Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    That the weapons Brady had back in his SB winning years were inferior to all the teams that have played since 2007???

     

    I mean it gets so sickening listen to ignorant fans say "Brady didnt have any weapons then, Where was the # 1, there wasnt any deep threat,etc.  SHUT IT!!!!  Let me just focus on the 03' season where we got contributions from everywhere . Guys got hurt, others stepped up. The Ball was SPREAD around and we Absolutely had players to attack every part of the field. We had a Bruising RB in A.Smith, complimented by a Fb who could catch(centers) and a change of pace back who was clutch and could also catch out of backfield. Contrast that now to a one dimensional Slot player who cant outrun anyone or get deep and has linebackers covering him in Wes. A nice, big TE who is always hurt at the end of the year and a # WR in Lloyd who ONLY works the sideline and isnt clutch and a hybrid WR/TE in Hernandez who is always hurt and just started drinking legally...Not EVEN CLOSE! 

     

    IN 2003, this TEAM WAS STACKED! 2007 aint SHIT compared to these guys... Rusty point to Givens being a 7th round pic and I say "so what" did he perform in the SB and in the Clutch or NOT??  He WAS PHYSICAL and worked ALL parts of the field

    Deion Branch played in 15 games and led the team in Catches that year with 57!!! and 3 TD's  (Surely we need a 100 catch WR to win it all right???)

    Kevin Faulk played in 15 games and was 2nd on the team with 48 catches

    Troy Brown played in 12 games and had 38 catches and 4 TD's in a year that he started to be phased out due to younger players like Branch and Givens. Also was injured that year.

    Daniel Graham played in 14 games and had 38 catches and 4 TD's while mainly being a run blocker and catching balls from playaction.

    David Givens played in 13 games and had 34 catches and 6 TD's in a limited role before becoming full time starter in 04'. This is something we dont allow anymore. Raw WR's to develop in 2 years like David did, who came in as a RB and was playing CB one preseason to making plays in the SB. Now we just cut guys after a year if we dont like them. He had 56 catches the following year.

    Christian Furia played in 16 games and had 28 catches and 2 TDs after totaling 7 the year before.

    David Patten  played in only 6 games that year due to injury and had only 9 catches. The following year  he bounced back and had 44 catches for 800 yards and 7 TD's. This was our deep threat wether some care to admit or not. More reliable than Moss.

    Bethel Johnson played in 15 games and had only 9 catches but made a BIG splash on s/t, returning 2 kicks for TDs and making a game sealing deep catch vs Seattle that year. (weiss as his best)

    Dedric Ward picked up late in the year played in 4 games and managed 7 catches and a TD.

    JJ Stokes  played in 2 games and caught 2 catches.

    Larry Centers played in 9 games and had 19 catches and a TD.

     

    So What I see is a very well rounded, talented team that spread the ball. I didnt see any 100 catch WRs. NO 1500 yard rushers. Just a game manager, handing off, passing to open guys and playing with a solid, aggressive defense that was full of playmakers who made plays in the clutch. So not only are our defenses worse than years past, Brady has had less to work with too. Guys just see Moss and Welker and their numbers but WHO was after them???  NOONE!  Glad I could clear that up. Anyone care to post the totals from 07 or this past year???  lol

     

    Just a reminder. This years 3rd and 4th WRs were Slater and Aiken!!!  Lol and Edleman was the starter in week 1......  Wow...  You guys are funny!  Always making up stuff to support agendas and let you guys tell it, our offense wont even MOVE without Wes here....Bwaah-haaaaa-haaaa (evil count dracula voice)

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from xXR3S1NXx. Show xXR3S1NXx's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    The exact reason i think we need to let welker go. Brady is Too complacant(sp) To just stare down welker and not even look at his other options. We need to get brady back on his heels, Make him play like the Guy who won 3 super bowls in 4 years again.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to TripleOG's comment:


     

    IN 2003, this TEAM WAS STACKED! 2007 aint SHIT compared to these guys...



    Um.  No.

     

    Welker, Moss, Stallworth, Watson, Gaffney and Faulk out of the backfield is a way better receiving corps.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

    The exact reason i think we need to let welker go. Brady is Too complacant(sp) To just stare down welker and not even look at his other options. We need to get brady back on his heels, Make him play like the Guy who won 3 super bowls in 4 years again.



    Sigh... Not this again.  Brady just led the league in INT% again this year and you want to argue he was staring down receivers.  Are you serious right now?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

    The exact reason i think we need to let welker go. Brady is Too complacant(sp) To just stare down welker and not even look at his other options. We need to get brady back on his heels, Make him play like the Guy who won 3 super bowls in 4 years again.




    lol...what other options???  Slater and Aiken???  LLoyd who only runs ONE route and has to DIVE to make every catch?  Gronk who is ALWAYS hurt in the postseason?? YOu tell me who else he has to throw too? I want to move on from wes too. Ive said for 3 years he is an ext. of the run game and its not good for establishing toughness. Teams love to Knock out Welker all game. The point is to make them tackle a 225 lb back once in a while.   Wes is whats wrong with this team NOT what makes it go. He is a 1str down maker and teams know where to find him....At the 1st down marker!  Duh!!!

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxfan94. Show redsoxfan94's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    you seriously just said 2007 wasnt stacked like the 2003 team??

    excuse me, but.....ARE YOU ON CRACK?

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to TripleOG's comment:


     

     

    IN 2003, this TEAM WAS STACKED! 2007 aint SHIT compared to these guys...

     

     



    Um.  No.

     

    Welker, Moss, Stallworth, Watson, Gaffney and Faulk out of the backfield is a way better receiving corps.




    Im sorry we will just have to agree to disagree. Are you talking about ALL around players or just what they do in the passing game?  Graham was Ten times the blocker Watson was... and Moss is better than Branch, I'll give you that. Givens > 2012 Branch. Branch(2003) >Stallworth . a Younger Faulk has to be better than an older one. What am I missing??  Troy Brown is better than Wes. More explosive, better returner, more clutch and played defense...  come again pcm..

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from xXR3S1NXx. Show xXR3S1NXx's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

     

    The exact reason i think we need to let welker go. Brady is Too complacant(sp) To just stare down welker and not even look at his other options. We need to get brady back on his heels, Make him play like the Guy who won 3 super bowls in 4 years again.

     



    Sigh... Not this again.  Brady just led the league in INT% again this year and you want to argue he was staring down receivers.  Are you serious right now?

     



    Brady Stares down Welker ALL the time. ARE YOU SERIOUS RIGHT NOW!!! Just because Brady Didnt throw an a55 ton of INT's doesnt mean he doesnt stare down welker.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:


    Brady Stares down Welker ALL the time. ARE YOU SERIOUS RIGHT NOW!!! Just because Brady Didnt throw an a55 ton of INT's doesnt mean he doesnt stare down welker. 



    You literally know nothing about the NFL if you believe this.  You cannot stare down receivers regularly and not throw INTs at this level.  Please stop.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

     

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

     


    Brady Stares down Welker ALL the time. ARE YOU SERIOUS RIGHT NOW!!! Just because Brady Didnt throw an a55 ton of INT's doesnt mean he doesnt stare down welker. 

     



    You literally know nothing about the NFL if you believe this.  You cannot stare down receivers regularly and not throw INTs at this level.  Please stop.

     

     




     

    I dont know If I agree with this .Wes gets open quickly and most times within 5 yards. Most linebackers which is who usally covers him cant make those plays. Being in the slot and having a 2 way go is not the same as playing outside when u can use your sideline as a defender. Once Wes gives a head fake , he is already breaking into his route,. so u cant intercept those but when Wes goes deep, you see the pics like the one vs San Fran. Brady can afford to stare him down and I wont say he always does but he was in the AGCCG. There is just no excuse why Wes dropped those balls other than being concussed.

     

    I think it was a stretch to say you know nothing to that poster when he had a point. You on the other hand were wrong. Most plays to Welker on 3rd downs are MONEY plays, meaning others run CLEAR out routes FOR him and he is the 1st option. Brady DOES stare him DOWN in these situations like the dropped pass on 4th and 7. Go back and look. I would hate to start using the phrase LTG on you because you are a good poster but you are slightly wrong here.

     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    After the Pats beat Indy in the post season on their way to a SB win, the league changed the rules on how the defense could defend the pass.  This completely changed how the game was played. 

    In other words, there is no way to compare teams prior to the rule change to teams after the rule change.  Teams that win the SB today would probably not have won prior to the rule change and vice versa.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to RockScully's comment:

    In response to pcmIV's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

     


    Brady Stares down Welker ALL the time. ARE YOU SERIOUS RIGHT NOW!!! Just because Brady Didnt throw an a55 ton of INT's doesnt mean he doesnt stare down welker. 

     



    [QUOTE]You literally know nothing about the NFL if you believe this.  You cannot stare down receivers regularly and not throw INTs at this level.  Please stop.[QUOTE]

     

     

    There's a reason why when Welker produces for catches and yards in a game, we lose against good Ds.

    This is the problem. When you target the same two guys over and over, whether it be Welker nad Gronk, Welker and Moss (2009), Welker and Hernandez or Gronk and Hernandez, the field shrinks.

    It's why Welker won't be getting 10 mil per year unless some dumb team does it. 

    If I am QB, I would much rather have a wider field to work with than a deeper one, but we rarely see Brady look to hit his perimeter guys during games.  He's more into the easy slants where Branch and Lloyd are diving and covering up for 7 yards.

    It can't be the same excuses all the time "He can't get separation, "He doesn't know the system", "He can't get deep", etc.

    They're all myths.  It's the skills of the players, how they're used in a game and the less he targets a Lloyd or a Branch early in games, the easier it is for a D to defend it.

    If you throw out a run game, your perimtere targets, why wouldn't it be?  Welker is an extension of the run game for crying out loud.

     


     

     




     

    This is WHY people tell you to learn the game Crusty!!!  What else Choice Does brady have??  I havent seen Branch or LLoyd SEPERATE ALL SEASON and you are sitting here wondering WHY Brady prefers to ONLY throw to 2 guys over the middle???  Wow,,,,you are sooooo football knowledgeably challenged that I had to make up that word just to prove my point.,....and now your minions are playing dumb too...    branch and seperation dont even go together......  Its like oil and water!  Learn the GAME!

     
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  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    Im sorry we will just have to agree to disagree. Are you talking about ALL around players or just what they do in the passing game?  Graham was Ten times the blocker Watson was... and Moss is better than Branch, I'll give you that. Givens > 2012 Branch. Branch(2003) >Stallworth . a Younger Faulk has to be better than an older one. What am I missing??  Troy Brown is better than Wes. More explosive, better returner, more clutch and played defense...  come again pcm..



    If you want to argue that the 2003 offensive cast was better than the 2007 cast which resulted in the highest scoring offense in NFL history and Brady having the best single season for a QB in NFL history then I'm not sure what to say.  And before you point to the SB that year I would point out that that was imo mostly the result of the play of the offensive line as opposed to the skill players.

     

    That being said I do think that this offense without Gronk leaves a lot to be desired simply because we don't have any other TE's that are great blockers (hopefully that changes with Ballard) or any receivers that you can just throw it up for.  That combined with the fact that Welker/Lloyd/Hern all work more horizontally than vertically makes us pretty one dimensional.  So I agree that without Gronk the earlier teams were more offensively diverse.  But 2007 was stacked.  Sorry if you don't agree.

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from jam757. Show jam757's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    sorry my friend, the 2007 team was so f'n stacked it was rediculous! Yes, the offense faltered down the stretch but that team had a brutal defense as well. The O line and crappy gameplan were most repsonsible for the Super Bowl loss. Look at these scores which will NEVER again be matched by any team. I for one am still incredibly proud of this team:

    09/09/2007 @ New York Jets W, 38-14 1-0-0 77,900 09/16/2007 San Diego Chargers W, 38-14 2-0-0 68,756 09/23/2007 Buffalo Bills W, 38-7 3-0-0 68,756 10/01/2007 (Mon.) @ Cincinnati Bengals W, 34-13 4-0-0 66,113 10/07/2007 Cleveland Browns W, 34-17 5-0-0 68,756 10/14/2007 @ Dallas Cowboys W, 48-27 6-0-0 63,984 10/21/2007 @ Miami Dolphins W, 49-28 7-0-0 71,951 10/28/2007 Washington Redskins W, 52-7 8-0-0 68,756 11/04/2007 @ Indianapolis Colts W, 24-20 9-0-0 57,540 11/18/2007 @ Buffalo Bills W, 56-10 10-0-0 71,338 11/25/2007 Philadelphia Eagles W, 31-28 11-0-0 68,756 12/03/2007 (Mon.) @ Baltimore Ravens W, 27-24 12-0-0 71,382 12/09/2007 Pittsburgh Steelers W, 34-13 13-0-0 68,756 12/16/2007 New York Jets W, 20-10 14-0-0 68,756 12/23/2007 Miami Dolphins W, 28-7 15-0-0 68,756 12/29/2007 (Sat.) @ New York Giants W, 38-35 16-0-0 79,110
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

     

    Im sorry we will just have to agree to disagree. Are you talking about ALL around players or just what they do in the passing game?  Graham was Ten times the blocker Watson was... and Moss is better than Branch, I'll give you that. Givens > 2012 Branch. Branch(2003) >Stallworth . a Younger Faulk has to be better than an older one. What am I missing??  Troy Brown is better than Wes. More explosive, better returner, more clutch and played defense...  come again pcm..

     

     



    If you want to argue that the 2003 offensive cast was better than the 2007 cast which resulted in the highest scoring offense in NFL history and Brady having the best single season for a QB in NFL history then I'm not sure what to say.  And before you point to the SB that year I would point out that that was imo mostly the result of the play of the offensive line as opposed to the skill players.

     

    That being said I do think that this offense without Gronk leaves a lot to be desired simply because we don't have any other TE's that are great blockers (hopefully that changes with Ballard) or any receivers that you can just throw it up for.  That combined with the fact that Welker/Lloyd/Hern all work more horizontally than vertically makes us pretty one dimensional.  So I agree that without Gronk the earlier teams were more offensively diverse.  But 2007 was stacked.  Sorry if you don't agree.



    nothing to be sorry about bro. U look at stats as a measure of success. I look at SBs! We won 3 with basically the same cast. Weve won NOTHING with these "super teams"

     

    Its what I call "PAPER CHAMPS"  If you are happy with Paper Champs who dont win SB's instead of well rounded teams who can collectively win the Big One, then I guess N.E. is now the right place for you. I need to root for the Dolphins next year. I hear Greg Jennnings wants to go there next year....  smh

     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from jam757. Show jam757's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    how does removimg Welker from the equation help this team??!! Yes, they need another big physical receiver and a deep threat, we all know that. If Welker will be reasonable and the Pats make a fair offer it would be GREAT to see him come back! If Brady is staring down Welker than that is a Brady problem.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

    That the weapons Brady had back in his SB winning years were inferior to all the teams that have played since 2007???

     

    I mean it gets so sickening listen to ignorant fans say "Brady didnt have any weapons then, Where was the # 1, there wasnt any deep threat,etc.  SHUT IT!!!!  Let me just focus on the 03' season where we got contributions from everywhere . Guys got hurt, others stepped up. The Ball was SPREAD around and we Absolutely had players to attack every part of the field. We had a Bruising RB in A.Smith, complimented by a Fb who could catch(centers) and a change of pace back who was clutch and could also catch out of backfield. Contrast that now to a one dimensional Slot player who cant outrun anyone or get deep and has linebackers covering him in Wes. A nice, big TE who is always hurt at the end of the year and a # WR in Lloyd who ONLY works the sideline and isnt clutch and a hybrid WR/TE in Hernandez who is always hurt and just started drinking legally...Not EVEN CLOSE! 

     

    IN 2003, this TEAM WAS STACKED! 2007 aint SHIT compared to these guys... Rusty point to Givens being a 7th round pic and I say "so what" did he perform in the SB and in the Clutch or NOT??  He WAS PHYSICAL and worked ALL parts of the field

    Deion Branch played in 15 games and led the team in Catches that year with 57!!! and 3 TD's  (Surely we need a 100 catch WR to win it all right???)

    Kevin Faulk played in 15 games and was 2nd on the team with 48 catches

    Troy Brown played in 12 games and had 38 catches and 4 TD's in a year that he started to be phased out due to younger players like Branch and Givens. Also was injured that year.

    Daniel Graham played in 14 games and had 38 catches and 4 TD's while mainly being a run blocker and catching balls from playaction.

    David Givens played in 13 games and had 34 catches and 6 TD's in a limited role before becoming full time starter in 04'. This is something we dont allow anymore. Raw WR's to develop in 2 years like David did, who came in as a RB and was playing CB one preseason to making plays in the SB. Now we just cut guys after a year if we dont like them. He had 56 catches the following year.

    Christian Furia played in 16 games and had 28 catches and 2 TDs after totaling 7 the year before.

    David Patten  played in only 6 games that year due to injury and had only 9 catches. The following year  he bounced back and had 44 catches for 800 yards and 7 TD's. This was our deep threat wether some care to admit or not. More reliable than Moss.

    Bethel Johnson played in 15 games and had only 9 catches but made a BIG splash on s/t, returning 2 kicks for TDs and making a game sealing deep catch vs Seattle that year. (weiss as his best)

    Dedric Ward picked up late in the year played in 4 games and managed 7 catches and a TD.

    JJ Stokes  played in 2 games and caught 2 catches.

    Larry Centers played in 9 games and had 19 catches and a TD.

     

    So What I see is a very well rounded, talented team that spread the ball. I didnt see any 100 catch WRs. NO 1500 yard rushers. Just a game manager, handing off, passing to open guys and playing with a solid, aggressive defense that was full of playmakers who made plays in the clutch. So not only are our defenses worse than years past, Brady has had less to work with too. Guys just see Moss and Welker and their numbers but WHO was after them???  NOONE!  Glad I could clear that up. Anyone care to post the totals from 07 or this past year???  lol

     

    Just a reminder. This years 3rd and 4th WRs were Slater and Aiken!!!  Lol and Edleman was the starter in week 1......  Wow...  You guys are funny!  Always making up stuff to support agendas and let you guys tell it, our offense wont even MOVE without Wes here....Bwaah-haaaaa-haaaa (evil count dracula voice)




    Gronkowski Hernandez and Welker when healthy trump anything you have and most teams have so ur whole premise is nonsense-they didn't score 550 pts for nothing and that's without H or G healthy for the full 16 games-come on

    the reason 01 03 04 were successful was ur D and Adam Vinitieri as much as or more than TB who was unspectacular stats wise-he was clutch and smart

     

     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Can we PLEASE Clear up this Misconception...

    In response to TripleOG's comment:


    nothing to be sorry about bro. U look at stats as a measure of success. I look at SBs! We won 3 with basically the same cast. Weve won NOTHING with these "super teams"

     

     

    Its what I call "PAPER CHAMPS"  If you are happy with Paper Champs who dont win SB's instead of well rounded teams who can collectively win the Big One, then I guess N.E. is now the right place for you. I need to root for the Dolphins next year. I hear Greg Jennnings wants to go there next year....  smh



    We didn't win in 2007 because of the offensive line.  Not the skill positions.  And if we had the 2003 defense we would have won as well.  I didn't say the 2007 team was more successful and that isn't the question.

     

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