Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from PhatVirginian. Show PhatVirginian's posts

    Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/draft/2014/02/24/jadeveon-clowneys-solid-combine-performance/5793491/

     

    "Greg Gabriel didn't see many players with the sheer explosive power of South Carolina defensive end Jadeveon Clowney in his three decades as an NFL scout.

    When reviewing tape last summer of Clowney's sophomore season in 2012, Gabriel kept thinking back to his days on the New York Giants' staff watching Lawrence Taylor — a lofty comparison, considering Taylor's in the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

    Only problem: Clowney's 2013 tape didn't match up.

    "He has an opportunity to be one of the all-time greats at his position," Gabriel told USA TODAY Sports on Monday, shortly after watching Clowney's impressive workout at the NFL scouting combine in Indianapolis.

    "He's going to get drafted high based on the pure talent. There's no question about that, and chances are he's going to be a good player. But to me, there's also a bust factor, and the bust factor is he didn't play worth a (expletive) this year."

    COMBINE: Clowney shines with blazing 40-yard dash

    BELL: Texans must pass on Clowney with No. 1 pick

    The exceptional numbers Clowney put up in testing Monday — 4.53 seconds in the 40-yard dash, plus a 37½-inch vertical jump and 124-inch broad jump, all at 6-foot-5 and 266 pounds — just confirmed what scouts knew: He's by far the most freakish physical specimen in this draft.

    That only makes it more maddening to evaluators such as Gabriel, who was a part of two Super Bowl winners with the Giants and later spent nine years as the Chicago Bears' college scouting director, that Clowney wasn't more productive in his final college season.

    "He has that talent to totally dominate a game at any given time. Now you go into this year, you didn't see him dominate at all," Gabriel said of Clowney, who finished last season with three sacks and 40 tackles (11½ for loss) in 11 games, missing two others because of injuries.

    "People are making excuses for him, saying that, 'Oh, he was double-teamed. He was triple-teamed.' Do you think every offense in the National Football League didn't set their game plan to stop Lawrence Taylor? Yet they never did it.

    "When you have that much talent, you find a way to get it done."

    In a media session Saturday at the combine, Clowney dismissed South Carolina coach Steve Spurrier's lukewarm remarks about his work ethic and pointed to the Gamecocks' success as a team, saying there was a "lot of game-changing" by opponents with him on the field.

    "Quick passes, two-on-one, opposite-side runs — but that happens," Clowney said. "I wasn't really worried about my stats. I just wanted to win."

    VIDEO: CLOWNEY ADDRESSES MEDIA AT SCOUTING COMBINE

     

    Clowney, who turned 21 this month, also admitted he probably would've left school after his sophomore season if NFL rules allowed it. Combined with the decision to pull himself from the lineup shortly before an October game against Kentucky because of sore ribs, it's only logical to wonder if Clowney was primarily worried about avoiding a major injury that would affect his payday. That excuse wouldn't sit well with Gabriel either.

    "The definition of a defensive lineman is he's a thug," Gabriel said. "You're asking him to win 60 street fights in the course of a game. He's got to be a tough guy. They're a little different birds. But you want to see the effort. I didn't see the effort this year, so that's the question mark.

    "People say, 'Well, he was playing to protect himself,' and that very well may be true. But who's to say he's not going to do that once he gets into the NFL level?"

    Taking a chance on a player like Clowney with the No. 1 overall pick isn't the financial risk it was four years ago, before the rookie wage system chopped the guaranteed money by more 50%.

    The Houston Texans own the top pick and just hired a defensive coordinator, Romeo Crennel, who was with the Giants for most of Taylor's career. Crennel had success with Willie McGinest in New England and might envision Clowney is a similar role as a big outside linebacker.

    If the Texans pass, Clowney has fans with the St. Louis Rams, who already have invested heavily in defensive ends Robert Quinn and Chris Long and could look to move the No. 2 pick. Next on the clock are the Jacksonville Jaguars, Cleveland Browns and Oakland Raiders.

    "No matter where I end up," Clowney said, "I am going to work hard and give a team everything I've got.""

    --------------------------------------

    Clowney will probably be a top 5 pick. If I were Houston, I'd take a chance on him.  Having him and JJ Watt trying to get after the QB?

    Any legitimacy to the bust factor?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Archer1. Show Archer1's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    He might have a little Vernon Gholston in him...

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from PhatVirginian. Show PhatVirginian's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    JaMarcus Russell

    Ryan Leaf

    Tony Mandarich

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    How he played for SC in 2013, IMHO, does not bode well for him.  He can say all he wants he tried, but, he clearly was not a team player in 2013 and was only out for himself.  In my mind, it does go to his work ethic in that he appears to pick and chose when it suits him to work hard.  Playing against college players, with barely a few NFL caliber players, is when he should have shined in 2013 and he didn't.  In the NFL, it may take only one NFL caliber tackle to knock him on his butt unlike the double and triple teams he faced in college. Additionally, NFL teams will not be afraid to run in his direction.  We shall see, won't we?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?


    I think it is very possible.  Once a guy gets so full of himself that he lets those thoughts guide his judgement (playing in 2014 to not get hurt), it seems like its hard for guys like that to return to the hunger drove them to the excellence like he experienced in 2013. 

    Look at his hair in the picture.  He's got it just right, perfect.  He is too focused on his image. 

    Manziell would be another one of these guys after his heisman season, but he came out last year and competed in the same way he did during his heisman year.  He may be a prima donna headache, but I believe he will always compete. 

    One counter to my feelings would be Cam Newton.  He seemed like a guy who was too stuck on himself, but he seemed to pull himself out of that and really performed last year.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to agcsbill's comment:

    How he played for SC in 2013, IMHO, does not bode well for him.  He can say all he wants he tried, but, he clearly was not a team player in 2013 and was only out for himself.  In my mind, it does go to his work ethic in that he appears to pick and chose when it suits him to work hard.  Playing against college players, with barely a few NFL caliber players, is when he should have shined in 2013 and he didn't.  In the NFL, it may take only one NFL caliber tackle to knock him on his butt unlike the double and triple teams he faced in college. Additionally, NFL teams will not be afraid to run in his direction.  We shall see, won't we?



         Clowney has a world of raw talent. But, as we've seen in the past from guys like Vernon Gholston, that doesn't always translate into NFL success.

         Many are giving Clowney a bad rap for how he played last season at South Carolina. Going into the season, he was the consensus #1 prospect for the 2014 draft. Going into last season, some people were commenting how it was foolish for Clowney to play, and risk injury. Those who felt this way advocated that he sit out the season. 

         Yet, Clowney chose to play. During garbage time of South Carolina's first game of the season vs. North Carolina, a Tarheel offensive lineman clipped Clowney from behind when he was well out of the particular play being run, in a deliberate attempt to injury him. It was one of the dirtiest plays that I've seen in a while. Thereafter, Clowney seemed to play tentatively for the rest of the season: http://athlonsports.com/college-football/unc-takes-cheap-shot-jadeveon-clowney

         Folks, can you really blame him? Here's a dirt poor kid who is a step away from getting a huge NFL payday...bringing with it financial security, and the ability to take care of his family for life. 

         I don't know what kind of a football player Clowney will turn out to be. But, I'd caution against letting how he played last year be the main determining factor as to whether he should be a top 5 pick.   

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    Clowney IMO is what is wrong with the combine that we as fans see on TV. We, and coaches watch his 40 time, his 3 cone drills and his broad jump. Coaches look at his measureables and say to themselves what a great player Clowney would be with proper coaching 

    They overlook his game tape where he took some plays off, or missed games altogether based on being wowed by his measureables. So, is a player like this (or like Gholdston) a "bust", or did the team drafting the player misread the player? 

    The part we do not see is the interview process. Is the team asking the right questions? Are they doing proper back ground checks? Are they listening to their scouts and the players college coach?

    I could see a scenario that Clowney is drafted #1, and all the other warning signs get thrown out the window

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to PhatVirginian's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/draft/2014/02/24/jadeveon-clowneys-solid-combine-performance/5793491/

     

    "Greg Gabriel didn't see many players with the sheer explosive power of South Carolina defensive end Jadeveon Clowney in his three decades as an NFL scout.

    When reviewing tape last summer of Clowney's sophomore season in 2012, Gabriel kept thinking back to his days on the New York Giants' staff watching Lawrence Taylor — a lofty comparison, considering Taylor's in the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

    Only problem: Clowney's 2013 tape didn't match up.

    "He has an opportunity to be one of the all-time greats at his position," Gabriel told USA TODAY Sports on Monday, shortly after watching Clowney's impressive workout at the NFL scouting combine in Indianapolis.

    "He's going to get drafted high based on the pure talent. There's no question about that, and chances are he's going to be a good player. But to me, there's also a bust factor, and the bust factor is he didn't play worth a (expletive) this year."

    COMBINE: Clowney shines with blazing 40-yard dash

    BELL: Texans must pass on Clowney with No. 1 pick

    The exceptional numbers Clowney put up in testing Monday — 4.53 seconds in the 40-yard dash, plus a 37½-inch vertical jump and 124-inch broad jump, all at 6-foot-5 and 266 pounds — just confirmed what scouts knew: He's by far the most freakish physical specimen in this draft.

    That only makes it more maddening to evaluators such as Gabriel, who was a part of two Super Bowl winners with the Giants and later spent nine years as the Chicago Bears' college scouting director, that Clowney wasn't more productive in his final college season.

    "He has that talent to totally dominate a game at any given time. Now you go into this year, you didn't see him dominate at all," Gabriel said of Clowney, who finished last season with three sacks and 40 tackles (11½ for loss) in 11 games, missing two others because of injuries.

    "People are making excuses for him, saying that, 'Oh, he was double-teamed. He was triple-teamed.' Do you think every offense in the National Football League didn't set their game plan to stop Lawrence Taylor? Yet they never did it.

    "When you have that much talent, you find a way to get it done."

    In a media session Saturday at the combine, Clowney dismissed South Carolina coach Steve Spurrier's lukewarm remarks about his work ethic and pointed to the Gamecocks' success as a team, saying there was a "lot of game-changing" by opponents with him on the field.

    "Quick passes, two-on-one, opposite-side runs — but that happens," Clowney said. "I wasn't really worried about my stats. I just wanted to win."

    VIDEO: CLOWNEY ADDRESSES MEDIA AT SCOUTING COMBINE

     

    Clowney, who turned 21 this month, also admitted he probably would've left school after his sophomore season if NFL rules allowed it. Combined with the decision to pull himself from the lineup shortly before an October game against Kentucky because of sore ribs, it's only logical to wonder if Clowney was primarily worried about avoiding a major injury that would affect his payday. That excuse wouldn't sit well with Gabriel either.

    "The definition of a defensive lineman is he's a thug," Gabriel said. "You're asking him to win 60 street fights in the course of a game. He's got to be a tough guy. They're a little different birds. But you want to see the effort. I didn't see the effort this year, so that's the question mark.

    "People say, 'Well, he was playing to protect himself,' and that very well may be true. But who's to say he's not going to do that once he gets into the NFL level?"

    Taking a chance on a player like Clowney with the No. 1 overall pick isn't the financial risk it was four years ago, before the rookie wage system chopped the guaranteed money by more 50%.

    The Houston Texans own the top pick and just hired a defensive coordinator, Romeo Crennel, who was with the Giants for most of Taylor's career. Crennel had success with Willie McGinest in New England and might envision Clowney is a similar role as a big outside linebacker.

    If the Texans pass, Clowney has fans with the St. Louis Rams, who already have invested heavily in defensive ends Robert Quinn and Chris Long and could look to move the No. 2 pick. Next on the clock are the Jacksonville Jaguars, Cleveland Browns and Oakland Raiders.

    "No matter where I end up," Clowney said, "I am going to work hard and give a team everything I've got.""

    --------------------------------------

    Clowney will probably be a top 5 pick. If I were Houston, I'd take a chance on him.  Having him and JJ Watt trying to get after the QB?

    Any legitimacy to the bust factor?

    [/QUOTE]

    i dunno but it seems people here throw around the term "bust" often and really early

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    It does not matter. He has demonstrated he has 1st round talent. Playing percentages, any team with a high pick and has no need for a QB would be mistaken to pass on him. The last CBA has made taking risks on players like this less costly. The only rational approach is to strike out swinging.

    On the other hand, if you have a need for a QB, you still pick the best QB available, because that is the most important position in the game.

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    I think it is very possible.  Once a guy gets so full of himself that he lets those thoughts guide his judgement (playing in 2014 to not get hurt), it seems like its hard for guys like that to return to the hunger drove them to the excellence like he experienced in 2013. 

    Look at his hair in the picture.  He's got it just right, perfect.  He is too focused on his image. 

    Manziell would be another one of these guys after his heisman season, but he came out last year and competed in the same way he did during his heisman year.  He may be a prima donna headache, but I believe he will always compete. 

    One counter to my feelings would be Cam Newton.  He seemed like a guy who was too stuck on himself, but he seemed to pull himself out of that and really performed last year.

    [/QUOTE]

         Hey Gomez...as a Colts fan, why are you worried about Clowney? After all, there's no chance that he'll end up a Colt, since those Dolts traded away their #1 draft choice this year in return for the bust that is Trent Richardson.

         LOL!!!

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from NoMorePensionLooting. Show NoMorePensionLooting's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    His Coach, when asked about Clowney's work ethic stated "it's OK"

    That's quite interesting for sure.

    Clowney has the tools...passing on him will take some big brass bxlls....

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from JohnHannahrulz. Show JohnHannahrulz's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    IMHO. He had no choice, but to play out the 2013  season(NFL Draft Eligibilty Rules), even though he had a great sophomore season in 2012(top 5 pick). Maybe he played not to get hurt or took plays off; according Spurrier who did nothing in the NFL (a better question would be Will Clowney have more success than his coach did in the NFL ?). Let's not forget there have been busts on the D Line (Emtman, Keith McCants etc....). For me it is a question of production: eg: if Clowney is the top defensive pick he should average 10-15 sacks per season and make the pro-bowl (for comparisons see Demarcus Ware, J. J Watt, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis etc....) if he goes McCants he averages less than 5 sacks he is perceived as underperforming or close to bust and is out of the league in six years. He needs the right coaches and a good locker room. Paired with JJ Watt and the could reek havoc on NFL QBs. IMHO Clowney is a safer pick than Manziel.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from PhatVirginian. Show PhatVirginian's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to agcsbill's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    How he played for SC in 2013, IMHO, does not bode well for him.  He can say all he wants he tried, but, he clearly was not a team player in 2013 and was only out for himself.  In my mind, it does go to his work ethic in that he appears to pick and chose when it suits him to work hard.  Playing against college players, with barely a few NFL caliber players, is when he should have shined in 2013 and he didn't.  In the NFL, it may take only one NFL caliber tackle to knock him on his butt unlike the double and triple teams he faced in college. Additionally, NFL teams will not be afraid to run in his direction.  We shall see, won't we?

    [/QUOTE]

    was his injury legit - or do you think he was just trying to protect his future in the NFL?

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to JohnHannahrulz's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    IMHO. He had no choice, but to play out the 2013  season(NFL Draft Eligibilty Rules), even though he had a great sophomore season in 2012(top 5 pick). Maybe he played not to get hurt or took plays off; according Spurrier who did nothing in the NFL (a better question would be Will Clowney have more success than his coach did in the NFL ?). Let's not forget there have been busts on the D Line (Emtman, Keith McCants etc....). For me it is a question of production: eg: if Clowney is the top defensive pick he should average 10-15 sacks per season and make the pro-bowl (for comparisons see Demarcus Ware, J. J Watt, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis etc....) if he goes McCants he averages less than 5 sacks he is perceived as underperforming or close to bust and is out of the league in six years. He needs the right coaches and a good locker room. Paired with JJ Watt and the could reek havoc on NFL QBs. IMHO Clowney is a safer pick than Manziel.

    [/QUOTE]

    100% agree. The texans should be picking clowney at 1 to pair with Watt. That is a wrecking crew. I personally don't think he will be a bust, and, if he is paired with a guy like watt, this can only help his numbers and production.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from PhatVirginian. Show PhatVirginian's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to 42AND46's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    i dunno but it seems people here throw around the term "bust" often and really early

    [/QUOTE]

    actually, it was the question in the article by the author.  I was just posing it to the fans.  Obviously, since he hasn't played one down of pro football - noone knows. We won't know for 2-4 years. It's off-season - just something to talk about.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from PhatVirginian. Show PhatVirginian's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to JohnHannahrulz's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    IMHO. He had no choice, but to play out the 2013  season(NFL Draft Eligibilty Rules), even though he had a great sophomore season in 2012(top 5 pick). Maybe he played not to get hurt or took plays off; according Spurrier who did nothing in the NFL (a better question would be Will Clowney have more success than his coach did in the NFL ?). Let's not forget there have been busts on the D Line (Emtman, Keith McCants etc....). For me it is a question of production: eg: if Clowney is the top defensive pick he should average 10-15 sacks per season and make the pro-bowl (for comparisons see Demarcus Ware, J. J Watt, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis etc....) if he goes McCants he averages less than 5 sacks he is perceived as underperforming or close to bust and is out of the league in six years. He needs the right coaches and a good locker room. Paired with JJ Watt and the could reek havoc on NFL QBs. IMHO Clowney is a safer pick than Manziel.

    [/QUOTE]

    If Clowney meets/exceeds expectations - do you think the combination of Clowney and Watt make the Texans a viable playoff contender for next year?  A defense that keeps games close enough to win?

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    I think it is very possible.  Once a guy gets so full of himself that he lets those thoughts guide his judgement (playing in 2014 to not get hurt), it seems like its hard for guys like that to return to the hunger drove them to the excellence like he experienced in 2013. 

    Look at his hair in the picture.  He's got it just right, perfect.  He is too focused on his image. 

    Manziell would be another one of these guys after his heisman season, but he came out last year and competed in the same way he did during his heisman year.  He may be a prima donna headache, but I believe he will always compete. 

    One counter to my feelings would be Cam Newton.  He seemed like a guy who was too stuck on himself, but he seemed to pull himself out of that and really performed last year.

    [/QUOTE]

         Hey Gomez...as a Colts fan, why are you worried about Clowney? After all, there's no chance that he'll end up a Colt, since those Dolts traded away their #1 draft choice this year in return for the bust that is Trent Richardson.

         LOL!!!

     

    [/QUOTE]

    what's up TPMMQB?  I am not at all worried about Clowney.  I am just enjoying a friendly discussion on a message board about him.  You seem to have a huge Jones for the colts my friend.  Becoming a fan?

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    I think it is very possible.  Once a guy gets so full of himself that he lets those thoughts guide his judgement (playing in 2014 to not get hurt), it seems like its hard for guys like that to return to the hunger drove them to the excellence like he experienced in 2013. 

    Look at his hair in the picture.  He's got it just right, perfect.  He is too focused on his image. 

    Manziell would be another one of these guys after his heisman season, but he came out last year and competed in the same way he did during his heisman year.  He may be a prima donna headache, but I believe he will always compete. 

    One counter to my feelings would be Cam Newton.  He seemed like a guy who was too stuck on himself, but he seemed to pull himself out of that and really performed last year.

    [/QUOTE]

         Hey Gomez...as a Colts fan, why are you worried about Clowney? After all, there's no chance that he'll end up a Colt, since those Dolts traded away their #1 draft choice this year in return for the bust that is Trent Richardson.

         LOL!!!

     

    [/QUOTE]

    what's up TPMMQB?  I am not at all worried about Clowney.  I am just enjoying a friendly discussion on a message board about him.  You seem to have a huge Jones for the colts my friend.  Becoming a fan?

    [/QUOTE]

    Oh...sorry, Gomez. Did the mention of Trent Richardson strike a nerve?

    LOL!!! 

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from PhatVirginian. Show PhatVirginian's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to seattlepat70's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It does not matter. He has demonstrated he has 1st round talent. Playing percentages, any team with a high pick and has no need for a QB would be mistaken to pass on him. The last CBA has made taking risks on players like this less costly. The only rational approach is to strike out swinging.

    On the other hand, if you have a need for a QB, you still pick the best QB available, because that is the most important position in the game.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    How often is Houston going to get a chance at a player like Clowney?  Wouldn't Houston be able to pick up a QB in the draft next year with their first rounder. Is there a QB in the second round  of this year's draft close to the talent of Manziel?

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from UD6. Show UD6's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    I think it is very possible.  Once a guy gets so full of himself that he lets those thoughts guide his judgement (playing in 2014 to not get hurt), it seems like its hard for guys like that to return to the hunger drove them to the excellence like he experienced in 2013. 

    Look at his hair in the picture.  He's got it just right, perfect.  He is too focused on his image. 

    Manziell would be another one of these guys after his heisman season, but he came out last year and competed in the same way he did during his heisman year.  He may be a prima donna headache, but I believe he will always compete. 

    One counter to my feelings would be Cam Newton.  He seemed like a guy who was too stuck on himself, but he seemed to pull himself out of that and really performed last year.

    [/QUOTE]

         Hey Gomez...as a Colts fan, why are you worried about Clowney? After all, there's no chance that he'll end up a Colt, since those Dolts traded away their #1 draft choice this year in return for the bust that is Trent Richardson.

         LOL!!!

     

    [/QUOTE]

    what's up TPMMQB?  I am not at all worried about Clowney.  I am just enjoying a friendly discussion on a message board about him.  You seem to have a huge Jones for the colts my friend.  Becoming a fan?

    [/QUOTE]

    Oh...sorry, Gomez. Did the mention of Trent Richardson strike a nerve?

    LOL!!! 

    [/QUOTE]

    Not at all, but it seems to have given you an unusual lift. 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from mellymel3. Show mellymel3's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to PhatVirginian's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/draft/2014/02/24/jadeveon-clowneys-solid-combine-performance/5793491/

     

    "Greg Gabriel didn't see many players with the sheer explosive power of South Carolina defensive end Jadeveon Clowney in his three decades as an NFL scout.

    When reviewing tape last summer of Clowney's sophomore season in 2012, Gabriel kept thinking back to his days on the New York Giants' staff watching Lawrence Taylor — a lofty comparison, considering Taylor's in the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

    Only problem: Clowney's 2013 tape didn't match up.

    "He has an opportunity to be one of the all-time greats at his position," Gabriel told USA TODAY Sports on Monday, shortly after watching Clowney's impressive workout at the NFL scouting combine in Indianapolis.

    "He's going to get drafted high based on the pure talent. There's no question about that, and chances are he's going to be a good player. But to me, there's also a bust factor, and the bust factor is he didn't play worth a (expletive) this year."

    COMBINE: Clowney shines with blazing 40-yard dash

    BELL: Texans must pass on Clowney with No. 1 pick

    The exceptional numbers Clowney put up in testing Monday — 4.53 seconds in the 40-yard dash, plus a 37½-inch vertical jump and 124-inch broad jump, all at 6-foot-5 and 266 pounds — just confirmed what scouts knew: He's by far the most freakish physical specimen in this draft.

    That only makes it more maddening to evaluators such as Gabriel, who was a part of two Super Bowl winners with the Giants and later spent nine years as the Chicago Bears' college scouting director, that Clowney wasn't more productive in his final college season.

    "He has that talent to totally dominate a game at any given time. Now you go into this year, you didn't see him dominate at all," Gabriel said of Clowney, who finished last season with three sacks and 40 tackles (11½ for loss) in 11 games, missing two others because of injuries.

    "People are making excuses for him, saying that, 'Oh, he was double-teamed. He was triple-teamed.' Do you think every offense in the National Football League didn't set their game plan to stop Lawrence Taylor? Yet they never did it.

    "When you have that much talent, you find a way to get it done."

    In a media session Saturday at the combine, Clowney dismissed South Carolina coach Steve Spurrier's lukewarm remarks about his work ethic and pointed to the Gamecocks' success as a team, saying there was a "lot of game-changing" by opponents with him on the field.

    "Quick passes, two-on-one, opposite-side runs — but that happens," Clowney said. "I wasn't really worried about my stats. I just wanted to win."

    VIDEO: CLOWNEY ADDRESSES MEDIA AT SCOUTING COMBINE

     

    Clowney, who turned 21 this month, also admitted he probably would've left school after his sophomore season if NFL rules allowed it. Combined with the decision to pull himself from the lineup shortly before an October game against Kentucky because of sore ribs, it's only logical to wonder if Clowney was primarily worried about avoiding a major injury that would affect his payday. That excuse wouldn't sit well with Gabriel either.

    "The definition of a defensive lineman is he's a thug," Gabriel said. "You're asking him to win 60 street fights in the course of a game. He's got to be a tough guy. They're a little different birds. But you want to see the effort. I didn't see the effort this year, so that's the question mark.

    "People say, 'Well, he was playing to protect himself,' and that very well may be true. But who's to say he's not going to do that once he gets into the NFL level?"

    Taking a chance on a player like Clowney with the No. 1 overall pick isn't the financial risk it was four years ago, before the rookie wage system chopped the guaranteed money by more 50%.

    The Houston Texans own the top pick and just hired a defensive coordinator, Romeo Crennel, who was with the Giants for most of Taylor's career. Crennel had success with Willie McGinest in New England and might envision Clowney is a similar role as a big outside linebacker.

    If the Texans pass, Clowney has fans with the St. Louis Rams, who already have invested heavily in defensive ends Robert Quinn and Chris Long and could look to move the No. 2 pick. Next on the clock are the Jacksonville Jaguars, Cleveland Browns and Oakland Raiders.

    "No matter where I end up," Clowney said, "I am going to work hard and give a team everything I've got.""

    --------------------------------------

    Clowney will probably be a top 5 pick. If I were Houston, I'd take a chance on him.  Having him and JJ Watt trying to get after the QB?

    Any legitimacy to the bust factor?

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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from mellymel3. Show mellymel3's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to Archer1's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    He might have a little Vernon Gholston in him...

    [/QUOTE]


    He's got a lot of potential Ghoulston in him...if he refuses to play 100% all the time...the game comes to easy to him...I'd be terrified he wants to sign the first good contract then cruise for the rest of his life, then pulling a Haynesworth and hoping to find a sucker team like the Redskins to give him a final megabucks contract to end his career ....I don't think I'd touch the guy with a ten foot pole....

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from mellymel3. Show mellymel3's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to UD6's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TexasPat's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to UD6's comment:
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    I think it is very possible.  Once a guy gets so full of himself that he lets those thoughts guide his judgement (playing in 2014 to not get hurt), it seems like its hard for guys like that to return to the hunger drove them to the excellence like he experienced in 2013. 

    Look at his hair in the picture.  He's got it just right, perfect.  He is too focused on his image. 

    Manziell would be another one of these guys after his heisman season, but he came out last year and competed in the same way he did during his heisman year.  He may be a prima donna headache, but I believe he will always compete. 

    One counter to my feelings would be Cam Newton.  He seemed like a guy who was too stuck on himself, but he seemed to pull himself out of that and really performed last year.

    [/QUOTE]

         Hey Gomez...as a Colts fan, why are you worried about Clowney? After all, there's no chance that he'll end up a Colt, since those Dolts traded away their #1 draft choice this year in return for the bust that is Trent Richardson.

         LOL!!!

     

    [/QUOTE]

    what's up TPMMQB?  I am not at all worried about Clowney.  I am just enjoying a friendly discussion on a message board about him.  You seem to have a huge Jones for the colts my friend.  Becoming a fan?

    [/QUOTE]

    Oh...sorry, Gomez. Did the mention of Trent Richardson strike a nerve?

    LOL!!! 

    [/QUOTE]


    Gomez!...BWAHAHAHAHA!!!

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat. Show TexasPat's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

         The word being put out in Houston is that the Texans are going to relase QB Matt Schaub, and definately take a QB. We shall see.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Clowney Oozing With Talent, Potential - Bust Factor?

    In response to PhatVirginian's comment:
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    In response to JohnHannahrulz's comment:
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    IMHO. He had no choice, but to play out the 2013  season(NFL Draft Eligibilty Rules), even though he had a great sophomore season in 2012(top 5 pick). Maybe he played not to get hurt or took plays off; according Spurrier who did nothing in the NFL (a better question would be Will Clowney have more success than his coach did in the NFL ?). Let's not forget there have been busts on the D Line (Emtman, Keith McCants etc....). For me it is a question of production: eg: if Clowney is the top defensive pick he should average 10-15 sacks per season and make the pro-bowl (for comparisons see Demarcus Ware, J. J Watt, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis etc....) if he goes McCants he averages less than 5 sacks he is perceived as underperforming or close to bust and is out of the league in six years. He needs the right coaches and a good locker room. Paired with JJ Watt and the could reek havoc on NFL QBs. IMHO Clowney is a safer pick than Manziel.

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    If Clowney meets/exceeds expectations - do you think the combination of Clowney and Watt make the Texans a viable playoff contender for next year?  A defense that keeps games close enough to win?

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    Not really. His impact would be on pass D. HOU is already ranked #3. What difference does it make if they become #1 on run D, while their run D, which ranked 23 stays the same or declines, and their O continues to be average? His impact on that team will be less than if he went to another.

    They will not win a SB with Schaub. Even if they get Clowney, they will need a real QB. Unless they get a real QB, chances of them winning a SB before Clowney's rookie contract expires will be slim. Good luck to keeping Watt and Clowney together, beyond that point.

     

     

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