Spooner

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Spooner

    The kid has 20+ games under his belt and has showed great improvements in faceoffs ( yes Red, faceoffs were a weakness whether you want to believe it or not ) and his defensive awareness.

    I like the creativity he brings to that third line better then the other vanilla options.

    The thoughts about "he needs to score" ? He is a pass first type of player. Scoring a goal is secondary for him to be playing good compared to creating offense for his wingers with his skating and passing. That argument doesn't have any any bearing on whether he stays or goes.

    Let him develop at the big league level would be the choice I hope the Bruins take. He's very green and can only get better. 




     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to marco0863's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    His whole nhl career- yes a real veteran in this league.  He had limited Ice time the cup year and had a great game vs tampa bay

    Now I'm not even going to search this but he was what 19or 20 vs wash remember when we lost and goals were hard to come by from every player.  

    [/QUOTE]

    Seguin - 42 playoff games - 6 goals, 12 assists.

    Other players from Seguin's draft year.  So they are the same age.

    Is it reasonable to expect that Seguin does better than them since he was drafted higher?

    So how have these other players done in the playoffs?

    Cam Fowler - 13 playoff games 1 goal 6 assists in the playoffs - close to half the pts Seguin has with 1/3 fewer games.

    Charlie Coyle - 5 playoff games - 2 assists.  If he had nearly 40 playoff games that project out to 16 assists.  Very close to Seguin.

    Emerson Etem - 7 playoff games - 3 goals 2 assists.  Substantially better than Seguin.

    Tyler Toffoli - 12 games, 2 goals 4 assists - 12 points.  That's a scoring pace better than Seguin.

    Brendan Gallagher - 5 playoff games - 2 goals. 1/3 as many goals as Seguin in only 1/8 as many games.

     

    That's about every player I could find from Seguin's draft year who has had playoff experience.  And they all are fairly much producing better than Seguin in the playoffs.

    So they are young players, too.

    And Seguin was drafted higher, so shouldn't he be better?

    Please explain.

     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    Once again I need to understand you're saying that seg should hsve been traded because of his dismal playoff performance based mainly on last year? He's got way to much talent and is far too young to expect him to make a playoff pattern of  mediocrity




    This is exactly why I'm putting you back on ignore.

    I've been spending the last 6 months saying his playoffs have not been good his entire career as brief as it is and not just last year.

    And I've just pointed out 5 players - about the only other 5 players from his draft year - who are not better than him, but have done better in the playoffs.

    Those players are just as young as Seguin, so what's the reason Seguin is doing worse?

    Again, you're back on ignore.  I go through the trouble of showing you the stats because I bother to look them up and your response is "Seguin is better than those players."

    I don't expect you to agree with me, I just expect you to listen to what me - and everyone else has to say.  But you disregard what people say and just say what you think.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Spooner

    Oh no, marco's back behind the Seguin plow again?

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to kelvana33's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Badhab, why did you have to mention Kessel and Seguin?

    Those two names get said, and here he comes.

    Stupid people are the most predictable.

    [/QUOTE]

    Kick me now.

    Marco and Stanley, both impossible to have a discussion with.

    I would pay money to have Marco and Stanley have their own thread and would go at it all day every day.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from NeelyOrrBourque. Show NeelyOrrBourque's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to dannycater's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    If  Spooner scores 0 goals in the playoffs, does he get thrown under a bus too? Anybody who compares Spooner to Marc Savard needs their head examined. Let alone David Krecji. I like the kid, I like his skating ability, I hope he becomes a good NHL player, but regardless, I find it interesting how people pull for players and not for others. Marchand has been called every name in the book, and I thank god he wasn't impulsively traded away when he was slumping. I don't see the offense out of Spooner, but it takes time to develop. It took Joe Thornton time to turn into a scorer/playmaker and Krecji too. I go back to my original statement, if he was in the minors tomorrow I developing I wouldn't lose any sleep over him not being on the Big B's. When or if the kid produces, we can revisit Spooner.

    [/QUOTE]

    I did actually a couple of weeks ago. They found nothing, but I still think the kid has Savard & Janny type passing skills & more speed, but he probably won't produce the same amount as those guys for 2 reasons. 1. He's never going to be on the 1st line with Bergeron & Krecji still a Bruin 2. As all Claude Julian players-- they learn to play an all around game instead of one-dimensional. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from riptide757. Show riptide757's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to bostonfan191646's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to riptide757's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Spooner has displayed his speed and offensive ability. it seems Claude as always is taking the slow approach that has spooner focused on his defensive responsibility first making him a little reluctant to rush the offense at this point in his career. same thing he's done with every good Bruin prospect...........

    It looks like Spooner will be the healthy scratch and up top watching when Kelly returns which is good for him. then go from there. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Based on what? I haven't seen any indication spooner will be scratched. Have you heard something I havent?

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes. Kelly is about to return

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to marco0863's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to marco0863's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Book 2 25 gs would rather have a first line player of impact u need that in playoffs.  The only one who is that but a slight cut below is March. 

    You need a top first and second line. Seg can do both. This is nit "law of diminishing returns"

    [/QUOTE]

    Two 25 goal scorers would improve both the first and second line.  One player can't do both at the same time.  Coming at you in waves is the way this team is built, and it has been very successful in the playoffs without any help from a guy who scores 40 in the regular season.  These are different days, marco.  Two 25 goal, 60 point RWs would give the Bruins two RWs in the top 17 in the league in scoring for RWs if you compare 2011-12 (the last full year).

    I don't think you understand the law of diminishing returns.  Instead of one guy who scored 29 as a RW, they now have two who score 25 each.  Net increase in goals of 21, and more security and flexibility on the roster (that is, if, like Seguin, one of them has a bad playoffs, the other is still there hammering away). 

    Problem here is that you just have a different philosophy - which isn't more valid, but also isn't something we can disprove.

    [/QUOTE]

    You can't use 2 guys vs 1 . Pick one player. Like I said  Why not trade march for  4 10gs

    [/QUOTE]

    Why can't I?  They didn't trade Seguin for one player.  If you need two RWs, so you trade a guy whose best year as a RW is 29 goals in order to get two RWs who both score 25 for you?  The comparison is direct.  You've filled an area of need and replaced 5/6ths of the peak production of the player you traded. 

    See, this is the fundamental difference in the way we think about these things, marco.  You're thinking about players.  I'm thinking about building the team.  From the team perspective, filling two key positions by trading one player - even if that player is a better player than either of the two guys you get back - is a win.  Columbus did the same thing when they dealt Nash.  They addressed the need for a two way centre and a speedy depth scorer in dealing Nash.  It transformed that franchise, and look at what they're doing now.  They're ahead of Nash and the Rangers in the standings.

    Your comparison to trading Marchand for 4 10 goal guys doesn't fly.  The Bruins don't have a need for 4 10 goal guys.  They had a need for RWs who could score, play Bruins defense, and play with some speed.  You also wouldn't need to trade Marchand to find 4 10 goal players.  You do need to give up something to get 20+ goal scorers.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The kid has 20+ games under his belt and has showed great improvements in faceoffs ( yes Red, faceoffs were a weakness whether you want to believe it or not ) and his defensive awareness.

    I like the creativity he brings to that third line better then the other vanilla options.

    The thoughts about "he needs to score" ? He is a pass first type of player. Scoring a goal is secondary for him to be playing good compared to creating offense for his wingers with his skating and passing. That argument doesn't have any any bearing on whether he stays or goes.

    Let him develop at the big league level would be the choice I hope the Bruins take. He's very green and can only get better. 

    [/QUOTE]

    I want to see him add some goals for two reasons: 1) I don't think you can have long-term success as a pass-first centre unless you are an elite level player and you play with an elite level finisher, and even then, I don't think it's a recipe for competitive success.  JT Superstar.  Henrik Sedin.  Nick Backstrom.  Even Krejci - when he's a pass-first player, I don't think he's as successful.  When he's a threat to score goals, he's so much better.  You have to make them respect the threat that you'll take the shote, or it becomes that much easier to defend.  2) Spooner's numbers his last two years of junior had a nice balance between G and A.  Last year in the AHL, the balance shifted to assists, and he was still very successful.  I think he's got the ability to score goals, but he's focusing on the part of his game that's most advanced.  Fine...for now...but he can score, so I hope to see him pushing to score more.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ejacks. Show ejacks's posts

    Re: Spooner


    <<Fine...for now...but he can score, so I hope to see him pushing to score more.>>

    Agreed.  And to me, that means he needs to drive the net more.  He tends to spend a lot of time on the perimeter, both with and without the puck.  I'd love to see him make more inside moves when he enters the zone with the puck, rather than always going outside or shooting from the top of the circles+. 

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from watchtower. Show watchtower's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to ejacks' comment:
    [QUOTE]


    <<Fine...for now...but he can score, so I hope to see him pushing to score more.>>

    Agreed.  And to me, that means he needs to drive the net more.  He tends to spend a lot of time on the perimeter, both with and without the puck.  I'd love to see him make more inside moves when he enters the zone with the puck, rather than always going outside or shooting from the top of the circles+. 

    [/QUOTE]

    he has to gain 20lbs first

     
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  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Spooner

    [/QUOTE]

    We need top players - first liners second liners. Col trading nash was simply a move for the future and nash wanted out btw. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Balls.  On the Bruins, a 25 goal RW is a first liner.  In fact, the last time there was a full NHL season, only 20 RWs across the league scored 25+ goals.  That's a 3rd of the league whose best RW doesn't score that well.  The Bruins would have received 2 of the top 20 scoring RWs in the league if the scenario played out, and neither would be the top line RW because Iginla's there.

    The Bruins don't need "top players".  As a team they're 8th in goals for and 2nd in goals against.  They have the leading playoff scorer from two of the last three years.  You have no argument.  If you did, you would have led with this "they need better first liners" thing rather than trying to say I can't compare one player to two and all of the other excuses for ignoring the idea that trading Seguin might have been a good idea - regardless of how Seguin does in Dallas.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Spooner

    Seguin averaged 19mins TOI vs Washington in the playoffs. If Tyler was good he would have scored. Tyler didn't do anything he dissapeared. Great or even good players don't dissapear like that at crucial times. Didn't even realize he was playing in the Hawks SCF series.

    More lies and skirting the truth from the President of the Seguin fan club. No Stanley cups for Phat Phil nor Jumbo Joe! No cup this year, none since 1993 for the Shabs. Man it must stink to be a Canadien or a Lerf fan.

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to marco0863's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Well he's just said phil is great.

    Btw check out berg playoff performance at start of career

    If I recall hes actually one pig few who scored vs wash 

    Typical response of homer while here player is a god when he's gone a bum

    OLE OLE OLE OLE

    [/QUOTE]

    Not bums, just not as great as you portray them. They might be great for hockey pools & stats guys, but remember, thats for regular season pools.

     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to marco0863's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    50 blz 

    Would you rather have seg or loui playing rw on first  or 2nd line

    Here's the thing seg had a dismal playoff last year the year prior vs wash every bruin had a hard time scoring

    And we got beat by wash and holnsby who was a rookie  So singling out seg is unfair

    Point is giving up on a 21 yr old with that much talent is a waste . I was looking forward to the further future seeing seg and march. 

    Now seg getting lots of ice in dallas - Do u think thst any other current bruin woukd be doing the same as him if they were in Dallas getting same Ice time.?

    It's what one believes seg should be in the future.  If one believes he's destined for a lifetime of playoff medoicrity then the fact he's gone favors then but I  Don't. Hes 21 And would have learned from it- It's called

    Growing pains.  

    I'm no nba fan but that said of a particular player thst he didn't  have whst it takes to be a champion his name LEBRON JAMES

    [/QUOTE]


    Time to put this whack job to bed. Kessel/Seguin, Kessel/Seguin, blah blah blah.

    Hardly any ice time versus Washington in the series? Thats your excuse? Your either misinformed (shocker) or lying. Go check his ice time for that series. He got top 6 forward ice time (every game) as San points points out. Two games he had more ice time than Bergeron did, and in one of the games only Krejci had more ice time among the forwards.

    There goes that excuse.

    Wait...Here it comes, but none of the other players were socring!!!! Okay genious, lets go to last years playoffs. Did the Bruins have trouble scoring? How were Seguins numbers the enitire playoffs?

    They gave up on a 21 year old with that much talent? Are you serious? Are you all there? He was warned on several occasions, his agent was spoken to. He was disciplined for his behavior and lack of immaturty. Result: Showing up hungover to the rink in the playoffs wearing the same clothes he left the arena in the day before. Those are facts.

    Looking at those facts, would you say the Bruins gave up on the talented 21 year old, or would you say the talented 21 year old gave up on the Bruins?

    Peter Chiarelli did not give up on Tyler Seguin when he traded him. In fact, he did everything BUT give up on him.  He tried everything he could to get that player to realize the magnitude of the situation. He was paying him alot of money, and the player was not getting it. In fact, it was getting worse, in the Stanley Cup playoffs no less, on a team built to compete for the championship.

    On another team, in another situation, perhaps they could live through the "growing pains" of a talented young player. Not this team. This team is poised to win now, and the player failed to recognize that by continually to ignore the advice he was given by management and teammates.

    Some professions pay you big boy money, expect you to make big boy decisions and show big boy responsibilites. He failed to do that. That is why he is a Dallas Star.

    He wrote his own ticket out of Boston.

    I wish you'd follow him.

     

     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Spooner

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:
    [


    I want to see him add some goals for two reasons: 1) I don't think you can have long-term success as a pass-first centre unless you are an elite level player and you play with an elite level finisher, and even then, I don't think it's a recipe for competitive success.  JT Superstar.  Henrik Sedin.  Nick Backstrom.  Even Krejci - when he's a pass-first player, I don't think he's as successful.  When he's a threat to score goals, he's so much better.  You have to make them respect the threat that you'll take the shote, or it becomes that much easier to defend.  2) Spooner's numbers his last two years of junior had a nice balance between G and A.  Last year in the AHL, the balance shifted to assists, and he was still very successful.  I think he's got the ability to score goals, but he's focusing on the part of his game that's most advanced.  Fine...for now...but he can score, so I hope to see him pushing to score more.

    [/QUOTE]

    I agree. All your future references to his game will make him a better player in the long run.

    But that's not my point.

    I'm referring to the present quotes that seem to currently suggest his lack of potting goals means he should be AHL bound.  

    I say nonsense. Goals would be nice but not the lone factor whether he stays or not. He is doing other things that shows he is an NHLer.

    We'll see when Kelly comes back on what their plans are for him.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Claudorr. Show Claudorr's posts

    Re: Spooner

    Why are you still talking about Seguin? He is now with another club, period! A trade is always a gamble, so is drafting( drafting second overall does not guarantee a thing!) . Let's wait a few years before assessing this trade

     

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