Re: Ellis and the Jets
posted at 5/17/2010 5:12 PM EDT
In Response to Re: Ellis and the Jets
In Response to Re: Ellis and the Jets :
Where to start? Here's the thing. True NFL money information is not easy to track down as playing stats. And I am certainly not in the know about what is going to happen with the CBA. However, most agree on a few points. Although there is no cap in 2010, the amount of money teams spend is still important. This is one of the reasons why teams have not spent like crazy this off season. Most of the owners feel that there likely will be some form of a retroactive cap in place and teams over will face some type of penalty. The Jets, like every other NFL team, usually face tough economic decisions every year. Who in Patriot land was really that concerned about the patsies ability to sign their crop of FAs this offseason? This off season the Jets cleared a lot money between Rhodes, Jones, Faneca, & Lito, somewhere around 28 million. Even with the money taken on in LdT (incidentally, pretty much the same contract that Fred Taylor got from the Pats for a RB 3 years younger and much closer to his 1000, 1400 & 1800 yard seasons. Is Fred's contract a bad one too?), Cromatie, & Taylor etc, it's around 15-20 mil in savings.
Agree with most of your start, but on the last point, we are talking apples and oranges. You are the one trying to explain to us innocent and deluded fans how the Jets are going to manage all these economic issues, remaining with the leading rushing unit and defence. My general comment is that won't be possible. Not neccessarily that the LdT contract is bad, but that it will prove a reduction in value and performance, as will replacement in Ducasse for Faneca. Point above by Russ is relevant - where is the upside?
Without rookies contacts the 2010 Jets are about 20 million below 2009s cap number. Likely, the cap will not be lower than it has been. Of course, rookies need to be signed, not a big deal considering there are only 4 picks. The Jets have a lot of FAs next off season. Harris, Revis, Mangold coming off rookie contracts and then Cromartie & Edwards. That is clearly a lot of money to pay out, but it's a problem I love to have. An olineman, Dback, and LB that all need top money? Nice job MikeT. I like that they are all fairly young players. The Jets are currently working on the expiring rookie contracts. I suspect that they will get at least two if not all three done this year using this years 'cap room' or lack of cap to take some of the sting of those big deals.
Again, don't doubt that it is a nice problem to have and the first 3 players are worthwhile paying......however, money, money, money.....the Sanchize is very expensive and other players will look round at the cash and there will not be enough to pay all of them. Your theory that you can take the 'sting' out this year could prove ineffective, as discussions around the salary cap 2011 on has been predicated that big bonuses, etc paid in 2010 would count towards it in some manner - to avoid Snyder and others (errr Woody) loading up and taking the mickey this year. If it was this simple, do you not think Kraft would have backed up the money truck and dumped it on Brady's lawn by now???
Edwards & Cromartie will only get paid of they play well this year. I don't know the specifics of NE's salary information and don't care enough to try to find it, but the upcoming FAs are Tom Brady, Maroney, Faulk, Moss, Holt. I would think that Moss, Holt, Light, & maybe Faulk will be gone. That's a pretty good hit to the offense.
Light is ok. Proven and more athletic replacement already there in place (not untested rookie). WR / RB may well be an issue to update. I don't doubt the Pats have to manage their roster and finances as well, but we have proven that we can win things with a cast of nobodys (or as near as), thus whilst we might look to take a top notch receiver and RB early in next year's draft (you know with our two no.1 picks), even if we don't, our plug in and play ability can and does also work.
Maroney will want big money claiming that he almost gained 1000 yards in 2007.
LMAO. Huge LMAO.
Tom Brady, enough said. But I'll add this, he's not taking a pay cut to be 3000 miles away from his family. He'll get top 5 money.. 15 -20 mil a year? Tough decsions. Regarding this accusation of going the free agency route. Sure the Jets have signed some good players they didn't draft. Surely you are not suggesting that the Patriots have done something different.
Absolutely not. But to keep all FA and resign your expensive talent is not possible. Everyone uses the FA system, but the last while, you have relinquished the possibility for cheap rookie contracts by sacrificing draft picks. This will ultimately come back to haunt. Look, our differences may be a matter of personal preference. You have suffered so much with so little success that a quick run with the hope of a SB run in the next two years is more important than long-term strategy and the intention of putting out a competitive and top-10 team (at worst) year on year.
Leigh Bodden, Fred Taylor, Junior (resigned), Tully, Chris Baker, Shawn Springs, Burgess, Ty Warren all just last year. Then off course there's AD, Lamont Jordan, Stallworth,Washington.... the list goes on and on. Take just a few of those contacts, AD, Bodden, & Tully amounted to about 75 million. That is some FA spending. The Jets have used FAs signings to be core players, supplement drafted core players, bridge gaps, and provide depth. You cannot build a team just through the draft or just through FAs. The Jets have a solid mix.
To address some specific comments: V.W - top nose tackle - thank you VW may very well be the best NT. Unfortunately, he chose to show that by having worse numbers than a backup NT for the Jets, starting for the first time in his career all in VWs contract year. Strange way to demonstrate being the best.
Please be joking. Please. I'm not even going there on this one. This is green tinted glasses, through green-tinted contact lenses, after far too many green pints of Guinness.
as they have gone down the free agent / money splashy way of building a team Let me get this right. Signing FAs who contribute to the team, Faneca, Pace, Jenkins, Farve (very good numbers until he tore his bicep), & Tony Richardson etc is flashy, but a bunch of FAs getting paid well but not producing is something not flashy - Chris Baker, AD, junior, Springs etc. That is just a bit hyprocritical.
Key word was the one in the middle. Team. Whatever the failures of the Pats use of FA from time to time (and I note that Pats successes / Jets failures are conveniently left out), what occured during AD / Seau period of FA - 18-1 / Conference Championship / two division titles / SB appearance / winning seasons each year. Again, our system has a proven success record, the Jets have not demonstrated the same with their approach. Therefore, I do not see that criticising your approach and questioning the long term benefits / possible success is at all hypocritical.
By the way, the Jets best moves have been trades. TJ for a swap of 2nd round picks with the Bears, Braylon, Cromartie, Holmes all trades not FAs.... not that it even matters, just clarifiing your slightly off target claims.
I apologise for my lack of clarity. As a paragon of accuracy, I am sure that troubled you immensely. Players acquired via trade also require contracts (and often expensive extensions) - particularly (as you so feverently desire) they perform successfully - Braylon / Cromartie / Holmes (when he gets on the field) - there will be questions over that last part.
Lastly, most new coaches tend to bring in players they feel more comfortable with or those that know their system. I'll just assume that I don't need to recap BBs wholesale changes in 2000 & 2001.
If Rex Ryan achieves the same result, I will duly doff my cap. Needless to say, I do not believe such a result is likely. Besides, the money train (coming in for final stop) started before Mr. Ryan started phoning around.....
a cut-price alternative (and abandon proven players) has already started to appear this off-season-/the way the Jets have treated proven performers this year, who seemed to be 'team' players, and the reported disquiet of some of the remaining players Who? Faneca?, Jones? Both were great for what they were. You don't pay players for what they did. you pay them for what they will do. Neither were huge cost savings in and of themselves, but both were old and solid replacements were already in place with Greene and Slausen.
Agreed that you pay for what they will do. But stop deluding yourself, there will be a drop off on what Jones / Faneca brought, to that of Greene / Slausen (Ducasse). That's the point. This will continue.
The other option is to try to get every last drop out of players. Seems that this often leads to old and slow (see Pats LBs 2008).
Come on. 11-5 record led by a second string QB and the LB's were 'old and slow'. They performed more than well enough that year. Please, even bring in some statistical evidence, or something. That is like me saying that the Jets QB last year was one of the worst performers in his position last year, with a god-awful TD/Int ratio......oh wait, that one is true.....
How unhappy do you think Mangold will be when he gets some of Faneca's cash?
This unlimited cash? Very. How much do you think he will believe (and be happy with) the Jets team when they display any prevarication or delay in negotiating or showing him the money (thanks Cuba Gooding Jr).....Hmmm...interesting......
your team is really only built for a one/two year run. Maybe, but the real core of this team, assuming next years FAs are resigned are young. Greene, Sanchez, Keller, Revis, Mangold, Brick, Harris are a strong foundation. This is without considering this years rookies.
Please note 'assuming'. Please note those core players whose rookie contracts are coming up for extension / replacement. Please refer to aforementioned unlimited cash. Just please.
many divisions, conferences, superbowls did that win for you last year. We are the AFC East Champions. We are the last AFC East team to win the Conference. We are the last AFC East team to make the Superbowl. We are the last AFC East team to win the Superbowl Ah yes, I hear this argument all the time from Yankee fans. Don't care the Yankees won it last year, don't care that they have 27 WS rings, don't care they they win the division most years. Do you? That's what I thought. Mostly, I don't care a thing about the Patriots past success. They are nowhere near the team they were.
....and the Jets are nowhere near the team, now (and soon to be dismantled / priced out) which you seem to believe they are. The general point is been there, done that and the team knows they can do it again. Until you have, until in some way the Jets win something and demonstrate a definite ability to be superior to the Pats, I'm afraid I cannot accept that your misguided beliefs are supportable.........and should (big should) the Jets surprise me and succeed next year, with a heavy heart I will congratulate them, congratulate the players and coaching team who will have worked bloody hard to get there (I won't be happy for them - don't push it) and will relish the feeling (rather unknown since 2001) of being the underdog with something to prove again.......but most importantly, I will not be trolling on NYJ sites seeking maliciously to annoy Jets fans......I have a life and better things to be doing.
Posted by bjesuss