Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    Comparing BB's 10 best players picked (based on PFR's CarAV rating, rounds 1-4), from the 2006 to the 2012 draft, to the best 10 picks of the SB teams since 2006 and/or the teams that made the playoffs this year.

     

    49ers 436

    Packers 435

    Ravens 433

    Broncos 420

    Saints 401

    Panthers 390

    Bengals 384

    Chiefs 364

    Steelers 347

    Seahawks 326

    Chargers 322

    Eagles 307

    BB 296

    Cardinals 293

    Giants 274

    Bears 274

    Colts 267

     

    So BB comes in 13th out of the 17 teams compared. He has performed about the same as the Cardinals.

     

    There's the facts, now let the homer spin begin.

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.



     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BsLegion. Show BsLegion's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    I'm not going to comment otherwise this will become Bruins-Chiarelli-Jacobs thread.

    but I will say "ouch"

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonSportsFan111. Show BostonSportsFan111's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In 2007 they used their 2nd pick (plus a 7th rounder) to get Welker, and their 4th pick to get Moss. I'm guessing Moss' value for the 2007 season alone was greater than any other player in that draft, and his 3 full seasons here outdid anyone as well. And Welkers value for the 6 seasons he was here was probably as good as just about anyone chosen that year. Do your statistics include these? 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    I hate that I clicked on this link, Babe knows nothing about football. He knows everything about endless ranting!

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In 2007 they used their 2nd pick (plus a 7th rounder) to get Welker, and their 4th pick to get Moss. I'm guessing Moss' value for the 2007 season alone was greater than any other player in that draft, and his 3 full seasons here outdid anyone as well. And Welkers value for the 6 seasons he was here was probably as good as just about anyone chosen that year. Do your statistics include these? 

    [/QUOTE]


    Are we going to subtract picks we got for trading away players too, or is this street one way?

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    I don't know the methodology, but agreed, the WW and the Moss trades -- are those factored in?  Also, some of those teams on that list were bad for a long time getting higher picks than the Pats over that time period.  It's not to say BB has not had clunker drafts, he has.  But teams like Denver, Saints and Chiefs had dramatic upswings in performance when they were able to acquire legit QBs via trade or FA (Brees, Manning, Smith).  That probably makes as much difference as their drafts, which sort of supports the thought that Brady has helped to mask some bad drafts here.  

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it is highly selective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it is highly selective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

    [/QUOTE]

    Hmmm . . . they say BB's best pick was Asante Samuel . . . and even Belichick didn't think he was worth re-signing. 

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    The draft is not a science. This model does not factor in team needs, trades or other intangibles which may factor the reason for a team drafting a player. It is the equivilant of saying you would want Peyton Manning as your QB in the biggest game of the year because he puts up the best numbers. 



     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonSportsFan111. Show BostonSportsFan111's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In 2007 they used their 2nd pick (plus a 7th rounder) to get Welker, and their 4th pick to get Moss. I'm guessing Moss' value for the 2007 season alone was greater than any other player in that draft, and his 3 full seasons here outdid anyone as well. And Welkers value for the 6 seasons he was here was probably as good as just about anyone chosen that year. Do your statistics include these? 




    Are we going to subtract picks we got for trading away players too, or is this street one way?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Your criteria was to only look at players they got in certain rounds of certain years of the draft. My point is that if they used the picks to obtain other players who were of greater value and use to the team than anyone they could have got during those rounds in the draft, I see that as a positive, a good move by the general manager. Your criteria appears to punished them for that. I guess they could have drafted guys in those rounds that might have made their CarAV rating (whatever that is) higher so they would look better on your list, but would not have made the team as strong as using the picks to get Moss and Welker. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from HomerHead. Show HomerHead's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    D'oh!

    I disagree babe.  Belichicks drafts are the greatest.  I learn so much from him.  Today for breakfast I traded back my bacon, eggs and hashbrowns for 1 sausage patty.  Value pick! Best move ever!

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it isselective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

    [/QUOTE]

    Hmmm . . . they say BB's best pick was Asante Samuel . . . and even Belichick didn't think he was worth re-signing. 

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Yeah, signing asante to a 6 year 60 million wasn't a good move for the future of your football team. As he showed in philly, he wasnt a corner stone player. Great move drafting him, and great move letting him walk.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    Is there a site for this report?

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to BostonSportsFan111's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In 2007 they used their 2nd pick (plus a 7th rounder) to get Welker, and their 4th pick to get Moss. I'm guessing Moss' value for the 2007 season alone was greater than any other player in that draft, and his 3 full seasons here outdid anyone as well. And Welkers value for the 6 seasons he was here was probably as good as just about anyone chosen that year. Do your statistics include these? 

    [/QUOTE]


    Are we going to subtract picks we got for trading away players too, or is this street one way?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Your criteria was to only look at players they got in certain rounds of certain years of the draft. My point is that if they used the picks to obtain other players who were of greater value and use to the team than anyone they could have got during those rounds in the draft. I see that as a positive, a good move by the general manager. Your criteria appears to punished them for that. I guess they could have drafted guys in those roundss that might have made their CarAV rating (whatever that is) higher so they would look better on your list, but would not have made the team as strong as using the picks to get Moss and Welker. 

    [/QUOTE]


    Im just being funny here but who is to say that Moss and Wes were great pics? Sure they allowed us to go 16-0 but they also allowed us to be cocky and lose a SB. Nothing has ever come from it. I didnt like 2007. Now I may be in the minority and I dont think BB would have got it right anyway but who is to say two defensive studs used with those pics wouldnt have set us up better?  I mean all we got was broken records, stats but NO championships. If THATS the measure, why do we think those were great pics?  Thats what changed us to a score first and sit back kind of team. Its done nothing for us

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonSportsFan111. Show BostonSportsFan111's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    Tom Brady alone has an AV of 177, so add him in to the list and see where the Pats fit in...

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    According to Babe the 49ers have drafted the best since 2006.  Well according to PFR the CarAV of the Patriots drafts from 2008-2012 was higher than the 9ers.  I guess Babe thinks BB has been the best drafter in the NFL since 2008.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from newenglanderinexile. Show newenglanderinexile's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    If the Patriots will just get rid of Bill Belichick and Tom Brady, they will win the next five Super Bowls. 

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from HomerHead. Show HomerHead's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to newenglanderinexile's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    If the Patriots will just get rid of Bill Belichick and Tom Brady, they will win the next five Super Bowls. 

    [/QUOTE]


    Your jealousy is delicious.

    Burp.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it isselective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.



    Hmmm . . . they say BB's best pick was Asante Samuel . . . and even Belichick didn't think he was worth re-signing. 

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Yeah, signing asante to a 6 year 60 million wasn't a good move for the future of your football team. As he showed in philly, he wasnt a corner stone player. Great move drafting him, and great move letting him walk.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Sure . . . the future was definitely bright with Ellis Hobbs and Jonathan Wilhite and Darius Butler out there instead. 

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it isselective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Hmmm . . . they say BB's best pick was Asante Samuel . . . and even Belichick didn't think he was worth re-signing. 

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Yeah, signing asante to a 6 year 60 million wasn't a good move for the future of your football team. As he showed in philly, he wasnt a corner stone player. Great move drafting him, and great move letting him walk.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Sure . . . the future was definitely bright with Ellis Hobbs and Jonathan Wilhite and Darius Butler out there instead. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Come on, prolate, that comment really isn't like you.  Asante Samuel had his talents as a ball hawk but he was not the best cover corner around and was a horrible tackler.  He wanted to get paid big money and he went where he could get it.  To suggest that BB dropped the ball by not re-signing Asante is inaccurate imo.

    With respect Hobbs, Wilhite and Butler, they were misses and everyone has acknowledged that. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it isselective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

    [/QUOTE]

    Hmmm . . . they say BB's best pick was Asante Samuel . . . and even Belichick didn't think he was worth re-signing. 

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Yeah, signing asante to a 6 year 60 million wasn't a good move for the future of your football team. As he showed in philly, he wasnt a corner stone player. Great move drafting him, and great move letting him walk.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Thank you. Signing him would not be as bad as selling the farm to buy Namdi or Revis; but similar banana.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it is highly selective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

    [/QUOTE]


    You wanted a comparison, I gave you one.

    My criteria was not contrived. I chose 2006 because that's when the questions about BB's drafting started. I didn't include 2013 because it's too soon to judge. I chose the first four rounds because it becomes completely dumb luck after that.

    But I hate to burst your non-objectivity bubble my well seasoned friend, because adjusting the parameters somewhat would not change much at all. You want all 7 rounds? It barely changes BB's score.

     

    As far as your clinging to the dufus Comey's article, his factoring in guys who simply managed to be hangers-on in the league is a joke and contaminates his entire grading. (As if a few more scrubs actually could be a factor in determining who will win a SB - that's just stupid.) Harumpf.

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to ATJ's comment:

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it isselective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

     



    Hmmm . . . they say BB's best pick was Asante Samuel . . . and even Belichick didn't think he was worth re-signing. 

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Yeah, signing asante to a 6 year 60 million wasn't a good move for the future of your football team. As he showed in philly, he wasnt a corner stone player. Great move drafting him, and great move letting him walk.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Sure . . . the future was definitely bright with Ellis Hobbs and Jonathan Wilhite and Darius Butler out there instead. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Come on, prolate, that comment really isn't like you.  Asante Samuel had his talents as a ball hawk but he was not the best cover corner around and was a horrible tackler.  He wanted to get paid big money and he went where he could get it.  To suggest that BB dropped the ball by not re-signing Asante is inaccurate imo.

    With respect Hobbs, Wilhite and Butler, they were misses and everyone has acknowledged that. 

    [/QUOTE]

    The problem (and Belichick has done this before) is letting guys like Samuel go and not having replacements for them.  The secondary was a disaster until Talib got here.  The homers on this site dis Samuel all the time, but through about 2011 most people considered him a top-10 corner.  Was he perfect?  No.  But was he good--and far better than the dregs we were left with--yes.   

    I appreciate what BB does, but there's a sort of "BB does no wrong" attitude on this board, which really is silly.  We have been a very good regular season team for years now and BB deserves huge kudos for what he's done.  But we've been pretty mediocre in the playoffs other than in 2007.  Why is that?  The answer is, pure and simple, lesser talent. 

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Comparing BB's drafting to the competition.

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ATJ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Babe, that is not objective comparison, it is highly selective using your own critieria.

    Independent analysis using consistent criteria is contained here (yes, I know you don't like this one):

    http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/content/decade-the-making-the-ultimate-nfl-draft-grades/2419/

    They have no ax to grind, sir.  And regardless of your youth, you do.

    [/QUOTE]

    Hmmm . . . they say BB's best pick was Asante Samuel . . . and even Belichick didn't think he was worth re-signing. 

     

    [/QUOTE]


    There is no "they" in that article. It's one guy - Comey. And he admits that the far far far superior analyst Byrne disagrees right in the article itself.

    Here's the genius that wrote that garbage.

     

    http://c.fn.fncdn.com/images/userphotos/Z/201107051925/WKXcWL.JPG

     

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