DT's

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    DT's

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: DT's

    wow I wonder what some folks are watching. The plan wasnt really to run but when Carolina wanted to move the chains with their backs, they usually did. Soap hasnt done much but just give us another body to throw in there but he didnt make the stat sheet. Vellano is a hard worker but overwhelmed a lot in run situations as well as CJ. I say why not. You are already sitting guys like Collins and Buchanan because they cant contain the edge even though they could have helped. 

    It could also be that AJ hasnt shown much( i didnt even know he was still here). I dont see why Fortson and Francis arent activated if they are healthy. It was very puzzling to not see collins on the field. I have to think these guys just arent doing things right. There was good reason to start the game w/Spikes and HIghtower but as the game went on, it was obvious Hightower was innefective and Spikes was doing the job. They didnt want to run that much, rather they attacked our secondary and the edges exposed our man coverage with QB scrambles. Their plan was never to run like they normally do.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TripleOG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    wow I wonder what some folks are watching. The plan wasnt really to run but when Carolina wanted to move the chains with their backs, they usually did. Soap hasnt done much but just give us another body to throw in there but he didnt make the stat sheet. Vellano is a hard worker but overwhelmed a lot in run situations as well as CJ. I say why not. You are already sitting guys like Collins and Buchanan because they cant contain the edge even though they could have helped. 

    It could also be that AJ hasnt shown much( i didnt even know he was still here). I dont see why Fortson and Francis arent activated if they are healthy. It was very puzzling to not see collins on the field. I have to think these guys just arent doing things right. There was good reason to start the game w/Spikes and HIghtower but as the game went on, it was obvious Hightower was innefective and Spikes was doing the job. They didnt want to run that much, rather they attacked our secondary and the edges exposed our man coverage with QB scrambles. Their plan was never to run like they normally do.

    [/QUOTE]

    Fletcher over Collins is not puzzling at all. BB isn't going to drop Collins into a 3-4 as a subpackage guy especially when he wants the run contained. How many rookies do you want playing on this D?

    Hightower was ineffective? How many mid range/mid field plays did Carolina's passing game slash us for? Not many.

    What games do you watch here?  It was 10-3 at the half and then NE took the game over in the 4th.

    If RIdley does not fumble early, we win that one going away.

    [/QUOTE]


    I love your expert analysis on Hightower's play - kind of reminds me of your expert analysis of Chung's play all those years. Let me guess, any plays made in the "mid range" part of the field weren't his fault and any plays he made were pro bowl worthy? Sound about right?

    All we know about Hightower at this point in his career is that he's fat, slow, can't cover and was embarrassed by the freaken NY Jets a few weeks ago. We also know he almost was faked out of his jock strap by Newton Monday night, and here's the thing, when most people say "faked out of their jock strap" they are just kidding...he really almost was. Two years into the league and I don't ever recall someone doing so little (hell even Chung did more/showed more...Maroney too). This guy makes me long for the days of Merriweather...you remember that guy? He was the second best safety in the AFC according to you. 

    This guy better start taking his head out of his fat ASZ. He needs to stay away from the free lunch after practice too. Next week the media will start asking Bill about his play, because only a blind person can't see how he is doing and Bill will say, "I think he does a lot of good things for this team , he's a smart kid, he works hard, he does everything we have asked of him...does he need to improve? Well we all could say that, but I think he's doing a good job". You will fall for it hook line and sinker, like you always do. I guarantee within the next two weeks this type of thing will happen. 

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to TripleOG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    wow I wonder what some folks are watching. The plan wasnt really to run but when Carolina wanted to move the chains with their backs, they usually did. Soap hasnt done much but just give us another body to throw in there but he didnt make the stat sheet. Vellano is a hard worker but overwhelmed a lot in run situations as well as CJ. I say why not. You are already sitting guys like Collins and Buchanan because they cant contain the edge even though they could have helped. 

    It could also be that AJ hasnt shown much( i didnt even know he was still here). I dont see why Fortson and Francis arent activated if they are healthy. It was very puzzling to not see collins on the field. I have to think these guys just arent doing things right. There was good reason to start the game w/Spikes and HIghtower but as the game went on, it was obvious Hightower was innefective and Spikes was doing the job. They didnt want to run that much, rather they attacked our secondary and the edges exposed our man coverage with QB scrambles. Their plan was never to run like they normally do.

    [/QUOTE]

    Fletcher over Collins is not puzzling at all. BB isn't going to drop Collins into a 3-4 as a subpackage guy especially when he wants the run contained. How many rookies do you want playing on this D?

    Hightower was ineffective? How many mid range/mid field plays did Carolina's passing game slash us for? Not many.

    What games do you watch here?  It was 10-3 at the half and then NE took the game over in the 4th.

    If RIdley does not fumble early, we win that one going away.

    [/QUOTE]


    I love your expert analysis on Hightower's play - kind of reminds me of your expert analysis of Chung's play all those years. Let me guess, any plays made in the "mid range" part of the field weren't his fault and any plays he made were pro bowl worthy? Sound about right?

    All we know about Hightower at this point in his career is that he's fat, slow, can't cover and was embarrassed by the freaken NY Jets a few weeks ago. We also know he almost was faked out of his jock strap by Newton Monday night, and here's the thing, when most people say "faked out of their jock strap" they are just kidding...he really almost was. Two years into the league and I don't ever recall someone doing so little (hell even Chung did more/showed more...Maroney too). This guy makes me long for the days of Merriweather...you remember that guy? He was the second best safety in the AFC according to you. 

    This guy better start taking his head out of his fat ASZ. He needs to stay away from the free lunch after practice too. Next week the media will start asking Bill about his play, because only a blind person can't see how he is doing and Bill will say, "I think he does a lot of good things for this team , he's a smart kid, he works hard, he does everything we have asked of him...does he need to improve? Well we all could say that, but I think he's doing a good job". You will fall for it hook line and sinker, like you always do. I guarantee within the next two weeks this type of thing will happen. 

    [/QUOTE]

    smh, its amazing how a guy gets drunk, sees something diff. from everyone else and thinks others dont see it. I dont get drunk during the game so I can see. I was excited for Hightower because of everyone telling me about his 2nd year leap but he aint gonna cut it here as a LB. If BB is smart he will protect his 1st round investment with a position change ala McCourty to FS. Hightower needs to put his chubby hand on the ground and rush the passer and occasionally drop into coverage. He is slow on his run reads and I counted 3 times he was half jogging to the ball before the whistle. He made Spikes look like Usain Bolt monday night. Horrible play the last few weeks for a 1st rounder and I liked him but its obvious now, he has NO instincts to play the middle and needs to be put on the line or dealt! Maybe Pittsburgh wants the next Levon Kirkland! I dont

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree 100%.  I can't believe some of the comments on this board defending their performance in this last game.  We hear that they intentionally sat back to stuff the run.  Except the Panthers still ran for over 100 yards and moved the chains throughout the game.  TD (clock-killing) drives of 90, 81, and 80 yards?  But the run defense has allowed over 100 yards since the ATL game.  That's a trend.  It looks like Vellano is wearing down (predictably).

    I'm ready to move on from Andre Carter too at DE.   He's lost his speed/strength.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: DT's

     

    18 runs to 28 passes. They changed their normal gameplan. They werent even trying to run on us. THey just ran to get 1st downs.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Mt Hurl, the real genuine fans here know I never said ANY of what you wrote above.  I said "SOMEONE" must thing Meriweather is the 2nd best FS in the AFC because he backed up the starter(Weddle) two years in a row.

    Awful players don't make Pro Bowls. Fact.

    As for Chung, I specifically he said he and Spikes would be needed in 2011 before we can judge the D.  He came back, and voila, the D played well in the 2011 postseason, a lot better than the offense did. That's a fact.  Then, I said Chung has to play a full 16 games in 2012 to even be considered to be re-signed here.

    That's it. That's all I have ever said on both players.  You idiots thought Meriweather would be Rodney and Chung the next Polamalu. Then, when it didn't happen, you would come in here and lash out like a clueless idiot.

    Lower your expectations.  Hightower is not the second coming of London Fletcher or some other quality Pro Bowl kind of a linebacker.   He's also only in his 2nd year playing on a D that has been absolutely throttled with injuries.

    Bottom line is, you idiots, you little dorky losers who apparently love the Pre KRaft era with Rod Rust, the Sullivans, etc, and can't see the forest for the trees, and you are so extreme in your analysis, you sound like uneducated fans, which clearly you are.

    Can Newton fakes a lot of defenders out of their jock straps, moron.  If you watched any other NFL games in this league, you'd know this.

    You also seem to know that our team, as bangged as it had been, is in the upper 5% of  teams in this league due to BB's teambuilding approach, which is something you mock daily here, too.

    Other teams lose one key player and their entire season craps the bed.  We lose 3, 4, 5 key players and we barely lose on the road to a hot team that needed some half baked fake call to beat us who the media claims is the best team in the league right now.

    Two years in the league?  Hightower had  a great rookie season last year. This year, he's been asked to take on the Mayo role which is not the sexy LB role here. It's why TCal, your stupid buddy was constantly ssaying he "sucks" all the time.  Then, he's gone and now it's the next guy on the list to scapegoat for you and your immature and childish little gang of morons.

    BB has coached this team for 14 years and you still don't get it. I'd be moritified if I was you.

    [/QUOTE]

    First off you did too say all those glorious things about all those players, you even went so far to say Chung shut down Antonio Gates all by himself. This is what you do...you lie...you back track and when the embarrassment gets to be too great, you lie and lash out at everybody. It's pathetic.

    As for Hightower, he's fat, he's slow, he's lazy, his technique sucks and he has done virtually nothing in his time here, but rest assured the next time he makes a tackle you will start a thread about it. Why? Because you don't understand football and you're pretty much the largest moron on the Internet.

    And don't make excuses about our injuries, you spent the last seven years telling the world we build for depth and we're not stupid like everyone else signing "big name free agents". Loser. And you also spent the last seven years telling the world how we save 5-10 million going into every season for situations like this...the good players are gone...we missed out on them again, bozo.

    So get your keyboard ready, Hightower is bound to run into some guy by accident one of these Sundays...you get that thread ready! 

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from patriotrain. Show patriotrain's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree 100%.  I can't believe some of the comments on this board defending their performance in this last game.  We hear that they intentionally sat back to stuff the run.  Except the Panthers still ran for over 100 yards and moved the chains throughout the game.  TD (clock-killing) drives of 90, 81, and 80 yards?  But the run defense has allowed over 100 yards since the ATL game.  That's a trend.  It looks like Vellano is wearing down (predictably).

    I'm ready to move on from Andre Carter too at DE.   He's lost his speed/strength.

    [/QUOTE]

    Umm, wow.

    Newton had that one scramble for like 30 yards. He had 62 total.  All on his athleticism. He does it every week.  I can always tell who watches the NFL games and who doesn't in this forum.

    D'Angelo Williams had 17 yards as the lead back.  This is a bad trend?  Sopaga clearly has been a nice pick up.  Teams now cannot run down the middle on us.

    Holding a rushing combo of any kind to under 80 yards is a wild success in an NFL game.  

    Like I predicted, a 3-4 was used for easier bottling up and lane containment for Newton. Success.

    He threw for a measly 209 yards. He as SACKED THREE TIMES.  If Ridley does not fumble, we win that game going away like 24-14 more maybe score more.  That was the ballgame right there. You can't go on the road and turn it over against a good team playing their SB. The same thing happened in Seattle last year.

    Carolina's D also allowed a long drive at the end of the game and they are supposed to be the best D in the NFL right now.

    So, what do you say about their D?   Can't have your cake and eat it too, frauds.

    They did not "move the chains" throughtout the game any more than we did on them. In fact, NE took over in the 4th qtr.

    [/QUOTE]

    seems to me harv is winning this one, makes a better arguement to me, ridley fumble not good, but pats one non call away from win, it seems to me the league does everything it can for home town to win, keeps the fan coming back , nfl losing integrity.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    Here's another sobering fact.  Denver has a better running game than Carolina.  Who knew that the Panthers "3-headed RB monster" was the reincarnation or Csonka-Morris-Kiick?

    But I know, since we have an immobile QB this time the plan will still be to sit back and maintain "lane integrity".   The D-Line will be pushed 2 yards off the LOS and then the ball carrier will carry them for another 3-5 yards.  If you can't get to the QB you must at the very least open up lanes for your LBs.  In case you haven't heard, PM is pretty good when you give him all day to throw.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Mt Hurl, the real genuine fans here know I never said ANY of what you wrote above.  I said "SOMEONE" must thing Meriweather is the 2nd best FS in the AFC because he backed up the starter(Weddle) two years in a row.

    Awful players don't make Pro Bowls. Fact.

    As for Chung, I specifically he said he and Spikes would be needed in 2011 before we can judge the D.  He came back, and voila, the D played well in the 2011 postseason, a lot better than the offense did. That's a fact.  Then, I said Chung has to play a full 16 games in 2012 to even be considered to be re-signed here.

    That's it. That's all I have ever said on both players.  You idiots thought Meriweather would be Rodney and Chung the next Polamalu. Then, when it didn't happen, you would come in here and lash out like a clueless idiot.

    Lower your expectations.  Hightower is not the second coming of London Fletcher or some other quality Pro Bowl kind of a linebacker.   He's also only in his 2nd year playing on a D that has been absolutely throttled with injuries.

    Bottom line is, you idiots, you little dorky losers who apparently love the Pre KRaft era with Rod Rust, the Sullivans, etc, and can't see the forest for the trees, and you are so extreme in your analysis, you sound like uneducated fans, which clearly you are.

    Can Newton fakes a lot of defenders out of their jock straps, moron.  If you watched any other NFL games in this league, you'd know this.

    You also seem to know that our team, as bangged as it had been, is in the upper 5% of  teams in this league due to BB's teambuilding approach, which is something you mock daily here, too.

    Other teams lose one key player and their entire season craps the bed.  We lose 3, 4, 5 key players and we barely lose on the road to a hot team that needed some half baked fake call to beat us who the media claims is the best team in the league right now.

    Two years in the league?  Hightower had  a great rookie season last year. This year, he's been asked to take on the Mayo role which is not the sexy LB role here. It's why TCal, your stupid buddy was constantly ssaying he "sucks" all the time.  Then, he's gone and now it's the next guy on the list to scapegoat for you and your immature and childish little gang of morons.

    BB has coached this team for 14 years and you still don't get it. I'd be moritified if I was you.

    [/QUOTE]

    First off you did too say all those glorious things about all those players, you even went so far to say Chung shut down Antonio Gates all by himself. This is what you do...you lie...you back track and when the embarrassment gets to be too great, you lie and lash out at everybody. It's pathetic.

    As for Hightower, he's fat, he's slow, he's lazy, his technique sucks and he has done virtually nothing in his time here, but rest assured the next time he makes a tackle you will start a thread about it. Why? Because you don't understand football and you're pretty much the largest moron on the Internet.

    And don't make excuses about our injuries, you spent the last seven years telling the world we build for depth and we're not stupid like everyone else signing "big name free agents". Loser. And you also spent the last seven years telling the world how we save 5-10 million going into every season for situations like this...the good players are gone...we missed out on them again, bozo.

    So get your keyboard ready, Hightower is bound to run into some guy by accident one of these Sundays...you get that thread ready! 

    [/QUOTE]

    In man coverage he did that day.  Sure. But, BB mixes zone and man, usually using zone before Talib got here, Cupcake.

    Hightower is now "fat", huh? THat's a new one. Do you just ask your students for new material so you can come on here with some new stuff, Cupcake?

    We're 7-3 with a decimated D and you don't think that is a testament to BB's depth? Are you this dumb? LOL!

    I've already mentioned the cap hell teams who are multiple games under .500 who wasted picks left and right in recent years and swapped huge chunks of their rosters, no failing.

    You could not be any more wrong on that topic.  You lost, dummy.  We lose a key player, another guy steps in. FACT.

    That's the genius of BB. It has no bearing on me being disappointed or annoyed that after a Bye some key players can't shake the injury bug.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    The "cap hell" teams that are losing all have one thing in common...they don't have Brady and they don't have Belichick the coach. You remember those two right? Those two are the reson we win...despite you blaming Brady and questioning coaching decisions every week, they are why we win. It's not because of Kyle (let me discover new ways to lose games for us) Arrington, it's not because of fat boy Hightower...or the boat loads of free agent and draft busts. Sorry that you haven't figured that out yet...you sure you have a 152 IQ? LOL!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree 100%.  I can't believe some of the comments on this board defending their performance in this last game.  We hear that they intentionally sat back to stuff the run.  Except the Panthers still ran for over 100 yards and moved the chains throughout the game.  TD (clock-killing) drives of 90, 81, and 80 yards?  But the run defense has allowed over 100 yards since the ATL game.  That's a trend.  It looks like Vellano is wearing down (predictably).

    I'm ready to move on from Andre Carter too at DE.   He's lost his speed/strength.

    [/QUOTE]

    Cat, I have to ask you. Based on what you are saying here, and on some other threads, did you really watch the game? It's ok if you didn't. In fact I prefer that you did not, because if you say you did watch the game, you are either blind, or have no clue what is going on during a football game. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...




    I agree 100%.  I can't believe some of the comments on this board defending their performance in this last game.  We hear that they intentionally sat back to stuff the run.  Except the Panthers still ran for over 100 yards and moved the chains throughout the game.  TD (clock-killing) drives of 90, 81, and 80 yards?  But the run defense has allowed over 100 yards since the ATL game.  That's a trend.  It looks like Vellano is wearing down (predictably).

    I'm ready to move on from Andre Carter too at DE.   He's lost his speed/strength.

    [/QUOTE]

    You can not be serious.

    62 of that 103 you speak of came from Newton on broken lane containment of the OUTSIDE players during a pocket breakdown on just a couple plays.

    Also one "amazing" individual effort that they got beat on even though they played it correctly. You tip your hat on those plays to just a superior athelete. Exactly how successful do you really think a big fat piece of beef would have done chasing Cam Newton???

    Not to mention that NO linebackers cleaned up the lost containment in short order.

    Mike Tolbert 2.8 ypc

    Deangelo Williams 2.3 ypc

    Jonathan Stewart 2.5 ypc

    Did not seem like the DT's were a problem to me. Especially since it seemed to be a big worry going into the game.

    Newton 7 attempts

    1st - over the left end for 4 yds

    2nd - over right guard for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    3rd - Pocket scramble over left end for 24 yds (so of the 62 he had, 24 can on ONE play)

    4th - pocket scramble over left end for 14 yards (so HALF of Netwons total rushing yards came on TWO plays)

    5th - pocket scramble over left tackle for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    6th - pocket scramble around right end for 15 yards (so 53 of 62 yards came on THREE plays, all pocket scrambles)

    7th - designed QB eeper up the middle for 3yds (DTs allowed 3 yds)

    Can you explain to me eactly looking at all of this where the DT's were a problem? Especially in the RUN! And why would you thinking adding another big fat guy to the middle would improved the pass rush, if that is your point?

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Cat, I have to ask you. Based on what you are saying here, and on some other threads, did you really watch the game? It's ok if you didn't. In fact I prefer that you did not, because if you say you did watch the game, you are either blind, or have no clue what is going on during a football game. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Sadly, I watched the whole thing.  You?

    I mean, on another thread you said they weren't trying to collapse the pocket, like that was a good idea.   You always try to collapse the pocket.   That's where pocket QBs are after all.  That does NOT mean flushing him out to run necessarily.  Secondly, as I said above, if you can't get to the QB as a DT, you sure as heck better be able to open a lane for your LBs.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Cat, I have to ask you. Based on what you are saying here, and on some other threads, did you really watch the game? It's ok if you didn't. In fact I prefer that you did not, because if you say you did watch the game, you are either blind, or have no clue what is going on during a football game. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Sadly, I watched the whole thing.  You?

    I mean, on another thread you said they weren't trying to collapse the pocket, like that was a good idea.   You always try to collapse the pocket.   That's where pocket QBs are after all.  That does NOT mean flushing him out to run necessarily.  Secondly, as I said above, if you can't get to the QB as a DT, you sure as heck better be able to open a lane for your LBs.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Cat, the game plan was to stop the run. they did. the plan was superb, and the DL executed the game plan perfectly. The 3 DT's are not capable of collapsing the pocket AND stopping the run. They stopped the run game. Perfect execution. Notice it was the ends that were missing Cam when he was scrambling? Jones, Nink, Carter.

    Maybe 2 or 3 other NFL QB's can do what Cam did in that game. Otherwise, the Pats win the game 27-14 or 31-14 IMO...

    Thats is why in my other threads I said this game wasnt on the refs...Pats should not have allowed iot to come down to the last play...the fumble, the penalties, the missed tackle on Ginn...those 4-5 plays were the game. Otherwise, imo the Pats 100% out played the Panthers in the Panthers SB game.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Cat, I have to ask you. Based on what you are saying here, and on some other threads, did you really watch the game? It's ok if you didn't. In fact I prefer that you did not, because if you say you did watch the game, you are either blind, or have no clue what is going on during a football game. 

    [/QUOTE]

    Sadly, I watched the whole thing.  You?

    I mean, on another thread you said they weren't trying to collapse the pocket, like that was a good idea.   You always try to collapse the pocket.   That's where pocket QBs are after all.  That does NOT mean flushing him out to run necessarily.  Secondly, as I said above, if you can't get to the QB as a DT, you sure as heck better be able to open a lane for your LBs.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    BB's defense rushes with "control" especially against extremely gifted athletes who are obviously a potential threat with their legs.

    Pats sacked Newton 3 times and he was forced to scrambled at least 4 others times. I do not know what the hurries were.

    So without even knowing the hurries, that is at least 7 times the Pats collapsed the pocket.

    The Panthers only had 7 posessions in the entire game and one of those was only a TWO play drive to end the 1st half.

    I am not sure what an average NFL ratio is for this but this seems pretty good to me.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Can you explain to me eactly looking at all of this where the DT's were a problem? Especially in the RUN! And why would you thinking adding another big fat guy to the middle would improved the pass rush, if that is your point?

     [/QUOTE]

    A DT that could actually move his man back into the pocket or into the QB would be a good thing.  This isn't rocket science.   I understand that VW and Kelly are out.  Do you really think if either of those guys were healthy they'd be satisfied with no push, getting pushed back themselves, and opening no lane to the QB for the LBs, thereby giving Newton all day to decide what he wanted to do?

    The injuries are horrible.  That doesn't mean we grade the replacements easier.  We grade on performance.  The performance was sub-par.

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    How about this? We got hosed at the end and the lone turnover by Ridley was really the difference in the game.

    [/QUOTE]

    Not really the topic of the thread, but no, the Ridley turnover was not the difference.   The Pats came back to take the lead with 6 minutes left in the 4th quarter.   With the game in the balance the Panthers moved 83 yards for a TD.   That's bend AND break, just like the last SB.  And much like the last SB, the Pats had SIX offensive possessions before their last 59 second desperation drive.  SIX possessions requires perfection on offense to win.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Harvey-Wallbanger's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    False. Arrington and a nagging groin injury that he can't shake or Talib off the field are not really avoidable situations.

    Ridley fumbling again....IS.

    Case closed.

    If we had run that thing into the end zone on one of the next handful of plays, Carolina has no clock left at the end.

    Turnovers in playoff games, on the road, in SBs, are NOT a good thing.  The game is more than just the last 2 minutes, little guy.

    It's what you do through all 4 qtrs that matter. You must be new to football.

    [/QUOTE]

    Ridley fumbled.

    The Pats came back and took the lead.

    Ridley did not fumble after the Pats took the lead.

    In the end the Pats lost.

    Therefore, Ridley was not the cause of the defeat.  He was the cause of a failed 1st half drive.

    You're welcome.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     


    A DT that could actually move his man back into the pocket or into the QB would be a good thing.  This isn't rocket science.   I understand that VW and Kelly are out.  Do you really think if either of those guys were healthy they'd be satisfied with no push, getting pushed back themselves, and opening no lane to the QB for the LBs, thereby giving Newton all day to decide what he wanted to do?

    The injuries are horrible.  That doesn't mean we grade the replacements easier.  We grade on performance.  The performance was sub-par.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This is the same insanity people made about the defense in the last superbowl. Expecting an average defense at best to suddenly transform into the steel curtain just because it is the superbowl.

    As a coach you know what the strengths and weaknesses are of your team and know just what you can reasonably expect out of a player or unit based on those realistic expectations and then game plan according to those.

    You would never, or at least I would never, say hey we have 6 number ones or starters out but we can accomplish and "expect" the same exact things from the Number 2's or backups. NO need to game plan around that, we'll just carry on as if our best players on defense aren't really on IR.

    If you live your life like that you must seriously "always" be disappointed about many things.

    I felt the DT's played to their potential and abilities very well (That was before going over the play by play and stats, which only confirmed my general feeling). As well as most likely their specific marching orders/roles given to them. If you are asking me if they played as well as Wilfork and Kelly are capable of playing.... heck NO! ...but "I" would not have that expectation. Honestly who would do that to themselves?

    As a coach I would also never say to myself, hey you know what, the guys I have tabbed as the current active starters at DT that I work with and see every day did not play as well as Wilfork and Kelly are capable of so let me go backwards all the way to the backups backups and see how they play. Makes zero sense, unless you had a specific hunch for a very specific match-up in mind. (Like maybe the Broncos had a guard or center that was a rookie or 2nd year player and Francis had a field day against him in a match-up in college or something) Otherwise it makes ZERO sense to me.

    Just my opinion but I think you are setting yourself up for a lot of disappointment "IF" that is how you approach your expectations for the Pats in general.

    Also just as an aside, it is also why I felt people complaining about McCourtey were off base this past game as well. I would be surprised if his roles and responsibilities were not expanded and he was leaned on more because of the overall depletion's around him. That sets him up fora more difficult set of tasks and more exposure to the typical fan who does not know any of the game plan or responsibilities of it.

    ...but again that's just my own opinion and thought process on the matter. 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree 100%.  I can't believe some of the comments on this board defending their performance in this last game.  We hear that they intentionally sat back to stuff the run.  Except the Panthers still ran for over 100 yards and moved the chains throughout the game.  TD (clock-killing) drives of 90, 81, and 80 yards?  But the run defense has allowed over 100 yards since the ATL game.  That's a trend.  It looks like Vellano is wearing down (predictably).

     

    I'm ready to move on from Andre Carter too at DE.   He's lost his speed/strength.

    [/QUOTE]

    You can not be serious.

    62 of that 103 you speak of came from Newton on broken lane containment of the OUTSIDE players during a pocket breakdown on just a couple plays.

    Also one "amazing" individual effort that they got beat on even though they played it correctly. You tip your hat on those plays to just a superior athelete. Exactly how successful do you really think a big fat piece of beef would have done chasing Cam Newton???

    Not to mention that NO linebackers cleaned up the lost containment in short order.

    Mike Tolbert 2.8 ypc

    Deangelo Williams 2.3 ypc

    Jonathan Stewart 2.5 ypc

    Did not seem like the DT's were a problem to me. Especially since it seemed to be a big worry going into the game.

    Newton 7 attempts

    1st - over the left end for 4 yds

    2nd - over right guard for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    3rd - Pocket scramble over left end for 24 yds (so of the 62 he had, 24 can on ONE play)

    4th - pocket scramble over left end for 14 yards (so HALF of Netwons total rushing yards came on TWO plays)

    5th - pocket scramble over left tackle for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    6th - pocket scramble around right end for 15 yards (so 53 of 62 yards came on THREE plays, all pocket scrambles)

    7th - designed QB eeper up the middle for 3yds (DTs allowed 3 yds)

    Can you explain to me eactly looking at all of this where the DT's were a problem? Especially in the RUN! And why would you thinking adding another big fat guy to the middle would improved the pass rush, if that is your point?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I was going to bring up exactly the same point. You beat me to it.

    I think replacing the interior DL would be a gross overreaction to the game outcome on Monday. But actually, it's a reaction to the wrong game factor. What drove Carolina's ypc was Newton. Unless we expect Peyton to go Newton on the Pats this weekend, Catfish ahd this wrong.

    IMO, if the DTs do as good a job against Denver RBs as they did against CAR RBs, the run D will be fine.

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    This is the same insanity people made about the defense in the last superbowl. Expecting an average defense at best to suddenly transform into the steel curtain just because it is the superbowl.

    As a coach you know what the strengths and weaknesses are of your team and know just what you can reasonably expect out of a player or unit based on those realistic expectations and then game plan according to those.

    You would never, or at least I would never, say hey we have 6 number ones or starters out but we can accomplish and "expect" the same exact things from the Number 2's or backups. NO need to game plan around that, we'll just carry on as if our best players on defense aren't really on IR.

    If you live your life like that you must seriously "always" be disappointed about many things.

    I felt the DT's played to their potential and abilities very well (That was before going over the play by play and stats, which only confirmed my general feeling). As well as most likely their specific marching orders/roles given to them. If you are asking me if they played as well as Wilfork and Kelly are capable of playing.... heck NO! ...but "I" would not have that expectation. Honestly who would do that to themselves?

    As a coach I would also never say to myself, hey you know what, the guys I have tabbed as the current active starters at DT that I work with and see every day did not play as well as Wilfork and Kelly are capable of so let me go backwards all the way to the backups backups and see how they play. Makes zero sense, unless you had a specific hunch for a very specific match-up in mind. (Like maybe the Broncos had a guard or center that was a rookie or 2nd year player and Francis had a field day against him in a match-up in college or something) Otherwise it makes ZERO sense to me.

    Just my opinion but I think you are setting yourself up for a lot of disappointment "IF" that is how you approach your expectations for the Pats in general.

    Also just as an aside, it is also why I felt people complaining about McCourtey were off base this past game as well. I would be surprised if his roles and responsibilities were not expanded and he was leaned on more because of the overall depletion's around him. That sets him up fora more difficult set of tasks and more exposure to the typical fan who does not know any of the game plan or responsibilities of it.

    ...but again that's just my own opinion and thought process on the matter. 

    [/QUOTE]

    I never said the DT's weren't playing hard or to their potential.   I just said they aren't playing well enough.  They are inexperienced and may develop over time.  But right now is all that matters.

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: DT's

    Guys, maybe it would be better to shift the topic a little bit and share your opinions on which adjustments would help defend against a Manning led D.

    I would not have said this before Manning's neck issues, but now that he seems a different QB to me, I am inclined to gamble and focus on defending the quick passes underneath, and force him to try making the long passes in the cold NWE weather.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from CatfishHunter. Show CatfishHunter's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to seattlepat70's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Guys, maybe it would be better to shift the topic a little bit and share your opinions on which adjustments would help defend against a Manning led D.

    I would not have said this before Manning's neck issues, but now that he seems a different QB to me, I am inclined to gamble and focus on defending the quick passes underneath, and force him to try making the long passes in the cold NWE weather.

    [/QUOTE]


    There is another thread on the Pats-Broncos matchup.  Suffice to say I think they should play base-nickel on defense.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree 100%.  I can't believe some of the comments on this board defending their performance in this last game.  We hear that they intentionally sat back to stuff the run.  Except the Panthers still ran for over 100 yards and moved the chains throughout the game.  TD (clock-killing) drives of 90, 81, and 80 yards?  But the run defense has allowed over 100 yards since the ATL game.  That's a trend.  It looks like Vellano is wearing down (predictably).

     

    I'm ready to move on from Andre Carter too at DE.   He's lost his speed/strength.

    [/QUOTE]

    You can not be serious.

    62 of that 103 you speak of came from Newton on broken lane containment of the OUTSIDE players during a pocket breakdown on just a couple plays.

    Also one "amazing" individual effort that they got beat on even though they played it correctly. You tip your hat on those plays to just a superior athelete. Exactly how successful do you really think a big fat piece of beef would have done chasing Cam Newton???

    Not to mention that NO linebackers cleaned up the lost containment in short order.

    Mike Tolbert 2.8 ypc

    Deangelo Williams 2.3 ypc

    Jonathan Stewart 2.5 ypc

    Did not seem like the DT's were a problem to me. Especially since it seemed to be a big worry going into the game.

    Newton 7 attempts

    1st - over the left end for 4 yds

    2nd - over right guard for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    3rd - Pocket scramble over left end for 24 yds (so of the 62 he had, 24 can on ONE play)

    4th - pocket scramble over left end for 14 yards (so HALF of Netwons total rushing yards came on TWO plays)

    5th - pocket scramble over left tackle for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    6th - pocket scramble around right end for 15 yards (so 53 of 62 yards came on THREE plays, all pocket scrambles)

    7th - designed QB eeper up the middle for 3yds (DTs allowed 3 yds)

    Can you explain to me eactly looking at all of this where the DT's were a problem? Especially in the RUN! And why would you thinking adding another big fat guy to the middle would improved the pass rush, if that is your point?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This is consistent with what I remember.  I hope to watch the film later this week, but I posted on Monday that I thought the problem was on the edges, with Nink and Jones overcommitting inside to attempt the sack and losing contain.  I thought Sopoaga was pretty stout in the middle.  Maybe I missed something (I had to work while I was watching), but I thought the middle of the line looked a bit better with Sopoaga there.  

     

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from seattlepat70. Show seattlepat70's posts

    Re: DT's

    In response to prolate0spheroid's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to CatfishHunter's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to wozzy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Bill bring AJ Francis or Sealver Silga up from the practice squad, whoever looks more ready to contribute or both.  I'd like to think Francis has more upside, but one thing we can be sure of is that we need more beef in the middle of our front. 

    Send either Fortson or Vellano down for a game, what's the worst that could happen...

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I agree 100%.  I can't believe some of the comments on this board defending their performance in this last game.  We hear that they intentionally sat back to stuff the run.  Except the Panthers still ran for over 100 yards and moved the chains throughout the game.  TD (clock-killing) drives of 90, 81, and 80 yards?  But the run defense has allowed over 100 yards since the ATL game.  That's a trend.  It looks like Vellano is wearing down (predictably).

     

    I'm ready to move on from Andre Carter too at DE.   He's lost his speed/strength.

    [/QUOTE]

    You can not be serious.

    62 of that 103 you speak of came from Newton on broken lane containment of the OUTSIDE players during a pocket breakdown on just a couple plays.

    Also one "amazing" individual effort that they got beat on even though they played it correctly. You tip your hat on those plays to just a superior athelete. Exactly how successful do you really think a big fat piece of beef would have done chasing Cam Newton???

    Not to mention that NO linebackers cleaned up the lost containment in short order.

    Mike Tolbert 2.8 ypc

    Deangelo Williams 2.3 ypc

    Jonathan Stewart 2.5 ypc

    Did not seem like the DT's were a problem to me. Especially since it seemed to be a big worry going into the game.

    Newton 7 attempts

    1st - over the left end for 4 yds

    2nd - over right guard for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    3rd - Pocket scramble over left end for 24 yds (so of the 62 he had, 24 can on ONE play)

    4th - pocket scramble over left end for 14 yards (so HALF of Netwons total rushing yards came on TWO plays)

    5th - pocket scramble over left tackle for 1 yd (DT gave up 1 yd)

    6th - pocket scramble around right end for 15 yards (so 53 of 62 yards came on THREE plays, all pocket scrambles)

    7th - designed QB eeper up the middle for 3yds (DTs allowed 3 yds)

    Can you explain to me eactly looking at all of this where the DT's were a problem? Especially in the RUN! And why would you thinking adding another big fat guy to the middle would improved the pass rush, if that is your point?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This is consistent with what I remember.  I hope to watch the film later this week, but I posted on Monday that I thought the problem was on the edges, with Nink and Jones overcommitting inside to attempt the sack and losing contain.  I thought Sopoaga was pretty stout in the middle.  Maybe I missed something (I had to work while I was watching), but I thought the middle of the line looked a bit better with Sopoaga there.  

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I would not even say they overcommitted. They were pretty tempered with their pass rush, obviously trying to be cautious of losing the edge to Newton. That said, they have to commit at some point, especially if they are getting close and it's already 3 secs past the snap and Newton is still holding the ball.

    Newton had three long runs.

    The long run was not a defensive breakdown. They did what they were supposed to do. It did not work because Newton overcame what they were supposed to do.

    One of two other long runs by Newton was also not a breakdown by Jones or Nink. It came to the point when they needed to pressure Newton. Newton was able to get around to his own left. The breakdown on that play was on Hightower. He was the one who dove in after seeing Jones rush in. He should have just supported Jones.

     

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