next 10 years, even if the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts are made permanent. All that’s actually needed to balance the budget is modest spending restraint, restraining outlays so they grow by an average of 2.5 percent.

    Of course restraint in government spending will never happen, with the Party of Government in power.

     

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