Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Look, I loved Harrison, Bruschi and Vrabel. But those guys had lost so much that they were reall starting to hurt the defense regardless of the leadership. Seymour? Well, if you are going to run the 4-3 and you have three DT's (Wilfork, Warren and Seymour) you obviously are better served trading the oldest one, especially when he is on the last year of his deal.

    So I predict that at the end of the year, this will be the best D we have seen in Foxboro since Ted Washington was eating people in 2003. They are young, fast and hungry. Just a gut feeling. Plus, our starting corners didn't star in Time Bandits.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from carawaydj. Show carawaydj's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    I say put a season under their (new guys) belt and I might agree with you.  Saying so at this point isn't predicting, it's outright guessing and hoping :^)
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]I say put a season under their (new guys) belt and I might agree with you.  Saying so at this point isn't predicting, it's outright guessing and hoping :^)
    Posted by carawaydj[/QUOTE]

    That's probably the same thing you would have said in 2003 when we cut Milloy, lost Colvin in game 2 for the year, Vrabel broke his arm, and we were forced to play untested rookies like Asante Samuel, Eugene Wilson and Ty Warren. Just saying that I get the same feeling this year.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fenwayfaith. Show Fenwayfaith's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    I like the prediction...The D-Line is still very good.  Mayo, Guyton, Thomas need to play big.  We're solid at the Safeties & we have our 2 best corners we've had in recent years.  I'll run with that prediction.  Of course we're hoping, but that's why it's a PREDICTION!
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Well at least we won't have any rookies starting at D this season, unless Brace or Pryor fill in on the D-Line, but that's probably the easiest position for a rookie to learn.  The way I see our defenders:

    Elite:  Wilfork
    Very Good:  Warren, Green, Thomas
    Good:  Merriweather, Mayo, Wright
    Adequate:  Sanders
    Unproven in our system:  Burgess, Springs, Bodden
    Unproven in NFL:  Wilhite, Guyton, Wheatley, Chung, Butler, Brace, Pryor 
    Sub-par:  Woods, Alexander, McGowan, TBC, Ninkovich

    We only have 4 very good/elite defenders, and 3 are on the D-Line.  Merriweather and Mayo may blossom this year.  We've got 5 unproven starters and 5 unproven backups, and 5 sub-par backups.  In sum ... this D is nothing like 2003.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    And our only elite defender is ineffective in passing situations, our greatest weakness.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from FOWLER8196. Show FOWLER8196's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    i like this thread. its not so doom and gloom as the other threads about our defense this year. i personally think that our defense will not be as good as 2003, however... i do believe that this defense is better than the 2007 defense by a long shot. with tom brady coming back, and upgrades on the offensive side of the ball we could be seeing another high flying offensive football team (see 2007). with this defense (as opposed to 2007) i think we have a much better shot at another title this year.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49Patriots. Show 49Patriots's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    It might be, but that's if the Pass rush can get to the QB. I have full faith in the Patriots' defense. What scares me is the lack of pressure. I love Merriweather out there, he has hands of Reed (Ed Reed) and can hit like Taylor (Sean Taylor), Sanders learned from Rodney and Bill is always talking about how much he would love to have 53 of him. Bodden looks good to me, Wilhite will be better than Asante Samuel in the very near future, Guyton is a speed demon (runs the 40 in 4.45. That's the fastest time for any active LB, I believe.) Mayo is the future franchise guy, Adalius was a beast before his injury last year, and the D-line has always been the corp of guys that I'm the least worried about. If we had Shawn Crable this year play to the potential he has, the Pats' D would've been elite, but we'll have to wait till next year to see. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from superfxb. Show superfxb's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Belicheck and his coaches have a way of getting the best out of players. This D should come together as the season moves on.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Grogan77. Show Grogan77's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Great Post!  I'm tired of hearing all this negativity about the Pats defense.  I also agree about the Pats having their best defense since 2003.  Mayo is going to have a huge impact this season, I expect to see plenty out of Burgess, and A.D. should live up to the hype finally.  I also like what I've seen out of the young guys, especially Butler.  The D will be much faster, but more importantly, the offense will control the clock with Brady and newly added Fred Taylor.  People need to just sit back and watch this defense shine, luckily we won't have long to wait!
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    The only prediction i have about the d is that their red zone d is going to be better this year than last.  I guess when we are second to last, next to detroit, the only way to go is up....lol.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rodimus77. Show Rodimus77's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Its funny how when Bruschi, Harrison, Vrabel and Seymour were with the team, all the so called experts could say was "how old this team is". Now that these players are no longer with the team, all I can hear is "the Patriots lost a lot of all pro players on defense as well as leadership". I don't think we are going to be seeing anymore heartbreaking drives like we all saw in the '06 conference game and the '07 super bowl. These moves had to be done. I really don't think they will be as good as the '03 defense but in a couple of years, they may be even better.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    The same 2003 defense that gave up 19 points in the fourth quarter against Delhomme? 
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from schwank. Show schwank's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]Its funny how when Bruschi, Harrison, Vrabel and Seymour were with the team, all the so called experts could say was "how old this team is". Now that these players are no longer with the team, all I can hear is "the Patriots lost a lot of all pro players on defense as well as leadership". I don't think we are going to be seeing anymore heartbreaking drives like we all saw in the '06 conference game and the '07 super bowl. These moves had to be done. I really don't think they will be as good as the '03 defense but in a couple of years, they may be even better.
    Posted by Rodimus77[/QUOTE]

    You could also add Seau in there as well (even though he's been a part-timer recently).  The common thread in all those names is "speed" or lack there of.  One hopes that this transition eliminates the moniker of "old and slow".  Remember how we aged before our eyes when Raymond Berry coached the team.  (I think we got more years than expected with those names above, to keep them another year would have been really pushing the envelope.)

    On another note, Gaspar's position by position look was troubling as many of the positions were labeled "worse" than last year.  Looks like we're a little thin at LB (Mayo, Thomas, Guyton, Woods, Ninkovich and Alexander). I guess, the "Hybrid" position (Burgess and Tully) you could also count Tully as an LB in a pinch as Burgess is a pure DE.  This position will require monitoring.  But, you know,  on the other hand, they play so many packages these days that they'll likely be in a nickle or dime with DL and Burgess and maybe one LB.  I'm not worried, BB and team are generally on top of this. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from mjxg. Show mjxg's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    I think the "bend but don't break" mentality works somewhat, but it gives us 3 weaknesses:

    1) giving the opposing offense too high of an average YPC in running situations
    2) giving the opposing offense the little dunk passes that go for 6-7 yards a pop
    3) less physicality with the opposing QB

    We do a good job of limiting the big plays once in a while, but the D just needs time to gel to limit and eventually remove those weaknesses.

    When I think of the defense of the Steelers, Ravens, or even the Vikings and Titans of the past two years, one phrase comes to mind.... "angry, pissed off, and mean". When we had Seau sacking the QB with fire and anger, that was the type of passion I'm talking about. When I think of the Pats defense now, words like "angry", "pissed off", "mean", etc. don't come to mind.

    I'm not saying the defense is bad - we have some of the best players in the league in their positions, I'm just saying that the defense doesn't strike the fear and punishment you normally correllate with the best defenses in the league. I can't wait for the day when that does get correllated with us. When the Pats defense comes in breathing fire with one thing in mind...destroy the QB and anyone that gets in between. We have the personnel for it. We have the youth and speed for it. I think at this point it's a mental change that has to happen between the players and the coaches - moreso the coaches. Start calling some crazy stuff. Let the players rip up the offense. Blitz like there's no tomorrow. Get pumped. I want to see the defense on the field fired up and screaming. I want the camera to zoom in on one of our defensive players after a stop and see them yelling with anger and excitement instead of the bland look. You see the look on Ed Reed, James Harrison, or Ray Lewis' face for the pre-game warmup and during the entire game? That's the intensity we need.

    If we have that, our defense IS the best in the league.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from mosseffect43. Show mosseffect43's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    yes it is a bold prediction,but as a fan there isnt anything wrong with makeing it,but i feel we will see the growing pains of the defense this year.we will see the struggles of the new guys grasping the pats playbook ect.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from prairiemike. Show prairiemike's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    I don't have anything of substance to add to this thread, other than to point out that anything that includes an applicable Time Bandits reference is automatically correct.

    Clearly, Caesar1177 is a genius.



     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from patriot54too. Show patriot54too's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]Well at least we won't have any rookies starting at D this season, unless Brace or Pryor fill in on the D-Line, but that's probably the easiest position for a rookie to learn.  The way I see our defenders: Elite:  Wilfork Very Good:  Warren, Green, Thomas Good:  Merriweather, Mayo, Wright Adequate:  Sanders Unproven in our system:  Burgess, Springs, Bodden Unproven in NFL:  Wilhite, Guyton, Wheatley, Chung, Butler, Brace, Pryor  Sub-par:  Woods, Alexander, McGowan, TBC, Ninkovich We only have 4 very good/elite defenders, and 3 are on the D-Line.  Merriweather and Mayo may blossom this year.  We've got 5 unproven starters and 5 unproven backups, and 5 sub-par backups.  In sum ... this D is nothing like 2003.
    Posted by themightypatriotz[/QUOTE]

    I disagree.  I think you are quite a bit off in rating Merriweather & Mayo as Good and not Very Good.  And in the unproven in NFL rating, Wilhite and Guyton do not belong there either.  Bottom line, this Patriots defense is much better than your pessimistic rating.  Ciao
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from mosseffect43. Show mosseffect43's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003 : I disagree.  I think you are quite a bit off in rating Merriweather & Mayo as Good and not Very Good.  And in the unproven in NFL rating, Wilhite and Guyton do not belong there either.  Bottom line, this Patriots defense is much better than your pessimistic rating.  Ciao
    Posted by patriot54too[/QUOTE]
    I dont always agree with mighty,but actually its a good rateing,and realistic,but i also have seen threads like this that he will argue the bend,but dont break theory.it depends on his mood,and what kind of reaction he wants to get.mayo is good,he hasnt played long enough to say he is great if he was to repeat his performance this year,like his first year,then you can say he is great,merriweather hasnt done much as of yet.wilfork,thomas are great,for they have proven it year in,and out.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from dplaye. Show dplaye's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]Look, I loved Harrison, Bruschi and Vrabel. But those guys had lost so much that they were reall starting to hurt the defense regardless of the leadership. Seymour? Well, if you are going to run the 4-3 and you have three DT's (Wilfork, Warren and Seymour) you obviously are better served trading the oldest one, especially when he is on the last year of his deal. So I predict that at the end of the year, this will be the best D we have seen in Foxboro since Ted Washington was eating people in 2003. They are young, fast and hungry. Just a gut feeling. Plus, our starting corners didn't star in Time Bandits.
    Posted by Caesar1177[/QUOTE]
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from dplaye. Show dplaye's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Vince Wilfork is in his last year also and Warren in a DE. Fast and hungry is good but fast,hungry and talented is better. I hope you are right.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Listen5. Show Listen5's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]Well at least we won't have any rookies starting at D this season, unless Brace or Pryor fill in on the D-Line, but that's probably the easiest position for a rookie to learn.  The way I see our defenders: Elite:  Wilfork Very Good:  Warren, Green, Thomas Good:  Merriweather, Mayo, Wright Adequate:  Sanders Unproven in our system:  Burgess, Springs, Bodden Unproven in NFL:  Wilhite, Guyton, Wheatley, Chung, Butler, Brace, Pryor  Sub-par:  Woods, Alexander, McGowan, TBC, Ninkovich We only have 4 very good/elite defenders, and 3 are on the D-Line.  Merriweather and Mayo may blossom this year.  We've got 5 unproven starters and 5 unproven backups, and 5 sub-par backups.  In sum ... this D is nothing like 2003.
    Posted by themightypatriotz[/QUOTE]

    I can not say that I agree with your placement of some of these players; I think that Mayo is in the very good category, and considering that I don't think Wheatley can make it in the NFL as nothing more than a Sub-Sub-Par backup, I think your slotting of him is not accurate. I also think from watching preseason and Chicago Bear games that McGowan is anything but sub-par. He had injury problems and he is the only hitter we have at safety. I read a comparison that Meriweather has hands like Reed, which I guess could be accurate but he doesn't have his spped or his ability to read a quarterback, and that he hits like Taylor??? Sean Taylor was a Ronnie Lott, a Jack Tatum, a guy that always, and I mean always delivered the blows, not a guy who can not tackle, and Meriweather is not a big tackler by any stretch of the imagination...
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from heddy. Show heddy's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    It amazes me that for the last few years everyone has complained the the Pats D needs to get younger and now that they have people are still complaining. With all the defensive departures the only 2 that stand out as costly are Samuel and possibly Seymour. Other than that Eugene Wilson, Willie McGinist, Randall Gay among others are not exactly lighting in up. Seau, Bruschi, Vrabel and Harrison are all past or are very close to past prime (Vrabel) Let's focus on the positive. Maybe Guyton, Alexander, Merriweather and the rest of the kids will crack some heads and make the defense elite. Offense is already there, why not the D....GO PATS
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from themightypatriotz. Show themightypatriotz's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    Mayo has played one season in the NFL.  To get a "very good" you have to show consistent performance that matches the best players at your position for several years in a row.  We've all seen players that do well one year and stink it up the next.  Ditto for Merriweather.  Played well last year but did very little the year before that.  Wheatley is unproven, he's only played a handful of downs in the NFL.  Bodden is definitely unproven, he was statistically one of the worst corners in the league last year against every depth of pass attempt, according to ESPN's fantasy draft guide. 

    And I love the bend but-don't-break D.  We can give up 80 yards on every drive and I won't mind.  It's the breaking that kills me.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Caesar1177. Show Caesar1177's posts

    Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003

    In Response to Re: Bold Prediction: Pats Defense Best Since 2003:
    [QUOTE]I don't have anything of substance to add to this thread, other than to point out that anything that includes an applicable  Time Bandits reference is automatically correct. Clearly, Caesar1177 is a genius.
    Posted by prairiemike[/QUOTE]

    Lol. Crazy movie. I think it gave me nightmares for a few weeks after though. Basically the devil was coming after me and my parents.
     

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