Alternate Reality

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from OatesCam. Show OatesCam's posts

    Alternate Reality

    I'm sure most of us have, at some point, wondered what last year would have been like if a bounce had gone another way, Horton didn't score the game 7 OT winner and the Bruins lost to the Habs in round 1 last year. We are now, to some extent, living that alternate reality.

    There are those saying that they knew all along the Bruins weren't good enough. They needed to get this player or that player. They are missing some element or that Washington was better because of some other quality that Boston lacked.

    Truth is round 1 was almost identical to last year when the Bruins won the cup. The Capitals played identical to the Canadiens, the team that gave Boston the most trouble last year. The Bruins play a style that capitalizes on enemy mistakes. Both the Habs and Caps played a style that didn't try to win, but rather not to lose. In both cases the result was low-chance, close, flip-the-coin for a winner hockey. Last year the Bruins got the win and went on to beat 3 better teams than the habs on the way to the cup. This year, it went the other way.

    Boston didn't lose because they weren't big enough, talented enough or hungry enough. They didn't lose because they were missing Ryder or Recchi. Tim Thomas wasn't missing the magic he had last year. This year's team was arguably more talented than last year's. But last year the team was 100% healthy and got the bounces. This year Horton was out and Bergeron was limited and the bounces went the way of the Captials. If Horton didn't play and score that game 7 winner last year, I dare say the Bruins might have been out 1st round. The result probably would have looked a lot like what we saw this year.

    The Bruins are a contender. They were last year, this year, and most likely will be again next year. You need some health and good fortune. They got it last year, didn't have it this year. Hope they have it next year. Anyone saying they could see all along that the Bruins were missing something is full of it. With one good bounce in any of 4 games against the Caps Boston would still be playing and no one would be saying anything. If Horton and/or Bergeron were 100% round one may have been won before game 7 even happened. I think it quite likely that Boston would have had an easier time with a team like the more talented Flyers, but we'll never know, just as we'll never know what would have happened last year had Horton been out and the Bruins lost. I'm just glad the Bruins won in '11 so that I could enjoy it, and so that misfortune didn't cost Julien his job and bring in radical changes even worse than some being kicked around here these days. I do find it amazing that people are saying that a team that won the cup is not good enough to win the cup. But c'est la vie.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from scooter244. Show scooter244's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    I said a few times last year that the team was a year away from winning, thinking that it needed a little more time for the younger guys to develop and guys like Horton to mesh.   In this alternate reality they did win, and I think they regressed a little this year, and partially because they won.   They didn't have the same energy they did last year, and if they did it was only in spurts.  That I blame soley one the success of last year.  Had they not won the cup in '11 I think they would have beat the Caps handily. 
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucicfan. Show lucicfan's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    Good post Oates, The only thing I would add is when they went on that crazy stretch I thought it will be hard to find a team that could beat them in a 7 game series. I will give credit to the Caps though, Im mean some people think the Bruins lost because they played bad but maybe the Caps just played good and snuffed out the Bruins offence by limiting the quality scoring chances.

    Cheers man!! I wasnt even upset (more dissapointed), Im still high from last year. that was one heck of a run and look forward to it again.

    The only thing that bothers me is I look @ the teams left and think had they beat the Caps they would have had a good chance to repeat or atleast make the final.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    This is why I think that the Bruins just need to develop their forward prospects and Krug/Hamilton instead of plugging in few players from a very thin UFA veteran market. If Boston's young wipper snappers falter as the season goes into November then PC can make a few trades as bookboy mentioned on another thread.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucicfan. Show lucicfan's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    exactly, SanDog

    even give some of the younger forwards a shot. 2 players Im interested in seeing are Knight and Koko (sorry NAS) that will always be his name to me.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from nrguy. Show nrguy's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    I for one would have been more PO'd if I was a Vancouver fan. Lose in the cup final, win the President's trophy, and then getting bounced by the LA Kings is much worse than winning a cup, getting key players hurt and losing in OT to the Caps.

    Without Bergeron, they wouldn't have won the cup. Given that, I'd rather the players get some rest for the run next year. You need a healthy Bergeron and Horton out there.

    Next year, there are no excuses and I will be disappointed if they don't get out of the first round next year. 

    Was listening to local sports radio over the weekend and wanted to put my fist through the radio. The talk was about how they are disappointed with the first round exit and expected the team to make the conference finals. Making the conference finals and not winning the cup is like winning the Presidents trophy, it means NOTHING. Also, talking about how they need a top winger and someone who can put the puck in the net - Hello!! Horton was injured.

    I know the impulse is a first round exit should cause some major changes but it fails to recognize that this core just won the cup.

    Fire the PP coach, put Seguin at the point with Chara, get healthy, and tell Lucic that he should dump it deep or hold onto it when he doesn't see a guy to pass it to. Lucic passing the puck into space time after time was a major factor in losing to the Caps.  
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:[QUOTE]exactly, SanDog even give some of the younger forwards a shot. 2 players Im interested in seeing are Knight and Koko (sorry NAS) that will always be his name to me. Posted by lucicfan[/QUOTE]

    That is what nicknames are for not having to remember some long European last name.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucicfan. Show lucicfan's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Alternate Reality : That is what nicknames are for not having to remember some long European last name.
    Posted by SanDogBrewin[/QUOTE]

    I dont mind when people call players by nicknames it not an issue to me.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49-North. Show 49-North's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:
    [QUOTE]I for one would have been more PO'd if I was a Vancouver fan. Lose in the cup final, win the President's trophy, and then getting bounced by the LA Kings is much worse than winning a cup, getting key players hurt and losing in OT to the Caps. Without Bergeron, they wouldn't have won the cup. Given that, I'd rather the players get some rest for the run next year. You need a healthy Bergeron and Horton out there. Next year, there are no excuses and I will be disappointed if they don't get out of the first round next year.  Was listening to local sports radio over the weekend and wanted to put my fist through the radio. The talk was about how they are disappointed with the first round exit and expected the team to make the conference finals. Making the conference finals and not winning the cup is like winning the Presidents trophy, it means NOTHING. Also, talking about how they need a top winger and someone who can put the puck in the net - Hello!! Horton was injured. I know the impulse is a first round exit should cause some major changes but it fails to recognize that this core just won the cup. Fire the PP coach, put Seguin at the point with Chara, get healthy, and tell Lucic that he should dump it deep or hold onto it when he doesn't see a guy to pass it to. Lucic passing the puck into space time after time was a major factor in losing to the Caps.  
    Posted by nrguy[/QUOTE]

    For me, what last season and this season point out is this: how difficult it is to get to the Cup Final and win it.  At the risk of repeating posts I've made on other threads, everything has to go right, at just the right time, for a team, any team to win the Cup.  That's why it's so tough.  It's breaks, bounces, injuries (or lack thereof), a big save here, an opponent's goalie whiffing on a soft shot there -- add up all those things, and you have a Cup.  If even one of those things goes the other way, that may be enough to deny you. 

    As the defending champs, the Bruins were considered one of the favourites to come out of the east.  As defending west reps, and #1 in the regular season, the Canucks were considered the same.  Both teams are out.  Bounces, injuries, goalies, and it's "woulda, coulda, shoulda".
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from nrguy. Show nrguy's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Alternate Reality : For me, what last season and this season point out is this: how difficult it is to get to the Cup Final and win it.  At the risk of repeating posts I've made on other threads, everything has to go right, at just the right time, for a team, any team to win the Cup.  That's why it's so tough.  It's breaks, bounces, injuries (or lack thereof), a big save here, an opponent's goalie whiffing on a soft shot there -- add up all those things, and you have a Cup.  If even one of those things goes the other way, that may be enough to deny you.  As the defending champs, the Bruins were considered one of the favourites to come out of the east.  As defending west reps, and #1 in the regular season, the Canucks were considered the same.  Both teams are out.  Bounces, injuries, goalies, and it's "woulda, coulda, shoulda".
    Posted by 49-North[/QUOTE]

    Right, more of a "it could be worse, we could have lost last year and had the same kind of cup hangover"

    My point is, if you don't win the cup, a prolonged playoff run is more detrimental to the team for the next year. Playoff experience is great, but if you already have it, I'd say that a long playoff run is good every other year and an early exit isn't all that bad. 

    Maybe I'm over rationalizing getting bounced in the first round. Cup win in 11 still clouds my thinking.  

    I could be
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from scooter244. Show scooter244's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Alternate Reality : For me, what last season and this season point out is this: how difficult it is to get to the Cup Final and win it.  At the risk of repeating posts I've made on other threads, everything has to go right, at just the right time, for a team, any team to win the Cup.  That's why it's so tough.  It's breaks, bounces, injuries (or lack thereof), a big save here, an opponent's goalie whiffing on a soft shot there -- add up all those things, and you have a Cup.  If even one of those things goes the other way, that may be enough to deny you.  As the defending champs, the Bruins were considered one of the favourites to come out of the east.  As defending west reps, and #1 in the regular season, the Canucks were considered the same.  Both teams are out.  Bounces, injuries, goalies, and it's "woulda, coulda, shoulda".
    Posted by 49-North[/QUOTE]

    Yes the breaks bounces and injuries are huge factors, but it is not all up to the Hockey Gods.  What teams need to do is put themselves in the best position to eliminate as many of those factors as they can.  For example depth can overcome injuries.  A bad bounce may be either a glitch or devastation.  Columbus was not going to win the Stanley Cup no matter what freakish things transpired.  They simply are in no position to win.  Both Boston and Vancouver had legitimate reasons for their inability to overcome the curves thrown at them.  Boston couldn't get past Hornton's injury, and the lack of energy.  The real puzzler is Pittsburgh.  Seemed to have it all heading in.  Their bugaboo was their first round match-up.  They couldn't overcome that.   Strange. 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    Good post Oates.  I agree.  And as 49 mentions above, it underscores how hard it really is to get far in the playoffs.  Heck, it's brutally hard to get through the first round.  Things have to go your way.

    That I why I believe that a GM's is just to get you there and give you a shot.  Preferably without mortgaging the future.  That is the foolishness of some posters here -- to look back in hindsight and say 'they didn't replace Ryder' or 'they needed another scorer'.  Every team is flawed, but sometimes if things fall your way, players stay healthy, and everyone executes, you can win in the playoffs.

    Good on Chia for getting them there, year after year, and taking a shot.  And the future looks bright too.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Alternate Reality : Yes the breaks bounces and injuries are huge factors, but it is not all up to the Hockey Gods.  What teams need to do is put themselves in the best position to eliminate as many of those factors as they can.  For example depth can overcome injuries.  A bad bounce may be either a glitch or devastation.  Columbus was not going to win the Stanley Cup no matter what freakish things transpired.  They simply are in no position to win.  Both Boston and Vancouver had legitimate reasons for their inability to overcome the curves thrown at them.  Boston couldn't get past Hornton's injury, and the lack of energy.  The real puzzler is Pittsburgh.  Seemed to have it all heading in.  Their bugaboo was their first round match-up.  They couldn't overcome that.   Strange. 
    Posted by scooter244[/QUOTE]
    Marc-Andre Fleury let them down BIG time,he was pathetic.When you don't have goaltending,you don't have a chance.Because of this fact i don't see Philly winning it all either.
     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bogie6. Show bogie6's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    good thoughts, and praise for a good group of players. I also think that Chiarelli isconsidering minor changes. Today's report indicates he may very well stay with timmy, and use his extra cash to sign Rask and Kelly first. Then he can look at other needs. If Hamilton and Krug display solid capabilities in training camp, Then the defense of Chara, Seids, Boychuck, Ference, Mc Quaid is fairly solid. With Horton back, Kreji's line OK; Bergie's line OK; might consider trading Marchand for a bigger alternative with same skills, if he's available] Sign Kelly, and add in Peverly and Pouliot; Then only the 4th line needs to be re-shuffled by adding Caron, Hendrickson around a re-signed Campbell. Still do not see how Thornton can earn a spot. He just doesn't have the necessary skills. One of Chiarelli's in frequent mistakes.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from OatesCam. Show OatesCam's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    You like to bash Thornton, but the truth is, he does have the skills. He's played his role fine. He did a great job in last year's run, and I thought he was good this year too. In game 5 he was the catalyst for the Bruins tying it up before they eventually lost. He came out, threw the body, mouthed off and got tempers going. That fired up the Bruins and got the Caps to break out of the non-engaging style for a moment... and the next shift the Bruins scored, and scored again. He should have been in for game 7.

    Some have tried to say that the Caps 4th line was better. It wasn't. Perreault: no points, -1.  Aucoin: 1A, -2.  Knuble and Ward came through pretty good, but they aren't in the Thornton role, they are more like Campbell or Rolston. And I don't think anyone would want to pay someone Ward's 3 million to sit on the 4th line.

    The Bruins could have used another skilled player to boost the offence and bump Peverley down to the third line. They have that in Horton, he was just injured. That's how it goes. A better 12th forward will hardly make a difference. I also don't know how making Marchand taller would make him better. He's skilled, wins most puck battles, annoys opponents. I don't know of anyone in the league that does those things better because they have an easier time changing light bulbs or reaching cookies on the top shelf.

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:
    [QUOTE]good thoughts, and praise for a good group of players. I also think that Chiarelli isconsidering minor changes. Today's report indicates he may very well stay with timmy, and use his extra cash to sign Rask and Kelly first. Then he can look at other needs. If Hamilton and Krug display solid capabilities in training camp, Then the defense of Chara, Seids, Boychuck, Ference, Mc Quaid is fairly solid. With Horton back, Kreji's line OK; Bergie's line OK; might consider trading Marchand for a bigger alternative with same skills, if he's available] Sign Kelly, and add in Peverly and Pouliot; Then only the 4th line needs to be re-shuffled by adding Caron, Hendrickson around a re-signed Campbell. Still do not see how Thornton can earn a spot. He just doesn't have the necessary skills. One of Chiarelli's in frequent mistakes.
    Posted by bogie6[/QUOTE]
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from stevegm. Show stevegm's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality


    A lot of us have been posting on that razor thin line between winning and losing.  Oates summed that up well.  
    The thing I keep thinkin is if the B's went down in round 1 last year(miricle they didn't) God knows what kind of team we would've opened this year with.  PC may have been gone.  CJ pretty much for certain, and there could have been a major player housecleaning.
    Although fans are generally frenzied alarmists, team owners tend to be too after a couple years of unfulfilled promise.
    I think this team, basically the whole organization as we know it, came within 1 overtime goal of being blown up.  If not, the axe would have certainly came down after this first round loss.
    Kind of interesting to look at in hindsight.  Trying to imagine exactly how much history was changed, by that 1 overtime goal.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Alternate Reality

    In Response to Re: Alternate Reality:
    [QUOTE]A lot of us have been posting on that razor thin line between winning and losing.  Oates summed that up well.   The thing I keep thinkin is if the B's went down in round 1 last year(miricle they didn't) God knows what kind of team we would've opened this year with.  PC may have been gone.  CJ pretty much for certain, and there could have been a major player housecleaning. Although fans are generally frenzied alarmists, team owners tend to be too after a couple years of unfulfilled promise. I think this team, basically the whole organization as we know it, came within 1 overtime goal of being blown up.  If not, the axe would have certainly came down after this first round loss. Kind of interesting to look at in hindsight.  Trying to imagine exactly how much history was changed, by that 1 overtime goal.
    Posted by stevegm[/QUOTE]
    Steve, most fans were ready to blow it up after going down 0-2 in round 1 to the Habs. As you guys stated, the line between winning and golfing is razor thin. There's definitely no need for major changes.
     

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