Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

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    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to VeniceSox's comment:

    In response to BiggerThanMyBrady's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    Based on the guys Chad Ford has left, I'd be thrilled with Shabazz falling to Boston. Jamaal Franklin is a guy I really like. High motor. Led his team basically in every statistical category. I'd be okay with him too. Gobert is really raw, and Boston already has a project in Melo. Giannis is just as raw, faced mediocre competition, but is EXTREMELY intriguing. Lots of size and length. Good top speed, but takes a bit to get there (first step isn't great). Ricky Ledo is unproven. Sergey is interesting. Watched some of his highlights this morning. Very good passer for a guy that size and that young. Quick jumper. I know most people want the C's to draft a big, but I'm not a huge fan of Dieng. Certainly has some ability, but I don't think he's a game changer. Shabazz has a much higher ceiling. Olynyk is pretty intriguing. Huge jump this year at Gonzaga. Can really stretch the floor for a 7-footer. I'd prolly pick him over Dieng.

     



    So what makes you thrilled about Shabazz? How often have you seen him and what did you see in him?

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Let me first say that this is a weak draft and I don't see too much high-end talent where the Celtics are picking. There are a whole bunch of different options that could play out, maybe someone falls. Who knows. But....

    Shabazz has a much higher ceiling than most guys left by the time Boston picks. I don't think Schroeder will be there (if Dallas trades out, there's a better shot of that happening). PG is not a deep position in this draft (Marcus Smart going back to OSU was a game-changer) so I think the odds of Dennis being available there are slim. Guys similar to him like Crabbe, Hardaway Jr, Jamaal Franklin, Reggie Bullock are good players but their ceilings aren't as high. He's more proven than the Euro guys and won't take as long to develop.

    In terms of what I've seen from him that I've liked: Extremely good pick-and-roll player. Really deadly if you leave him. Really good catch-and-shoot ability. Can finish strong through contact. Can work on his dribble-drive game a little bit. Extremely athletic. Good leaping ability. For a two-guard he's a good rebounder. Not sure he could be a sure-fire three. Could be better in isolation. Needs to work on his defense. Dion Waiters was small too, but I think he'll pan out just fine. He also had similar attitude issues. I think getting Shabazz on a veteran team with Doc could help him there.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    When you aren't a quick guard, you need outstanding handle and shooting ability to be good. Shabazz has neither.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiggerThanMyBrady. Show BiggerThanMyBrady's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to DaCeltics' comment:

    When you aren't a quick guard, you need outstanding handle and shooting ability to be good. Shabazz has neither.




    You mention Curry, Hardaway Jr, and Crabbe. I wouldn't take Curry. He's too small. He'd have to be a PG at a whopping 6'1". Guy can shoot, no question, but Rivers was a better prospect than Seth. Shabazz had a better 3-point percentage than Hardaway Jr and Crabbe (38, 37, 35 respectfully). In terms of handles, none of them have extraordinary skills. All could be better off the dribble, but again I come back to Shabazz because I know he can score off the dribble better than the other two.

    I'll reiderate what I said....this is a weak draft. I'm not sure what you're looking for in terms of talent, but Shabazz has as much as anyone left after the top-6/7.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    He's an inferior shooter compared to the guys you mentioned and THAT makes all the difference. You ever play your heart out and lose because the other team had better shooters? It sux.

    The percentage argument always has to be looked at in context of volume of shots. 1-2 looks great statistically but I prefer someone that shot 7-16 from 3 because its 7 3's instead of just one.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiggerThanMyBrady. Show BiggerThanMyBrady's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to DaCeltics' comment:

    He's an inferior shooter compared to the guys you mentioned and THAT makes all the difference. You ever play your heart out and lose because the other team had better shooters? It sux.

    The percentage argument always has to be looked at in context of volume of shots. 1-2 looks great statistically but I prefer someone that shot 7-16 from 3 because its 7 3's instead of just one.




    But wouldn't you think scoring more points (572 - Bazz, 552 - Hardaway, 607 - Crabbe) in less minutes (987 - Bazz, 1324 - Hardaway, 1195 - Crabbe)  make a more efficient scorer? I understand the argument when guys have a small sample size, but these numbers are over the course of a full season. As far as inferior, I'm not sure what numbers suggest that. All three shot roughtly 45% from the field with roughly the same amount of attempts (456 - Bazz, 460 Hardaway, 468 - Crabbe). You're going to knock Shabazz for outside shooting because he took 80 less threes? Because that's the major difference between all three guys when you break down the numbers.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    Yes. As a SG he needs outstanding quickness or outstanding range. He has neither. I'm not saying he's not an NBA player. I don't like his game. Therefore I don't want him on my favorite team.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiggerThanMyBrady. Show BiggerThanMyBrady's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to DaCeltics' comment:

    Yes. As a SG he needs outstanding quickness or outstanding range. He has neither. I'm not saying he's not an NBA player. I don't like his game. Therefore I don't want him on my favorite team.



    Then look at James Southerland. More range and a better shooter from three than all of them.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    Southerland is a fine player. My focus has been Celtic needs, which is backcourt shooting, backcourt playmaking, and shot blocking.

    Southerland is a SF/PF. I think Jeff and Brandon have that covered.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from cabutan. Show cabutan's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    I dont know...but I started checking videos of prospects and we would be very lucky to get this guy. He is a scorer and not afraid of shooting. We lack center, forwards, shooting guards and we also lack that scorer. I think given such a dry pool of choices, this guy (from what I see) would be a good pick and that scorer...remember, last year we needed a big and we chose a project and it did not work.... This guy seems to be more NBA ready and you have to take that. Clear example, Jared Sullinger.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ortiz123. Show Ortiz123's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to DaCeltics' comment:

    He's an inferior shooter compared to the guys you mentioned and THAT makes all the difference. You ever play your heart out and lose because the other team had better shooters? It sux.

    The percentage argument always has to be looked at in context of volume of shots. 1-2 looks great statistically but I prefer someone that shot 7-16 from 3 because its 7 3's instead of just one.



    That was the Celtic season is a nut shell....

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from cabutan. Show cabutan's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    I also like that Mason Plumlee but I havent seen lots of him...I dont watch as much college as before...

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ortiz123. Show Ortiz123's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to cabutan's comment:

    I dont know...but I started checking videos of prospects and we would be very lucky to get this guy. He is a scorer and not afraid of shooting. We lack center, forwards, shooting guards and we also lack that scorer. I think given such a dry pool of choices, this guy (from what I see) would be a good pick and that scorer...remember, last year we needed a big and we chose a project and it did not work.... This guy seems to be more NBA ready and you have to take that. Clear example, Jared Sullinger.



    Sully has a very high BB IQ...not sure about this kid...

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from cabutan. Show cabutan's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to Ortiz123's comment:

    In response to cabutan's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    I dont know...but I started checking videos of prospects and we would be very lucky to get this guy. He is a scorer and not afraid of shooting. We lack center, forwards, shooting guards and we also lack that scorer. I think given such a dry pool of choices, this guy (from what I see) would be a good pick and that scorer...remember, last year we needed a big and we chose a project and it did not work.... This guy seems to be more NBA ready and you have to take that. Clear example, Jared Sullinger.

     



    Sully has a very high BB IQ...not sure about this kid...

     

    [/QUOTE]

    True..but he is a scorer and a fearless one..

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from cabutan. Show cabutan's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    there is so much disparity between different mocks on this years draft..interesting..

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BiggerThanMyBrady. Show BiggerThanMyBrady's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to DaCeltics' comment:

    Southerland is a fine player. My focus has been Celtic needs, which is backcourt shooting, backcourt playmaking, and shot blocking.

    Southerland is a SF/PF. I think Jeff and Brandon have that covered.



    He's neither of those. He's a really tall two-guard. Incredibly talented pick-and-pop player. No dribble-drive, bad in isolation. Think Eddie House, but 6'8". Catch-and-shoot ability is through the roof. And when he gets hot keep feeding him. Range is also almost unlimited.

    I agree with the needs, but disagree with how the Celtics can get them. They're not going to get all three in this draft with only one pick. Maybe they trade back and accumulate picks (maybe take a look at Bullock, Hardaway), but this draft class is AWFUL. The bigs in this class aren't anything to write home about (with the exception of Noel and possibly Adams).

    I think Boston not taking Shabazz at 16 if he's available would be a mistake. If they don't want him there then trade out. Someone will want to take him there. I just think the upside on him could be huge. And you can never have enough bench scoring, which is his primary asset.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaCeltics. Show DaCeltics's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    The way he scores will not translate to the NBA. In Shabazz videos he shows a lack of ability to finish through contact, and NBA refs are NOT going to call fouls for him. His post ups can easily be taken away by the Kawhi Leonards and help shot blockers that don't exist in college. He's going to come of screens in the pros to find out he's not open like in college,  then what? Without the dribble isolation skills he will be a career back-up sg/sf that is decent in the reg.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from KJandHondo. Show KJandHondo's posts

    Re: Chad Ford Mock draft 4.0 - C's with Muhammad

    In response to DaCeltics' comment:

     

    The way he scores will not translate to the NBA. In Shabazz videos he shows a lack of ability to finish through contact, and NBA refs are NOT going to call fouls for him. His post ups can easily be taken away by the Kawhi Leonards and help shot blockers that don't exist in college. He's going to come of screens in the pros to find out he's not open like in college,  then what? Without the dribble isolation skills he will be a career back-up sg/sf that is decent in the reg.

     



    He can't finish trough contact?  Out of all the hybrid 2 guards he probably has the best "finishing" skills.  He has above average length (6'11") and the size (220lbs) than the likes of Crabbe (197lbs).  If anything Crabbe will be a catch and shoot guy in the NBA, and at least there is ample tape the Shabbaz can create shots off the dribble.  

     

    Like BiggerthanmyBrady suggested if Danny isn't a fan of Shabazz trade out because someone will want to gamble on him at 16 and look at someone like Bullock who has a really good stroke (42%3Pt) and could be a lock down defender.  Its a weak draft, but the deepest position is definatly 2/3 guy which is why I would go there first even though they "need" a 5 more.

     

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