posted at 11/22/2013 4:23 PM EST
In response to rkarp's comment:
In response to TrueChamp's comment:
In response to rkarp's comment:
In response to wozzy's comment:
In response to ATJ's comment:
wozzy, respectfully, you know that's not factual.
Mayo - IR,
Dennard - out with knee,
Talib - not 100%,
Arrington - hampered by hamstring,
Gregory - out with thumb,
Moreover, there is no way of knowing that the changes that you are proposing will be an upgrade. I, for one, do not see them as that.
Talib and Arrington played, when Talib wasn't playing Dennard was, Mayo is the only significant loss... the reality is the DT's don't pass the eyeball test. Watch the last game if you have it recorded and strictly watch the middle of the D line, these guys get blown back at the snap of the ball or hit the wall when rushing with a single blocker removing them.
Both Kelly and Wilfork routinely demanded double teams... this can't be dismissed. We've been talking about whats wrong with the defense for about five years now, to start the season they dominate looking nothing like recent defenses, D tackles go down with injury and pass pressure up the middle disappears.
I love how we actually think two undrafted free agent DT's can replace two pro bowl caliber players and think there has been no drop off, even as the defensive stats drop dramatically. Defensive tackles in our system get zero credit, zero accolades, they are totally overlooked, it's always the linebackers and defensive backs "can't cover."
Football is won and lost in the trenches, you don't remove 700 pounds of All Pro mass in the middle and think that everything will be gravy. What we're seeing now is a domino effect that starts in the middle and is working it's way back. I'm not sure Francis and especially Siliga will help, but they have one thing that neither Vellano, Chris Jones or even Fortson have, pure mass.
I'd like to see Chris Jones out there, he has a non stop motor and seems to hold up better against the run but Vellano should be playing a back up role or in Canada.
I did watch the game live, and also watched the reply tape 2 times. Where I was able to watch the DL play, Soap was not pushed back. He did not penetrate, but he was able to play both gaps well imo. I also did not see Jones pushed back, also holding his ground. He also did not penetrate, but held his ground.
I firmly believe the DT's part of the game plan was to stop the run. Play both gaps, and don't try to shoot one of the gaps to get to Cam leaving a gaping hole to run thru. I thought Jones and Soap did a good job of following that plan.
I have made my thoughts regarding Vellano well known on other posts. I appreciate his effort and what he has done for the team. He is a great 5th or 6th player in a DT rotation. He is not a starter. He s/b on some ones practice squad this year.
IMO, the proof is in the non Cam rushing yards...Carolina's run game was stymied for the most part IMO.
I thought Nink and Jones brought very good edge pressure. I thought if Cam was not the QB, Pats could have had 6-7 sacks.
I saw the same thing as Karp in this game and agree the game plan was to hold containment on newton, but the inside pocket did not collapse enough which allowed him time to throw. This, I think is Wozzys point, that with VW and Kelly in there Newton would have had to rush more throws or pull the ball down sooner and try to find an outlet against Nink and Jones who both had great games imo.
once the DT's push the pocket they have given up 1 of the gaps, allowing the runner that gap. Spikes can only contain one gap, and Hightower is in pass coverage. Panthers get 160 plus yards on the ground, keeping the ball out of Bradys hands...
That simply was not the game plan against the Panthers.
Well they only had 100 yards rushing, and surely the plan was not to let cam stand still until somebody got open, so I don't understand your point. A pocket can collapse while maintaining gap responsibility. Not to mention it wasn't cams 60 rushing yards that killed us, it was his 3 passing tds to 3 different receiving threats, and steve smith handing talib his hat.