Tainted Championship

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from TeamUmbutu. Show TeamUmbutu's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    I have to say that like one or two other Celtic fans on this board I am still considering ever watching the NBA again.  I thought that I would wait a few days to see how I felt about the league and how it conducts itself.

    For years, I have teased one of my son in laws about watching professional wrestling. "How can you watch that stuff, it is scripted".

    I have concluded that I am the one who is the dupe. At least with professional wrestling, they don't try to hide the scripting. At least with professional wrestling people watch it and know that is a show, and not a sporting event.

    I am not referring just to game seven, or any other game specifically, but rather the entire play-offs this year. Many games were hard to watch. There is no other sport that referees can have such a great influence on the game as in NBA basketball. Systematic game calling changes occurred at various and unexpected times. Referees that always call games loosely called games very tightly. Star calls were over the top, and free throws decided games, and series.

    So the question that I really have to answer is: Do I really want to watch professional wrestling?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jofc. Show jofc's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    I would be very interested to see a breakdown of the 4th quarter calls. 

    I've heard a lot of Celtics fans complaining about them being unfair, but haven't heard very many examples.  The main one I've heard about was the Ray Allen/Kobe foul.  Although replay showed Ray Allen hit not just one, but both arms.

    A big difference though, is that guys like Wallace, Davis and Perkins paint a picture of being wronged with each and every call.  Wallace went SCREAMING up and down the court a couple times after, what replay showed to be, clear fouls. 

    It's not like he doesn't know...I think he does it to paint the picture that the Celtics are being victimized.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    Lakers/Kings 2002  NBA rigged
    Posted by Karllost


    That definitely was one of the worst officiated playoff series in NBA history. 
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jofc. Show jofc's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    I'm definitely get where you're coming from.  I felt that way after game 2 in 2008.  Game 6 was almost a relief...to know that the refs really hadn't hurt LA...that Boston was genuinely the better team.  So i understand 100% where you're coming from.

    I'd like to almost do a breakdown though...to see if it really was slanted one way or the other.  The only reason I say that is...I have some really sensible friends, who are Lakers fans...and they honestly thought that the officiating went from fair to slightly biased against LA. 

    I'm saying this because...they really are sensible people.  I think fan bias hits people strongly and distorts perception...but sometimes the calls really are slanted.  I honestly don't know what the situation is with game 7. 

    I'd like to review it...or have someone post here.  If it's so controversial, why not examine it?  Could be really, really intriguing.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from hedleylamarr. Show hedleylamarr's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship


    As I have stated previously, I don't think there is a conspiracy.  However, the TREND since the 1970's has been this:

    In the NBA, more than any other league, the home team usually wins close games.

    The reasons for this could be varied.  Officials control the games, they are intimidated by the home crowd, there's so many calls they get to pick and choose. 
    I was very concerned before the playoffs started that NOT having home court would come back and bite the Celtics. And it did.

    NOT saying it's rigged, or the refs gave the lakers the game, I'm just saying that over a long period of time, since the 70's, the home team in the NBA has won, like, 70% of the games.  Largest disparity in all of sports.

    Makes me angry that we gave away so many games to the Clips, Nets, Knicks et al of the world.......think there were EIGHT games we could have won?  That would give us a better record than LA.

    I also know, living out here, that LA fans were actually rooting for the Celtics to win because it was the only way they would have home court in the Finals.

    I do not know what is THERE, but I do know there is SOMETHING there!!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driscoll92587. Show Driscoll92587's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    I'm definitely get where you're coming from.  I felt that way after game 2 in 2008.  Game 6 was almost a relief...to know that the refs really hadn't hurt LA...that Boston was genuinely the better team.  So i understand 100% where you're coming from. I'd like to almost do a breakdown though...to see if it really was slanted one way or the other.  The only reason I say that is...I have some really sensible friends, who are Lakers fans...and they honestly thought that the officiating went from fair to slightly biased against LA.  I'm saying this because...they really are sensible people.  I think fan bias hits people strongly and distorts perception...but sometimes the calls really are slanted.  I honestly don't know what the situation is with game 7.  I'd like to review it...or have someone post here.  If it's so controversial, why not examine it?  Could be really, really intriguing.
    Posted by jofc


    I agree since I'm still going off of what I saw as a C's fan in game 7, and not as a neutral fan of basketball.  I've started glancing over the game during my down time and watching each play where:

    1) There was a foul called
    2) There may have been contact on a shot
    3) Every drive by either team

    I haven't made it every far yet since I just started this yesterday after i could muster up the courage to review the game, but I want to see how the final score would change given the discrepancy in no calls and bad calls.  If the no call would have resulted in FT's, then 1-2 pts would be added to the score depending on the player shooting.  Also, I want to tally the number of missed calls and see who actually received the benefit of the doubt.  These will be given a 1, 2, or 3 for  an easy, medium, or hard call to make.  So any hard calls would be void. 
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    The very fact that the refereeing is such a major issue, is reason enough to watch sports that are not so referee dependant. For the NBA to overcome its credibility problems, It would have to have an independent referee system, and simplify some rules to allow or disallow some types of contact, and better define charges and blocks.
    Posted by TeamUmbutu


    Theres no way to improve on the current refs.. theyre corrupt.  Cant even use replay reviews cause it'll slow the game and what about "no-calls"? How can you stop a team thats breaking off missed shot when you want to review if he was fouled or not?

    One possible solution (although not bullet proff) is players/league agree on a 3rd party in charge of refs... was great when we had replacement refs.. all of a sudden the star calls werent happening. you actually got pretty good reffing...

    anyone else wonder why that was when the NBA refs werent there?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from TeamUmbutu. Show TeamUmbutu's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    The very fact that the refereeing is such a major issue, is reason enough to watch sports that are not so referee dependant.

    For the NBA to overcome its credibility problems, It would have to have an independent referee system, and simplify some rules to allow or disallow some types of contact, and better define charges and blocks.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    There are people that still cant acknowledge the 2002 Kings/Lakers game as being corrupt. Lets face it, it you can sit and watch that game and still spin on behalf of the refs, then its senseless having a dialogue with you.

    Maybe refs dont determine for sure the winner of the game... but they certainly called fouls and set the tone so as the Lakers had many advantages.. and gave them every chance to win the title, especially the forth qtr.

    Examine the forth qtr... all through the game the FTs were close... all of a sudden in the forth qtr, everything changed.. What happened, both teams changed their style?? lol  Game was being played the same way it had the first 3 qtrs.. a gritty game, poor FG shooting on both sides.

    Then the refs decided to blow the whistle differently and in favor of the Lakers.. Sure the Lakers were attacking the rim.. but they were doing that all game long.

    Also, the Celtics werent getting legit Laker fouls called.. like KGs layup "blocked" by Gasol when it was clear on replay Gasol smacked KGs arm... ya know what??? The refs didnt miss one call like that against the C's in the 4th!!

    This game wasnt as bad as the Kings/Lakers 2002.. nothing may ever approach that game, but it was in the vicinity..

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from MartiniLover248. Show MartiniLover248's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : Keep posting this garbage all you want, but why don't you try proving me wrong with some intelligent discussion instead?
    Posted by Driscoll92587


    If I want intelligent conversation regarding basketball, I look elsewhere.  This isn't where one finds it.  This is where one finds a bunch of children crying that their team didn't win and trying to blame it on outside forces.  There is one reason and one reason only that the Lakers beat the celtics.  They were the better team.  That's it.  End of intelligent conversation.  It wasn't because of the refs, the injuries, the NBA conspiracies.  This is all a bunch of garbage.  So whine away, celtic fans, whine away.  Whine and cry and bemoan and we will be having a parade once again in the City of Angels.  It's a very, very good day.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Tainted Championship:
    I know as sports fans the breaks are not supposed to be taken into account when a team loses. I know we should have won despite the horrendous advantage given to LA in the 4th quarter by the refs.  I know that bad reffing is just part of the game but really folks this takes the cake.  The lakers took 21 foul shots in the 4th quarter to 6 for the Celtics. They took 20 more for the game. What had been called fairly evenly for the entire game became totally one sided in the 4th. Gasol blocked Garnett...nope clearly a foul on Gasol. Gasol gets rebound over Rondo...when the announcers said Gasol might of gotten away with one there...they were right it was a huge uncalled foul. Garnett fouls Kobe....nope a real block. Pierce hacked by Kobe...nope he just lost the ball...even Kobe started to put his hand up on that one....Artest fouled by Pierce...should have been offensive or better yet no call as Artest had dipped his shoulder into Pierce just like all the no calls made the whole game when Kobe and Pierce did it. Gasol went up and down...nope not called. 20 more foul shots....21 foul shots in the 4th quarter..what does it mean.... It means the refs stole this from the Celtics and the lakers won a tainted championship.
    Posted by gtown07


    Let see, gtown. Now that you can't blame dudder or pud for Rondo's less than stellar play, whom do you blame? Gotta be somebody! Hey, why not...........

    The refs!!! 

    What a bad loser you are.

    We got ouplayed. Plain and simple.

    Pud
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driscoll92587. Show Driscoll92587's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : If I want intelligent conversation regarding basketball, I look elsewhere.  This isn't where one finds it.  This is where one finds a bunch of children crying that their team didn't win and trying to blame it on outside forces.  There is one reason and one reason only that the Lakers beat the celtics.  They were the better team.  That's it.  End of intelligent conversation.  It wasn't because of the refs, the injuries, the NBA conspiracies.  This is all a bunch of garbage.  So whine away, celtic fans, whine away.  Whine and cry and bemoan and we will be having a parade once again in the City of Angels.  It's a very, very good day.
    Posted by MartiniLover666


    I guarantee I know more about ball then you do or would ever know.  You're simply a pestering little human who seems to have nothing better to do than come onto a forum and annoy people.  I have yet to see you post anything besides pointless jabbing and ridicule.  You seem more like the type of person who like the Lakers because they wear your favorite colors, all the while not knowing your *ss from your elbow when it comes to the sport.  But to each his own, have fun with the parade.  Hope your classy fans don't flip any floats or light anything on fire.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from jofc. Show jofc's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : If I want intelligent conversation regarding basketball, I look elsewhere.  This isn't where one finds it.  This is where one finds a bunch of children crying that their team didn't win and trying to blame it on outside forces.  There is one reason and one reason only that the Lakers beat the celtics.  They were the better team.  That's it.  End of intelligent conversation.  It wasn't because of the refs, the injuries, the NBA conspiracies.  This is all a bunch of garbage.  So whine away, celtic fans, whine away.  Whine and cry and bemoan and we will be having a parade once again in the City of Angels.  It's a very, very good day.
    Posted by MartiniLover666


    Let's be fair though.  There are a lot of Celtics fans that come here and discuss things rationally and maturely.  Driscoll happens to be one of them. 

    Yes, there has been an overabundance of complaining.  Some posters are literally throwing temper tantrums on these boards.  But really, the bulk of the Lakers fans here are just as juvenile.  You have about 10% of the Lakers fans who come here to discuss things, and then 90% to post garbage. 

    Saying that you'd look elsewhere for intelligent conversation is somewhat ironic if you're contribution to the overall degradation of these forums.  That's akin to me walking into a library, screaming, and then complaining that the library is too loud.

    If you want intelligent conversation here, then participate.  You'll find a good amount of people willing to discuss things on an intellectual leve...but by coming here and doing little more than gloating, you put yourself on the same level as the Celtics fans you're complaining about.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    Can we get over this. They lost complaining and saying there is a conspiracy just makes us as fans look like sore losers. For me im looking forward to how we are going to reload and try to get back to the finals.
    Posted by uncommon13


    Thats nice, but whats it really matter to you if other have complaints that they feel strongly about? 
     
    Since when is it that only certain opinions are acceptable.. Anyone that has a gripe about the officiating also has plenty of company... Why do you think that is?  Are the people complaining about the refs here so alone in their thoughts?

    No, its been happening for some time and was on full display during the finals and earlier.  Its a legitimate gripe shared by many but you feel offended or cheapened as a fan because of it.

    I dont recall the Celtic fans griping last year in the playoffs... like they have this year.  Why not?  Take a guess
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from uncommon13. Show uncommon13's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    Can we get over this. They lost complaining and saying there is a conspiracy just makes us as fans look like sore losers. For me im looking forward to how we are going to reload and try to get back to the finals.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from uncommon13. Show uncommon13's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : Thats nice, but whats it really matter to you if other have complaints that they feel strongly about?    Since when is it that only certain opinions are acceptable.. Anyone that has a gripe about the officiating also has plenty of company... Why do you think that is?  Are the people complaining about the refs here so alone in their thoughts? No, its been happening for some time and was on full display during the finals and earlier.  Its a legitimate gripe shared by many but you feel offended or cheapened as a fan because of it. I dont recall the Celtic fans griping last year in the playoffs... like they have this year.  Why not?  Take a guess
    Posted by Karllost



    Im willing to bet we had some fans complaining last year. I know I will get called a troll for what im about to say. But after EVERY and I mean EVERY loss by the Celtics, Red Sox or Patriots NE fans always say it was someone elses fault. Whether its the refs, the weather, the hot dog vendor whatever it may be. Could it be maybe we just got beat? I watched every second of the finals and the entire season for that matter. I played basketball threw high school and I coach it now. Why didnt I have a problem with the way game 7 was called? What I saw was one team attacking the rim and another being passive and taking jump shots. The Celtics were tired and you could see it. Explain to me what calls the C's should have gotten. The fouls I see people having the most problem with are the Kobe 3 and Artests 3 point play. The Kobe play IS a foul by rule. I have seen Pierce, Kobe, James, Wade, Rashard Lewis and so on get the same call. Do I like the call? No, not at all its the offensive player causing the contact. But by the rules its a foul. The Artest lay up/4 footer was a foul. He got hit on the body while shooting. I will end on this. Do you think there would be half as many threads complaining if the Celtics had held on?
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from jofc. Show jofc's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : Im willing to bet we had some fans complaining last year. I know I will get called a troll for what im about to say. But after EVERY and I mean EVERY loss by the Celtics, Red Sox or Patriots NE fans always say it was someone elses fault. Whether its the refs, the weather, the hot dog vendor whatever it may be. Could it be maybe we just got beat? I watched every second of the finals and the entire season for that matter. I played basketball threw high school and I coach it now. Why didnt I have a problem with the way game 7 was called? What I saw was one team attacking the rim and another being passive and taking jump shots. The Celtics were tired and you could see it. Explain to me what calls the C's should have gotten. The fouls I see people having the most problem with are the Kobe 3 and Artests 3 point play. The Kobe play IS a foul by rule. I have seen Pierce, Kobe, James, Wade, Rashard Lewis and so on get the same call. Do I like the call? No, not at all its the offensive player causing the contact. But by the rules its a foul. The Artest lay up/4 footer was a foul. He got hit on the body while shooting. I will end on this. Do you think there would be half as many threads complaining if the Celtics had held on?
    Posted by uncommon13


    TROLL!!!!!  Hehe. 

    Sounds like you and I come from a similar fanbase.  You're a brave man.  I wish more fans, on both sides of the fence, approached the game as you do. 

    Unfortunately, the 'voice of reason' is often drowned out in times like this.



     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driscoll92587. Show Driscoll92587's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : Thats nice, but whats it really matter to you if other have complaints that they feel strongly about?    Since when is it that only certain opinions are acceptable.. Anyone that has a gripe about the officiating also has plenty of company... Why do you think that is?  Are the people complaining about the refs here so alone in their thoughts? No, its been happening for some time and was on full display during the finals and earlier.  Its a legitimate gripe shared by many but you feel offended or cheapened as a fan because of it. I dont recall the Celtic fans griping last year in the playoffs... like they have this year.  Why not?  Take a guess
    Posted by Karllost


    Absolutely correct.

    The 2009 season had very, VERY little to do with the officiating being a cause for concern among fans of any team.  Each series seemed decently officiated and even across the board.  This post season, we've witnessed some of the worst calls in NBA postseason history.  From Perkins double techs, to the awful call by joey crawford in the Blazers-Suns game in crucial minutes, to Kevin Durant's Free Throws being giftwrapped and given to him all series long in LA.

    It just seems that the ref's are getting worse and worse.  Time for a change.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : Im willing to bet we had some fans complaining last year. I know I will get called a troll for what im about to say. But after EVERY and I mean EVERY loss by the Celtics, Red Sox or Patriots NE fans always say it was someone elses fault. Whether its the refs, the weather, the hot dog vendor whatever it may be. Could it be maybe we just got beat? I watched every second of the finals and the entire season for that matter. I played basketball threw high school and I coach it now. Why didnt I have a problem with the way game 7 was called? What I saw was one team attacking the rim and another being passive and taking jump shots. The Celtics were tired and you could see it. Explain to me what calls the C's should have gotten. The fouls I see people having the most problem with are the Kobe 3 and Artests 3 point play. The Kobe play IS a foul by rule. I have seen Pierce, Kobe, James, Wade, Rashard Lewis and so on get the same call. Do I like the call? No, not at all its the offensive player causing the contact. But by the rules its a foul. The Artest lay up/4 footer was a foul. He got hit on the body while shooting. I will end on this. Do you think there would be half as many threads complaining if the Celtics had held on?
    Posted by uncommon13


    did you notice anybody retracting their opinions of how the refs had called this series and previous series when we were leading the Lakers 3-2? so the C's were winning yet the complaints continued on. Must be pretty bad reffing when u complain when u win...

    We eliminated Orlando yet the officiating was attrocious. I mean, do you watch these games?

    There were plenty of calls the C's should have gotten in the 7th game and others, there were plenty of calls the Lakers got away with murder... do you think Im going to check out the replays so you can have an itenized list? No.


     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from futbal. Show futbal's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    http://www.82games.com/lakerskingsgame6.htm

    Interesting read...maybe this guy will do the same for game 7 of this series.

    Until then, I'll leave you all with a question: who is the sneakier troll; the one who wants to reason you into shutting up, or the one who won't shut up?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    Interesting how people think Kobe is MVP cause he was a workhorse. Yea, by choice and not very efficient either.

    Kobe wasnt the workhorse because Phil designed it that way... Kobe took it upon himself to dominate the ball and hoist up very poor shots, over & over... He missed a significant % of them too... and imo was responsible for almost giving the title to the Celtics because of his selfish ways.  

    It took Phil to finally tell Kobe in game 7....STOP! 

    Now everyone looks at Kobes line.. 28 points but at what cost?? 6-24 shooting and shots so poor that it allowed Boston to break on the awful misses and forge a good lead.

    His only breakout game... where he still shot under 50% and the Lakers lost was game 5. 

    Not an MVP.. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : The Celtics are a great defensive team, so good they made the Lakers play their game if they wanted to win. Well, you take that great defensive team, and you use it to focus on stopping Kobe first and foremost, you are going to slow down his offense. He was playing 1 on 3 for most of the series, and the Celtics did a phenomenal job of trapping him to the point he had no where to go but to jack up a bad shot.  First, he garnered that attention from the Celtic defense because he is that good'. Second, basketball is not only about offensive efficiency. Kobe struggled on offense in game 7, but 15 boards from a guard? Kobe was going to be named the MVP even if the Lakers lost. All the bitter feelings you are expressing would not change that.
    Posted by Bobbarcker


    Thanks for the response only I dont know what point youre trying to make.

    Lakers dont pay Kobe to rebound and his bad shooting was many times the result of good 1on1 defense by Ray and TA.

    and if I wanted to use your rationale that Kobe was playing 1 on 3, then it shows how inept he really is that he would continue to pump up horrible shots being guarded by 3 defenders.

    and if the Celts did such a phenomenal job of trapping him to the point he had no where to go but to jack up a bad shot... then youre making my point that Kobe as ineffective and a liability
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bobbarcker. Show Bobbarcker's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    Interesting how people think Kobe is MVP cause he was a workhorse. Yea, by choice and not very efficient either. Kobe wasnt the workhorse because Phil designed it that way... Kobe took it upon himself to dominate the ball and hoist up very poor shots, over & over... He missed a significant % of them too... and imo was responsible for almost giving the title to the Celtics because of his selfish ways.   It took Phil to finally tell Kobe in game 7....STOP!  Now everyone looks at Kobes line.. 28 points but at what cost?? 6-24 shooting and shots so poor that it allowed Boston to break on the awful misses and forge a good lead. His only breakout game... where he still shot under 50% and the Lakers lost was game 5.  Not an MVP.. 
    Posted by Karllost


    The Celtics are a great defensive team, so good they made the Lakers play their game if they wanted to win. Well, you take that great defensive team, and you use it to focus on stopping Kobe first and foremost, you are going to slow down his offense. He was playing 1 on 3 for most of the series, and the Celtics did a phenomenal job of trapping him to the point he had no where to go but to jack up a bad shot. 

    First, he garnered that attention from the Celtic defense because he is that good'. Second, basketball is not only about offensive efficiency. Kobe struggled on offense in game 7, but 15 boards from a guard? Kobe was going to be named the MVP even if the Lakers lost. All the bitter feelings you are expressing would not change that.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from GREEN-KILLER-SWEET-16. Show GREEN-KILLER-SWEET-16's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    Karllost still lost after the beat down. LET IT GO KARLLOST YOU LOST.
    SWEET THREE PEAT LOADING...
    LET THE DYNASTY REIGN!!!!!!!!!!!!
    GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO DYNASTY!!!!!!!!!!
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from futbal. Show futbal's posts

    Re: Tainted Championship

    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship:
    In Response to Re: Tainted Championship : The Celtics are a great defensive team, so good they made the Lakers play their game if they wanted to win. Well, you take that great defensive team, and you use it to focus on stopping Kobe first and foremost, you are going to slow down his offense. He was playing 1 on 3 for most of the series, and the Celtics did a phenomenal job of trapping him to the point he had no where to go but to jack up a bad shot.  First, he garnered that attention from the Celtic defense because he is that good'. Second, basketball is not only about offensive efficiency. Kobe struggled on offense in game 7, but 15 boards from a guard? Kobe was going to be named the MVP even if the Lakers lost. All the bitter feelings you are expressing would not change that.
    Posted by Bobbarcker

    I agree with much of what you said; Kobe was very good at getting the ball to a teamate when the trap was on...something Paul Pierce struggles with (as did I when I played, it's no fun being smothered). But I agree with Karllost as well, at other times Kobe was just chucking em up from everywhere when he should have just passed the ball. As to who would be MVP if the Celtics won, we will never know; as to bitter feelings of some Celtics fans, why not cut people some slack, you're team won...
     

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