RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to RajonRondowski's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to puddinpuddin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to darkman20's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    A hall of fame player with still plenty of game left for 3mil a year--Miami got a steal...not only that, but Ray looks like the Ray before Doc told him to go stand in the corner for the last five years---Now in Miami: he's going coast-to-coast, dribbling behind his back, driving to the hole, falling on the ground fighting for lose balls...D@mn!

    His stats tonight: 15points 3-4 from 3s...on only 9 shots--6 rebounds and 6 assists...D@mn!  Miami is already labeling Lebron, Wade, Bosh and Ray The Fantastic Four....Thanks Rondo!

    [/QUOTE]
    Turns out that there is LAR... Life After Rondo... for someone who wins a reprieve/release/full pardon from basketball's infamous DBR... AKA, death by Rondo... gulag.

    The Heat enjoy the Fantastic 4 while the Cs get to tout  the Now Shrinking BIG 2.5!

    Pud 

    [/QUOTE]

    LoL.. I am laughing at loud.

    You guys know that none of that good stuff counts for the Ray haters.

    They got their reasons and their own twisted logic.

    I agree on this:  Ray's got a lot left in the tank, and the Heat got a real bargin. 

    As Bob Neumy used to say, Why can't we get players like that?

    Lol

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't hate Ray.

    It is quite odd how people think that Ray Allen wont keep shooting 63 percent are called "haters" instead of realists.  By the end of the year Ray will be shooting 46, or 47 percent.  

     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from joel49. Show joel49's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to aciemvp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to puddinpuddin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Acie:

    RA's crankles served him pretty well in 2007-08 after they were scoped. I remember him one on one blowing by SashaV for the clincher if memory serves me.

    He's older now but his freshly scoped ankles may endure less wear/tear coming off the bench w/ the floor fully spread so he doesn't have to work so hard to get open.

    The notion that he's driving to the hoop, dishing and rebounding in addition to 3-balling is unbelievable.

    Will it last???

    Stay tuned, RayRay fans. Others may avert their eyes.

    Pud

    [/QUOTE]

    absolutely not.  it cannot last.  he did not make it through last season. 


    he's on his third ankle surgery.  the only chance for ray to "last" is if they don't use him much.  and then how do you keep conditioning?


    [/QUOTE]


    Exactly.  Ray started out last season on fire, shooting ridiculous percentages in the first month of the season.  How did that work out?  New ankles or not, he has only one direction he can go. 

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    I don't hate Ray.

    It is quite odd how people think that Ray Allen wont keep shooting 63 percent are called "haters" instead of realists. By the end of the year Ray will be shooting 46, or 47 percent.

    Haha, love it Snake, you have been on fire in these Ray Allen threads with your lucid relaity based posts.

    I don't hate Ray either, how can I? He helped get my C's a title, I waited so long. I can't remember '86... I had my Huskies in '99, Patriots in '01 and Red Sox in '04 and finally FINALLY came the one team I wanted to see hoisting a title more than any other, and Ray buried 3's in LA's face as I smoked ciagrs with my friends in the nose bleeds.

    Also as a teenager at Jim Calhoun's bball camp Ray was great dude, shooting hoops with us kids, signing hats, being available to talk about the game. But that doesn't make me unable to say the TRUTH about the exit from Boston... which was 80& the fault of Ray and 20% the fault of the C's and Ray 100% acted like an ungrateful pertulant child and egomaniac. 

    Anyhow, I'm rambling. Ray will shoot 44-47% on 3's this year and remain a dangerous late game option... if healthy... but his defense and turnovers will not make him much of (or any) better than the opposing teams SG in the first 45 mins of the game and he will be hard-pressed to match what Mike Miller and James Jones did from 3 in the playoffs last year so the Heat are really not that much better. Its a healthy Bosh/Wade and a LBJ w/ no monkey on his back that has them really clicking, Ray will absolutely cool off.

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    People do realize that Ray is taking all the mins the Heat gave Jones and Miller last year... do you know what they did in the playoffs?

    Miller was hurt a lot but when they needed to close a team out he strapped one on and came to ball. In the game enders vs. the Knicks (3-5), Pacers (4-7) and Thunder (7-8) he was out of this world.

    Jones had less single game heroics but more consistent showings. He knocked down a big 3 in 4 of the 7 games vs. the C's and 2 of the 5 vs. the Thunder. his percentages weren't great like Miller's... but giving Ray all the mins the two of those guys had isn't going to make them that much better from behind the arc, but will weaken their overall defense.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxfan94. Show redsoxfan94's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    people dont understand that danny ainge offered ray DOUBLE what he got from miami.....danny wanted ray back, ray didnt want to be back. and its too early to tell whether it will work out for us or not....if you want to buy this much stock into the first three or four games of the season, then apparently the knicks will sweep the heat in the playoffs because they beat them badly....seriously, way too early to tell.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from runrunandrun. Show runrunandrun's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to COMMIE-CONTRARIAN's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not only is the man bringing it at 15 ppg but is only turning it over once per game despite handling the rock much more than he ever did in boston and is often helping to facilitate the offense while he's out there. no grudge against the man, he made the best basketball decision for himself. wide open looks, and guys who can actually catch his passes due to increased athleticism and younger reflexes, south freakin beach... well played by mr. allen!

    will those numbers stay that high? not likely... but he will top his 45% career average and 40% 3 average. can see him shooting 50%+ and leading the league at 45% on 3s while making the all-star game and getting at least one more ring over the next 3 years!

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Ray was one of the few gentlemen and great player on the C's last 5 years.Ray carried the C's and hit many game winning shots.

    Run

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to runrunandrun's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to COMMIE-CONTRARIAN's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Not only is the man bringing it at 15 ppg but is only turning it over once per game despite handling the rock much more than he ever did in boston and is often helping to facilitate the offense while he's out there. no grudge against the man, he made the best basketball decision for himself. wide open looks, and guys who can actually catch his passes due to increased athleticism and younger reflexes, south freakin beach... well played by mr. allen!

    will those numbers stay that high? not likely... but he will top his 45% career average and 40% 3 average. can see him shooting 50%+ and leading the league at 45% on 3s while making the all-star game and getting at least one more ring over the next 3 years!

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Ray was one of the few gentlemen and great player on the C's last 5 years.Ray carried the C's and hit many game winning shots.

    Run

    [/QUOTE]


    Ray stopped being a gentleman sometime last year... but thanks for your captain obvious comments on his contributions as a player run

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from RajonRondowski. Show RajonRondowski's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    -

    For a bunch of guys who claim they don't hate Ray at all, they sure spend a lot of verbiage and energy running him down, criticizing him, hoping he fails, slandering him, impunging his integrity, and minimizing the accomplishmnet of this certified Hall of Famer.

    A hater by any other name is still a hater.

    Isn't it hypocritical to say you don't hate Ray when almost everything you say about him is derogratory and spiteful?

    It will be interesting at the end of the season to compare the stats of Avery Bradly and the crew at the 2, for the Celtics, the Celtics W/L record, and Ray's stats and the Heat's record.

    It is fair to say that the Celtics took a hosing when Ray went to the Heat, isn't it? It's fair to say the Celtics would be in better shape with Ray, wouldn't it?

    You can debate it and spin it, but I think the honest answer is obvious.

     

    Ya can't look at much, can ya, Man.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    Last night Terry had 16 and Allen had 9.

    So therefore Terry is better than Ray right?

    Isn't that how we figure things out around here?  

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to RajonRondowski's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    -

    For a bunch of guys who claim they don't hate Ray at all, they sure spend a lot of verbiage and energy running him down, criticizing him, hoping he fails, slandering him, impunging his integrity, and minimizing the accomplishmnet of this certified Hall of Famer.

    A hater by any other name is still a hater.

    Isn't it hypocritical to say you don't hate Ray when almost everything you say about him is derogratory and spiteful?

    It will be interesting at the end of the season to compare the stats of Avery Bradly and the crew at the 2, for the Celtics, the Celtics W/L record, and Ray's stats and the Heat's record.

    It is fair to say that the Celtics took a hosing when Ray went to the Heat, isn't it? It's fair to say the Celtics would be in better shape with Ray, wouldn't it?

    You can debate it and spin it, but I think the honest answer is obvious.

     

    Ya can't look at much, can ya, Man.

    [/QUOTE]


     

    The Heat were better last year when the Celtics had Ray Allen.  Obviously the won lost record will be a spurious comparison this year.

    As far as Stats go, yeah at the end of the year we can look at Terry and Allen and compare stats by minute.

    Either way Bradley is the best of the bunch if he is healthy. 

    Again I really don't get why you would identify someone as a "hater" who chooses to point out that Ray is not the player that he used to be.

    Garnett isn't either, Neither is Pierce.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from RajonRondowski. Show RajonRondowski's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The Heat were better last year when the Celtics had Ray Allen.  Obviously the won lost record will be a spurious comparison this year.

    As far as Stats go, yeah at the end of the year we can look at Terry and Allen and compare stats by minute.

    Either way Bradley is the best of the bunch if he is healthy. 

    Again I really don't get why you would identify someone as a "hater" who chooses to point out that Ray is not the player that he used to be.

    Garnett isn't either, Neither is Pierce.

    [/QUOTE]


    -

    "Again I really don't get why you would identify someone as a "hater" who chooses to point out that Ray is not the player that he used to be."

    I didn't do that, snake: perhaps youre self-identifying as a "hater".

    "The Heat were better last year when the Celtics had Ray Allen."

    The Heat were a little better last year than the C's, but this year they are much better and you do know why, don't you.

    I thought it would be interesting to compare stats in light of the many claims here that Allen won't be effective all season and that his body will break down, dubious claims, ast best, and totally unfounded based on the available evidence.  Correlation does not equal causation.

    I just think that whenever someone places a disclaimer like, "I don't hate Ray . . " there is a big, implied "but" just waiting be sprung that will include a long litany of why they don't {not} hate Ray, and a list of bad things about Ray and why he will fail now that he is not with the Celtics.

    Feel free to disagree for I'm not trying to change anyone's mind just pointing out the dynamics and the rhetorical tactics being used in his ongoing debate.

    -

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    Unless Ray can play center, we wont miss him and last I checked, Ray is a Sg which we have plenty of. If you combine what we got instead of him. We got the better deal by far. Terry, Lee and Barbosa ALL play better D then Allen while not shooting at great but are very good shooter in their own rights.  I'll take the drop off in percentage by a couple points for more defensive stops. thank you

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Gasthoerer. Show Gasthoerer's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    You can be considered a hater when you only forcus on the negative aspects (and on top use fals arguments).

    You can be considered a fanboy when you only look at the positive aspects (see above).

    1. Ray will not going to shot the same number like in the first 3 games. Terry and Lee will come around.

    2. Ray was better than either Terry or Lee last year and without an injury it is not unlikely similiar this year.

    3. Ray was always a starter and Star player. Lee is a journeyman and Terry was always a benchplayer (a great one though) --> There is a reason for that.

    4. Terry NEVER was a better defense player than Ray. He is not focused and too small. Check what Doc said after what was a good defensive game of Terry: Celtics coach Doc Rivers said: “And, you know, it’s funny, we left Jason in because he was playing great defense. That may be a first in his career that that’s ever been said about Jason Terry. ..."

    5. Both Lee and Terry (and AB as well) are not better rebounders than Ray.

    6. Lee (and AB) is not a better ball handler than Ray (Terry only a little).

    7. Ray is not a turnover machine --> I proved that with facts several time.

    8. Ray's defense is underappreciated --> prove last playoffs.

    9. Over a long season: Terry & Lee & Allen might be better than Allen & AB due too the risc of injury --> but if healthy it might be the other way around.

    10. Our biggest problem is NOT at the SG positions. SF and C is an issue so far. Green is terrible at the moment!

     

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to RajonRondowski's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The Heat were better last year when the Celtics had Ray Allen.  Obviously the won lost record will be a spurious comparison this year.

    As far as Stats go, yeah at the end of the year we can look at Terry and Allen and compare stats by minute.

    Either way Bradley is the best of the bunch if he is healthy. 

    Again I really don't get why you would identify someone as a "hater" who chooses to point out that Ray is not the player that he used to be.

    Garnett isn't either, Neither is Pierce.

    [/QUOTE]


    -

    "Again I really don't get why you would identify someone as a "hater" who chooses to point out that Ray is not the player that he used to be."

    I didn't do that, snake: perhaps youre self-identifying as a "hater".

    "The Heat were better last year when the Celtics had Ray Allen."

    The Heat were a little better last year than the C's, but this year they are much better and you do know why, don't you.

    I thought it would be interesting to compare stats in light of the many claims here that Allen won't be effective all season and that his body will break down, dubious claims, ast best, and totally unfounded based on the available evidence.  Correlation does not equal causation.

    I just think that whenever someone places a disclaimer like, "I don't hate Ray . . " there is a big, implied "but" just waiting be sprung that will include a long litany of why they don't {not} hate Ray, and a list of bad things about Ray and why he will fail now that he is not with the Celtics.

    Feel free to disagree for I'm not trying to change anyone's mind just pointing out the dynamics and the rhetorical tactics being used in his ongoing debate.

    -

    [/QUOTE]


    The Heat were way better last year.  They had a .697 winning percentage.  The Celtics had a .591 winning percentage.

    At the end of the year we can compare their winning percentages this year and then one could possibly make an argument that Allen was a big difference maker if the Heat's winning percentage rose or the Celtics dropped.

    Miami won the championship last year without Ray Allen, the Celtics lost to the Heat with Ray Allen.

    But somehow Ray Allen is why the Heat are better?  

    Makes sense.

     I dont think Ray will fail.  I just don't think he is that good anymore either.  Time will tell.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    Again, its not how you start but how you finish

    snake your posts are spot on as always

    And I'll post this a second time... but through 4 games last season Ray was avergaing 20 points and 58/58/100... he entered January doing that. Then in 17 games in January he shot 55% from 3 and avg'd under 2 turnovers a game.

    and it was all downhill from there...

    He is a career 45/40 shooter but as a Celtic his last 4 years, in his mid 30's, he was a 47/42 shooter... that is what I expect from him in Miami if he is healthy.. even a few ticks more b/c he will get better looks... so 48/45 maybe.

    So what are the better odds?

    A. That he shoots 48/45 over the whole year and at some point deals with an injury, or a shooting slump... and Miami will be holding their breath its not in the playoffs

    or

    B. That he shoots 59/59 all year, or even 50% from either the 2 or the 3, and is run 28 mins a game and there are no issues for his 37 year old body?

    He lost his job to Avery and pouted, he wanted no part of beign a decoy or playing here off the bench anymore... so he took 50% of the $ to go elsewhere. What are we complaining about?

    At the end of the year if Terry and Lee shoot their career averages they will have combined to be FAR better than what Ray gave us off the bench at the end of the year last year... in a role he refused to be in this year.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from RajonRondowski. Show RajonRondowski's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to Gasthoerer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You can be considered a hater when you only forcus on the negative aspects (and on top use fals arguments).

    You can be considered a fanboy when you only look at the positive aspects (see above).

    1. Ray will not going to shot the same number like in the first 3 games. Terry and Lee will come around.

    2. Ray was better than either Terry or Lee last year and without an injury it is not unlikely similiar this year.

    3. Ray was always a starter and Star player. Lee is a journeyman and Terry was always a benchplayer (a great one though) --> There is a reason for that.

    4. Terry NEVER was a better defense player than Ray. He is not focused and too small. Check what Doc said after what was a good defensive game of Terry: Celtics coach Doc Rivers said: “And, you know, it’s funny, we left Jason in because he was playing great defense. That may be a first in his career that that’s ever been said about Jason Terry. ..."

    5. Both Lee and Terry (and AB as well) are not better rebounders than Ray.

    6. Lee (and AB) is not a better ball handler than Ray (Terry only a little).

    7. Ray is not a turnover machine --> I proved that with facts several time.

    8. Ray's defense is underappreciated --> prove last playoffs.

    9. Over a long season: Terry & Lee & Allen might be better than Allen & AB due too the risc of injury --> but if healthy it might be the other way around.

    10. Our biggest problem is NOT at the SG positions. SF and C is an issue so far. Green is terrible at the moment!

     

    [/QUOTE]


    My hat is off to you, Sir, for putting together a wonderful post: clear, well thought out, and easy to follow.

    "You can be considered a hater when you only forcus on the negative aspects (and on top use false arguments).

    You can be considered a fanboy when you only look at the positive aspects (see above)."

    I am in complete agreement with you on most things.  According to your definations do the folks here who demand that you only post positive things about the Celtics qualify as fanboys?

    -

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to puddinpuddin's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Ray's averaging 28min/game at this point in the season.

    Last year he averaged 34min/game and ranged from 34 to 36.5min/game during his tenure in Beantown.

    Prior to Boston, he was in the high 30's to low 40's per game every season.

    The Heat should limit him to 18-20minutes/game and keep him fresh for the PO's.

    Considering that he will be carrying less of a load in Miami and getting a lot of open looks, he has a better chance of staying healthy there than here.... and a lot more productive too.

    KG and PP should be envious of RA's situation of being able to play less and do more.

    Pud

    [/QUOTE]

    RayRay tonight. An efficient 17 points, 6-12 from the field, 3-5 from downtown. 2 TO, 1 Reb, 1 dime. 24 min.

    Lee (6) and JET (13)  tonight a combined 47 minutes, 19 points. Not nearly so efficient.

    Anyone else missing RA yet?

    Pud

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from darkman20. Show darkman20's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to Gasthoerer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You can be considered a hater when you only forcus on the negative aspects (and on top use fals arguments).

    You can be considered a fanboy when you only look at the positive aspects (see above).

    1. Ray will not going to shot the same number like in the first 3 games. Terry and Lee will come around.

    2. Ray was better than either Terry or Lee last year and without an injury it is not unlikely similiar this year.

    3. Ray was always a starter and Star player. Lee is a journeyman and Terry was always a benchplayer (a great one though) --> There is a reason for that.

    4. Terry NEVER was a better defense player than Ray. He is not focused and too small. Check what Doc said after what was a good defensive game of Terry: Celtics coach Doc Rivers said: “And, you know, it’s funny, we left Jason in because he was playing great defense. That may be a first in his career that that’s ever been said about Jason Terry. ..."

    5. Both Lee and Terry (and AB as well) are not better rebounders than Ray.

    6. Lee (and AB) is not a better ball handler than Ray (Terry only a little).

    7. Ray is not a turnover machine --> I proved that with facts several time.

    8. Ray's defense is underappreciated --> prove last playoffs.

    9. Over a long season: Terry & Lee & Allen might be better than Allen & AB due too the risc of injury --> but if healthy it might be the other way around.

    10. Our biggest problem is NOT at the SG positions. SF and C is an issue so far. Green is terrible at the moment!

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Great post.  But wasted on Ray Allen haters.  To them, 1 turnover by Ray equals 5.  If he misses a shot, he's all washup and needs to be traded immediately.   

    They won't even admit this simple truth:  The Celtics always started strong during the Ray Allen era.  

    So why the slow start this year? What's different now?  Simple: No Ray Allen.

    But they will never admit it; they will come up with this excuse and that exuse instead of the obvious: No Ray Allen.   Off course, now that Jeff Green has been thrown to the wolves, they now have their hopes on their other savior= Avery Bradly.  LOL  Sorry but it's simple delusion to think Avery Bradly will be the difference maker for Title contention...he will always be simply a role player at best; use as a diffensive stopper.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to rameakap's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Again, its not how you start but how you finish

    snake your posts are spot on as always

    And I'll post this a second time... but through 4 games last season Ray was avergaing 20 points and 58/58/100... he entered January doing that. Then in 17 games in January he shot 55% from 3 and avg'd under 2 turnovers a game.

    and it was all downhill from there...

    He is a career 45/40 shooter but as a Celtic his last 4 years, in his mid 30's, he was a 47/42 shooter... that is what I expect from him in Miami if he is healthy.. even a few ticks more b/c he will get better looks... so 48/45 maybe.

    So what are the better odds?

    A. That he shoots 48/45 over the whole year and at some point deals with an injury, or a shooting slump... and Miami will be holding their breath its not in the playoffs

    or

    B. That he shoots 59/59 all year, or even 50% from either the 2 or the 3, and is run 28 mins a game and there are no issues for his 37 year old body?

    He lost his job to Avery and pouted, he wanted no part of beign a decoy or playing here off the bench anymore... so he took 50% of the $ to go elsewhere. What are we complaining about?

    At the end of the year if Terry and Lee shoot their career averages they will have combined to be FAR better than what Ray gave us off the bench at the end of the year last year... in a role he refused to be in this year.

    [/QUOTE]
    Ray was a great addition to the Celtics the year that they won the championship.  Although, I always thought that if the Celtics had acquired KG before they did, without Ray, they still could have been a championship caliber team.  I was always surprised that KG stayed with Minn.  He was always very loyal to his franchise, something that doesn't exist anymore.  If the Celtics had added KG about 5 years before they did, they just needed another good shooter.  If I remember correctly, the reaon the Celtics won the championship was because of KG and Pierce.  I never thought of Ray as the difference maker.  It would have been nice to see KG win a few more championships, if not with the Celtics, with some other team.   Does anyone agree with me?   

     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to COMMIE-CONTRARIAN's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to susan250's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rameakap's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Again, its not how you start but how you finish

    snake your posts are spot on as always

    And I'll post this a second time... but through 4 games last season Ray was avergaing 20 points and 58/58/100... he entered January doing that. Then in 17 games in January he shot 55% from 3 and avg'd under 2 turnovers a game.

    and it was all downhill from there...

     

    NO! not on this susan.. ray was nearly the mvp of that series and he was the one making countless late game daggers. minus ray, we dont win a ring! he was that good.. kg was often the 

    He is a career 45/40 shooter but as a Celtic his last 4 years, in his mid 30's, he was a 47/42 shooter... that is what I expect from him in Miami if he is healthy.. even a few ticks more b/c he will get better looks... so 48/45 maybe.

    So what are the better odds?

    A. That he shoots 48/45 over the whole year and at some point deals with an injury, or a shooting slump... and Miami will be holding their breath its not in the playoffs

    or

    B. That he shoots 59/59 all year, or even 50% from either the 2 or the 3, and is run 28 mins a game and there are no issues for his 37 year old body?

    He lost his job to Avery and pouted, he wanted no part of beign a decoy or playing here off the bench anymore... so he took 50% of the $ to go elsewhere. What are we complaining about?

    At the end of the year if Terry and Lee shoot their career averages they will have combined to be FAR better than what Ray gave us off the bench at the end of the year last year... in a role he refused to be in this year.

    [/QUOTE]
    Ray was a great addition to the Celtics the year that they won the championship.  Although, I always thought that if the Celtics had acquired KG before they did, without Ray, they still could have been a championship caliber team.  I was always surprised that KG stayed with Minn.  He was always very loyal to his franchise, something that doesn't exist anymore.  If the Celtics had added KG about 5 years before they did, they just needed another good shooter.  If I remember correctly, the reaon the Celtics won the championship was because of KG and Pierce.  I never thought of Ray as the difference maker.  It would have been nice to see KG win a few more championships, if not with the Celtics, with some other team.   Does anyone agree with me?   

    [/QUOTE] NO! UR MISREMEMBERING THINGS ON THIS susan. ray was nearly the mvp of that series. kg was often the third wheel on offense, remember? doc always says that ray made the most sacrifices. plus he played pretty good defense, everyone remarked at how good his d was,. a healthy ray is still a deadly ray! we dont win that ring without RAY! period!


    [/QUOTE]
    Thanks for responding to me.  I just wonder if anyone else has any thoughts on my original post. 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to susan250's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Ray was a great addition to the Celtics the year that they won the championship.  Although, I always thought that if the Celtics had acquired KG before they did, without Ray, they still could have been a championship caliber team.  I was always surprised that KG stayed with Minn.  He was always very loyal to his franchise, something that doesn't exist anymore.  If the Celtics had added KG about 5 years before they did, they just needed another good shooter.  If I remember correctly, the reaon the Celtics won the championship was because of KG and Pierce.  I never thought of Ray as the difference maker.  It would have been nice to see KG win a few more championships, if not with the Celtics, with some other team.   Does anyone agree with me?   

    [/QUOTE]

    Paul Pierce was the biggest reason why the Celts won the 2008 title.  And Ray Allen had to make the greatest sacrifice, yes.  Which basically means that the Celts rode the defense, anchored by KG and Perkins, and an offense anchored by Paul Pierce.  Posey was a key versatile contributor to both.  Eddie House provided his moments.  Ray did his part by playing decent defense and making the required offensive contributions.  In the large scheme, Ray was the 3rd. most significant contributor but not by much over Posey.

    I am not a Ray hater.  I think that Ray made the best decision for himself as a player and not for financial reasons.  I have kept quiet about the back and forth sniping that has gone on between him and the Celts. He is a good fit in Miami and he makes Miami very strong.  But I also believe that Ray on the Celts would not be as effective.

    Much as I remember Ray for his killer shooting, I also remember him getting abused by Wade. I remember him for his poor and scared finish of fast breaks, trying to aviod blocks from behind, poor spacing and missing the layups.  Ray's great game 7 against the Lakers in 2008 must be balanced against his scared performance against Miami in 2010 and 2011.  Ray is thriving in Miami as a 4th option behind LeBron, Wade and Bosh.  These three are a stronger combination than KG, Pierce and Rondo.  On the Celtics, Ray would not have been as effective.

    So what is the problem here?  I don't get it.  Ray left twice the money to go to a situation where he will fit better as a player.  Did Danny try to keep him?  He did.  Would Ray have stayed if he had a better relationship with Rondo and if he was not shopped around?  No one can predict that.  Why would Ray have sacrificed the chance to play on a championship team and maximize his contributions at this point in his career?  Did the Celts need to explore options at 2?  Absolutely.  When and where will they find the solution is not yet known.  But status quo was definitely not an option.

    Change happens.  The Celts have to search for a new identity.  That is irrespective of Ray.  Lets just remember Ray for his past contributions, treat him as a member of the enemy now and root for the Celts.  In 2007 the Celts got Posey because of the circumstances.  In 2012, Miami got Ray because of the circumstances.  It time to stop bashing Danny and Rondo for this.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: RAY: 63% from the field, 56% from 3... it was a WISE choice!

    In response to darkman20's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Gasthoerer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    You can be considered a hater when you only forcus on the negative aspects (and on top use fals arguments).

    You can be considered a fanboy when you only look at the positive aspects (see above).

    1. Ray will not going to shot the same number like in the first 3 games. Terry and Lee will come around.

    2. Ray was better than either Terry or Lee last year and without an injury it is not unlikely similiar this year.

    3. Ray was always a starter and Star player. Lee is a journeyman and Terry was always a benchplayer (a great one though) --> There is a reason for that.

    4. Terry NEVER was a better defense player than Ray. He is not focused and too small. Check what Doc said after what was a good defensive game of Terry: Celtics coach Doc Rivers said: â€ÂÂÂœAnd, you know, it’s funny, we left Jason in because he was playing great defense. That may be a first in his career that that’s ever been said about Jason Terry. ..."

    5. Both Lee and Terry (and AB as well) are not better rebounders than Ray.

    6. Lee (and AB) is not a better ball handler than Ray (Terry only a little).

    7. Ray is not a turnover machine --> I proved that with facts several time.

    8. Ray's defense is underappreciated --> prove last playoffs.

    9. Over a long season: Terry & Lee & Allen might be better than Allen & AB due too the risc of injury --> but if healthy it might be the other way around.

    10. Our biggest problem is NOT at the SG positions. SF and C is an issue so far. Green is terrible at the moment!

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Great post.  But wasted on Ray Allen haters.  To them, 1 turnover by Ray equals 5.  If he misses a shot, he's all washup and needs to be traded immediately.   

    They won't even admit this simple truth:  The Celtics always started strong during the Ray Allen era.  

    So why the slow start this year? What's different now?  Simple: No Ray Allen.

    But they will never admit it; they will come up with this excuse and that exuse instead of the obvious: No Ray Allen.   Off course, now that Jeff Green has been thrown to the wolves, they now have their hopes on their other savior= Avery Bradly.  LOL  Sorry but it's simple delusion to think Avery Bradly will be the difference maker for Title contention...he will always be simply a role player at best; use as a diffensive stopper.

    [/QUOTE]


     

    It's hard to tell whether you are serious or not, by the end of February last year the Celtics were 17 and 17 with ray allen.  this year they are starting 3 and 3 without Ray Allen.  I dont know if you can figure that out without a calculator but its the same winning percentage.

     

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