Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed?

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    Re: Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed?

    In Response to Re: Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed?:
    [QUOTE]Hey, it's the PC thing to say ... doesn't mean I believe it, haha. Now the money center banks are a different story. Where else do they take your money and pay you nothing in return? Then charge such usurious rates on a loan and huge fees to boot. Now that's mob-like and bloodsucking!
    Posted by Mployee8[/QUOTE]

    Oh yeah.  Too big to fail...right.  They took gov't $ and just lent it to each other and not to consumers or small businesses.  Whose interest were they considering?  Organized crime doesn't always mean the "mob".  
     
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    Re: Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed?

    I think it's delusional to believe Walker can help. Yes, delusional.  Maybe eight or nine years ago, but now?  Walker didn't "eat himself out of the League" as some have suggested.  In fact, his conditioning in Miami was the best of his career.  It was another case of someone becoming more of what they already are as they age.  We see this in elderly people all of the time.  A sort of cranky person becomes an out and out terror.  Someone given to hyperbole becomes someone who sees everything as either black and white or totally without nuance.  Walker would be wont to move the ball, push it inside, and would fire threes at will (usually at the wrong times, as per history).  For a guy who could pass effectively he was a black hole and how and why would he change now?  He's about to be only 34 but he could never jump higher than about 4".  I can't see him getting better than he was when they dumped him (twice).  Many people are dead set against Delonte West for being a depressed individual, but his problems aren't necessarily of his own making (although it was he who put a gun in his motorcycle).  He's more of victim than Walker who has shown clear signs of immaturity and irresponsible behavior to this day.  Is it just bad luck to be robbed at gunpoint twice? He's bankrupt in more than one way. How this guy could help the Celtics is beyond comprehension.  West is only 27 and has proved he can play. Tim Thomas goes to work every day and sweats.  Walker, never a workaholic and always looking for the easy way, could hardly demand equal consideration.  I will only allow that Antoine was always a good citizen in Boston and a testament to the generosity of spirit that helps others.  I hold nothing against him off the court (except for his ruinous gambling, which grossly hurt him and his family) or in the public domain. He was always in the community doing good deeds and for that I applaud his efforts.  But as a player, he's cooked, overcooked.  Any addition to the roster has to be for good basketball reasons, not nostalgia or a longing to repeat what once was.  The few former C's still playing that could be brought back include Billups and Johnson and maybe Giddens, but not Walker, who's not currently playing.  What does everyone else know about Antoine that people here don't know?
     
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    Re: Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed?

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    [QUOTE]I think it's delusional to believe Walker can help. Yes, delusional.  Maybe eight or nine years ago, but now?  Walker didn't "eat himself out of the League" as some have suggested.  In fact, his conditioning in Miami was the best of his career.  It was another case of someone becoming more of what they already are as they age.  We see this in elderly people all of the time.  A sort of cranky person becomes an out and out terror.  Someone given to hyperbole becomes someone who sees everything as either black and white or totally without nuance.  Walker would be wont to move the ball, push it inside, and would fire threes at will (usually at the wrong times, as per history).  For a guy who could pass effectively he was a black hole and how and why would he change now?  He's about to be only 34 but he could never jump higher than about 4".  I can't see him getting better than he was when they dumped him (twice).  Many people are dead set against Delonte West for being a depressed individual, but his problems aren't necessarily of his own making (although it was he who put a gun in his motorcycle).  He's more of victim than Walker who has shown clear signs of immaturity and irresponsible behavior to this day.  Is it just bad luck to be robbed at gunpoint twice? He's bankrupt in more than one way. How this guy could help the Celtics is beyond comprehension.  West is only 27 and has proved he can play. Tim Thomas goes to work every day and sweats.  Walker, never a workaholic and always looking for the easy way, could hardly demand equal consideration.  I will only allow that Antoine was always a good citizen in Boston and a testament to the generosity of spirit that helps others.  I hold nothing against him off the court (except for his ruinous gambling, which grossly hurt him and his family) or in the public domain. He was always in the community doing good deeds and for that I applaud his efforts.  But as a player, he's cooked, overcooked.  Any addition to the roster has to be for good basketball reasons, not nostalgia or a longing to repeat what once was.  The few former C's still playing that could be brought back include Billups and Johnson and maybe Giddens, but not Walker, who's not currently playing.  What does everyone else know about Antoine that people here don't know?
    Posted by painter[/QUOTE]

    I am not at all wishing you or anyone harm, but based on your comments you are deserving of no sympathy if you and your family are robbed at gunpoint in your own home or if you are the victim of a violent crime.  Personally I don't believe in karma but hey, what goes around comes around.     
     
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    Re: Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed?

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    [QUOTE]should have posted this over here: Just some stats PP/AW Stats: Year  Team Gms Mins  FG%  FT% 3P%  RPG  APG SPG BPG  PPG 99-00 BOS 73   35.4  44.2  79.8  34.3   5.4   3.0  2.1  0.9  19.6 00-01 BOS 82   38.0  45.4  74.5  38.3  6.4   3.1  1.7  0.8  25.3 01-02 BOS 82   40.3  44.2  80.9  40.4  6.9   3.2  1.9  1.1  26.1 02-03 BOS 79   39.2  41.6  80.2  30.2   7.3   4.4  1.8  0.8  25.9 03-04 BOS 80   38.7  40.2  81.9  29.9   6.5   5.1  1.6  0.7  22.9 < AW Gone % FT% 3PT% RPG APG SPG BPG PPG 96-97 BOS 82   36.2  42.6  63.1  32.7  9.0   3.2  1.3  0.7  17.5 97-98 BOS 82   39.9  42.6  64.5  31.2 10.2  3.3  1.7  0.7  22.4 99-00 BOS 82   36.6  43.0  69.9  25.6   8.0   3.7  1.4  0.4  20.5 < PP Arrives 00-01 BOS 81   41.9  41.3  71.5  36.6  8.9   5.5  1.7  0.6  23.4 01-02 BOS 81   42.0  39.4  74.1  34.4  8.8   5.0  1.5  0.5  22.1 02-03 BOS 78   41.5  38.8  61.5  32.3  7.2   4.8  1.5  0.4  20.1 Toine avg'd about 32-33% on 3 pointers five of six yrs here with the one outlier being the year PP arrived. During the five years they played together PP only shot the three exceedingly better than AW for two of those years with an overall avg of 34.5%. AW was clearly the better rebounder while PP was clearly the better FT shooter. Their overall FG% was about 40% for AW and about 43% for PP .  PP avg'd 24 PPG and AW 20 PPG ... These numbers are very close to each other for the early years of their careers. There just isn't a huge difference in their stats - 2% on threes and 3% overall! Why a fan would castigate Walker for his play as compared to Pierce over the time they played together is just unjustified and speaks to an ignorance of the facts or other underlying reasons.
    Posted by Mployee8[/QUOTE]
    Yes because EVERY team needs a power forward who can't shoot 40% blended.. that's unacceptable numbers, even for a point guard! A PF is supposed to have more dunks and post putbacks and be one of the higher % on your team, as is the center. However, walker sat on the line more than sheed and scal combined!
     
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    Re: Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed?

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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Censorship: Antoine Walker discussion removed? : Yes because EVERY team needs a power forward who can't shoot 40% blended.. that's unacceptable numbers, even for a point guard! A PF is supposed to have more dunks and post putbacks and be one of the higher % on your team, as is the center. However, walker sat on the line more than sheed and scal combined!
    Posted by jrmccook[/QUOTE]

    You're forgetting something ... Walker was a SF for the C's originally as he was deemed too small (esp @ 19) to bang with most PF's. He was being groomed for the SF spot until the C's got lucky and landed Pierce. Then the discussion turned to where to play each - have PP play the 2 and AW play the 3? Ultimately it was decided that PP was a natural 3 and he took over that spot while Toine was pushed into the PF slot and did well there due to his quickness. But for the most part he excelled at beating his man off the dribble (when it didn't go off his foot) or creating for others. Sure he rebounded well but not due to his hops but as a result of his ability to get to the spot quicker. He didn't have the bulk in those early years and was easily pushed off the post in a half court game. He had to rely on beating his man, pulling him out of the paint and spreading the floor. And of course when OB game planned the three point shooting offense AW took to that like a duck to water. After all, why would he want to bang with the big boys unless he had a mismatch? That's the way I saw it and I was there ... I even think it's a shame how things worked out. Toine was developed as a PF when he should have been a SF. And couple that with the fact that he was encouraged to shoot threes at a 600/yr clip for three years just brainwashed him into thinking he was better at it than he really was and it became a part of his mindset. He should have been working on his handle and free throws as he had all the other tools to excel at the SF position - size, quickness, court awareness, passing skills and a descent wingspan.

    But at any rate he was misconceived or misused depending on your viewpoint. Here's a good article regarding AW's return to the C's - Read it, you might learn something!

    http://sports.espn.go.com/espnmag/story?id=3756860
     

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