GB Packers

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    Re: GB Packers

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

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    Yeah, great example.

    Here is a comparison. Matthews had 5 more sacks then Rob Ninkovich, but he also had 4 less FF's...you know turnovers? Only difference is Matthews now makes more money then most players in the LG, oh and Nink probably plays the run better.

    Bottom line it for you. If we paid a guy like Mario Williams to come in here and get 10 sacks a year for us at 100 million$ we wouldn't be able to "build a team".

    I Love the way BB builds the team that has won more games then any other for 13 years strong.

     



    Come on TC.  Ninkovich is an underrated player for this team imo, but Matthews got the contract he did and is a 2 time all pro for a reason.  The guy is a beast.  Do I think BB would have paid him as much as GB just did had we drafted him?  Probably not although perhaps he would have locked him up proactively.  But the guy was a good draft pick regardless.  I'll be honest.  I didn't want him because I thought he was a PED risk.

     

    I will say that I think we made out okay since we ended up with Gronk via a long combination of trades and it is impossible to know how it would have turned out otherwise, but Matthews is a great player.  No need to bash the guy to defend BB (and honestly it was pretty obvious to me that prolate was just dicking around).

     




     

    I'm not bashing Matthews, and when Prolate goes on a 3 year long mission of "bashing" BB's draft picks I don't consider it dicking around. Matthews is a great pass rusher. I disagree that he was effective against the run and have seen him get pushed around often watching packers games with my uncle(some reason is a die hard pack fan and not a Pats fan booooo).

    My point was that while Prolate continues to bash BB the GM I point out that Nink was nearly as effective rushing the QB while playing a role BB covets. A guy who can defend the run, rush the passer and drop back to get his hands in passing lanes. 5 FF's is nothing to sneeze at and I was surprised to see Clay only had 1.

    Who would you rather have if you are building a "TEAM"

    Nink at a few million or Matthews at 60 million?

    I am sure of who BB would choose.



    Except I never said the Pats should pay Matthews that kind of money.  But to deny he wouldn't have been an excellent draft pick is silly.  Look I've already said at the time I didn't want Matthews because I thought he was a PED risk.  I also think Ninkovich is a better player than a lot of people give him credit for.  But Matthews is a better player than Ninkovich and was also a bargain before he signed this extension (which is why he was a good draft pick).

     
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    Re: GB Packers

    In response to RidingWithTheKingII's comment:

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    I'm sure Packers fans would feel much better if the Packers had forgone Clay Matthews and instead gotten great value by trading down to sign Darius Butler and Brandon Tate. 

     

     




     

    Yeah, great example.

    Here is a comparison. Matthews had 5 more sacks then Rob Ninkovich, but he also had 4 less FF's...you know turnovers? Only difference is Matthews now makes more money then most players in the LG, oh and Nink probably plays the run better.

    Bottom line it for you. If we paid a guy like Mario Williams to come in here and get 10 sacks a year for us at 100 million$ we wouldn't be able to "build a team".

    I Love the way BB builds the team that has won more games then any other for 13 years strong.

     




    Irrationals exposed! You believe these people?? We have Nink at a fraction of the price...and what is five sacks anyway? Nothing. And this Mathews fellow - if we drafted him, we would eventually have to pay him for being one of the best pass rushers in the NFL...who wants to do that? It's about team building. Team. You sign a bunch of nobody's...they play hardly relevant for a year...then you get rid of them. It's low risk. Yeah you find yourself not really improving and having to do it all over again, but no one gets hurt...and in the end we can always just blame it on the quarterback.

     

    It's about being the smartest person in the room. What's a decade without winning a Super Bowl while having the best quarterback in the NFL? Exactly...nothing. Hell Marino never won a thing - we may never win a thing again, but our books are balanced...we're smarter than everyone and we are super safe. That's what matters most.

     



    "books are balanced"?

     

    Every time you open your mouth on the cap concepts, it proves how little you get it. You sound just like Felger or Mazz.

    This franchise makes millions every year and grows its revenues every year.  It has nothing to do with "balanced books".

    It has to do with a formula under a cap.  You stll haven't read Pats Management Secrets Vol 1 or 2?

    Why?

    You can get each for like $4 off Amazon, used.  Why won't you educate yourself? What are you so afraid of?

    There is really only one tried and true way to skin the cat as a successfull GM in this cap era, and BB invented it. Make no mistake. Sure, there are some variations, maybe you go off the path one year, maybe you tweak this or that, but generally speaking staying true to the formula is the big key.

    Who do you think Ozzie Newsome, Jerry Reese, etc, are mirroring? BB!

    How Tom Brady and the offense executes in SB 42 or SB 46 is irrelevant to that fact.



    Ozzie Newsome and Reese mirror Belichick in team building, salary cap management? Hmm...kind of interesting that you bash both of these guys and their signings. Belichcick himself would laugh himself silly litening to you try to rationalize some of the free agent mistakes we've made over the last five years. I'm sure he'd just love to hear your opinion on his offese and Tom brady as well. 

     
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    Re: GB Packers

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

     

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    Yeah, great example.

    Here is a comparison. Matthews had 5 more sacks then Rob Ninkovich, but he also had 4 less FF's...you know turnovers? Only difference is Matthews now makes more money then most players in the LG, oh and Nink probably plays the run better.

    Bottom line it for you. If we paid a guy like Mario Williams to come in here and get 10 sacks a year for us at 100 million$ we wouldn't be able to "build a team".

    I Love the way BB builds the team that has won more games then any other for 13 years strong.

     



    Come on TC.  Ninkovich is an underrated player for this team imo, but Matthews got the contract he did and is a 2 time all pro for a reason.  The guy is a beast.  Do I think BB would have paid him as much as GB just did had we drafted him?  Probably not although perhaps he would have locked him up proactively.  But the guy was a good draft pick regardless.  I'll be honest.  I didn't want him because I thought he was a PED risk.

     

    I will say that I think we made out okay since we ended up with Gronk via a long combination of trades and it is impossible to know how it would have turned out otherwise, but Matthews is a great player.  No need to bash the guy to defend BB (and honestly it was pretty obvious to me that prolate was just dicking around).

     




     

    I'm not bashing Matthews, and when Prolate goes on a 3 year long mission of "bashing" BB's draft picks I don't consider it dicking around. Matthews is a great pass rusher. I disagree that he was effective against the run and have seen him get pushed around often watching packers games with my uncle(some reason is a die hard pack fan and not a Pats fan booooo).

    My point was that while Prolate continues to bash BB the GM I point out that Nink was nearly as effective rushing the QB while playing a role BB covets. A guy who can defend the run, rush the passer and drop back to get his hands in passing lanes. 5 FF's is nothing to sneeze at and I was surprised to see Clay only had 1.

    Who would you rather have if you are building a "TEAM"

    Nink at a few million or Matthews at 60 million?

    I am sure of who BB would choose.

     



    Except I never said the Pats should pay Matthews that kind of money.  But to deny he wouldn't have been an excellent draft pick is silly.  Look I've already said at the time I didn't want Matthews because I thought he was a PED risk.  I also think Ninkovich is a better player than a lot of people give him credit for.  But Matthews is a better player than Ninkovich and was also a bargain before he signed this extension (which is why he was a good draft pick).

     




    I don't disagree with anything you have said. My original post was in response to a guy sarcastically saying BB would be happier with Butler, Tate etc... which is a B.S point of view. Those were positions of need at the time and he drafted accordingly but the guys didn't work out. They both are solid contributors on the teams they play for now though.

    And if we want to go down the path of revisionist history, we can ask who would we rather have Gronk or Matthews. Point being, the draft is a crap shoot but BB still compiles one of the most talented teams in the LG, year in and year out, despite what people like Mthurtl, babe and Prolate say.

    We are in fact talented, we do win games, and when you win as many games as we have in the regular season but fail to perform in the clutch then I say yes it is a result of the raping of our core coaching staff.

    People talk about a rebuild of our defense or other teams have to rebuild their core group of players(like the ravens right now/steelers/colts) but what about when you win more games then any other team in the LG and you lose all of your coaches? Does BB stands alone?

    No.

    We have talent, we have probably the most talented team in the LG from top to bottom over the last 10 years. Every GM misses on draft picks, but only a few GM's build a SB contender ever year....actually only 1 GM has. Bill Belichick.

     
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    Re: GB Packers

    In response to RidingWithTheKingII's comment:

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

     

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

     

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

     

    In response to pcmIV's comment:

     

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

     

     

    Yeah, great example.

    Here is a comparison. Matthews had 5 more sacks then Rob Ninkovich, but he also had 4 less FF's...you know turnovers? Only difference is Matthews now makes more money then most players in the LG, oh and Nink probably plays the run better.

    Bottom line it for you. If we paid a guy like Mario Williams to come in here and get 10 sacks a year for us at 100 million$ we wouldn't be able to "build a team".

    I Love the way BB builds the team that has won more games then any other for 13 years strong.

     



    Come on TC.  Ninkovich is an underrated player for this team imo, but Matthews got the contract he did and is a 2 time all pro for a reason.  The guy is a beast.  Do I think BB would have paid him as much as GB just did had we drafted him?  Probably not although perhaps he would have locked him up proactively.  But the guy was a good draft pick regardless.  I'll be honest.  I didn't want him because I thought he was a PED risk.

     

    I will say that I think we made out okay since we ended up with Gronk via a long combination of trades and it is impossible to know how it would have turned out otherwise, but Matthews is a great player.  No need to bash the guy to defend BB (and honestly it was pretty obvious to me that prolate was just dicking around).

     




     

    I'm not bashing Matthews, and when Prolate goes on a 3 year long mission of "bashing" BB's draft picks I don't consider it dicking around. Matthews is a great pass rusher. I disagree that he was effective against the run and have seen him get pushed around often watching packers games with my uncle(some reason is a die hard pack fan and not a Pats fan booooo).

    My point was that while Prolate continues to bash BB the GM I point out that Nink was nearly as effective rushing the QB while playing a role BB covets. A guy who can defend the run, rush the passer and drop back to get his hands in passing lanes. 5 FF's is nothing to sneeze at and I was surprised to see Clay only had 1.

    Who would you rather have if you are building a "TEAM"

    Nink at a few million or Matthews at 60 million?

    I am sure of who BB would choose.

     



    Except I never said the Pats should pay Matthews that kind of money.  But to deny he wouldn't have been an excellent draft pick is silly.  Look I've already said at the time I didn't want Matthews because I thought he was a PED risk.  I also think Ninkovich is a better player than a lot of people give him credit for.  But Matthews is a better player than Ninkovich and was also a bargain before he signed this extension (which is why he was a good draft pick).

     

     




     

    I don't disagree with anything you have said. My original post was in response to a guy sarcastically saying BB would be happier with Butler, Tate etc... which is a B.S point of view. Those were positions of need at the time and he drafted accordingly but the guys didn't work out. They both are solid contributors on the teams they play for now though.

    And if we want to go down the path of revisionist history, we can ask who would we rather have Gronk or Matthews. Point being, the draft is a crap shoot but BB still compiles one of the most talented teams in the LG, year in and year out, despite what people like Mthurtl, babe and Prolate say.

    We are in fact talented, we do win games, and when you win as many games as we have in the regular season but fail to perform in the clutch then I say yes it is a result of the raping of our core coaching staff.

    People talk about a rebuild of our defense or other teams have to rebuild their core group of players(like the ravens right now/steelers/colts) but what about when you win more games then any other team in the LG and you lose all of your coaches? Does BB stands alone?

    No.

    We have talent, we have probably the most talented team in the LG from top to bottom over the last 10 years. Every GM misses on draft picks, but only a few GM's build a SB contender ever year....actually only 1 GM has. Bill Belichick.

     



    But, they;ll spin your last sentence as it being becaue of Brady, which we both know isn't totally true. 

     

    Because when they use that one, I put to Brady's crappy postseasons, and then they say it's a TEAM thing (which I agree, overall, it is).

    LOL

    They'll try to spin in and out of what you just wrote, which is the truth, but don't let them spin out of it.

    The fact is, the media in 2009 in this town with Tony Mazz and Felger, 98.5 and the Pats coverage needed to flip the script and turn on BB as a way to get more hits on their columns.

    YEP.

    Since then, a fraction of our fanbase has bought into their garbage.  1 SB loss later and it's worse than ever and it ain't because of BB's drafts recently either.

    I'll leave it at that.




    Well, you should leave it at that, because without drectly saying it you make it sound like it is Brady's fault. Brady is a football player. I believe he does the best he can but without "mental toughness" for the team we do not win on the biggest stage. Mental toughness is a result of sound coaching imo. Brady still has ice water in his veins. Our team is young, offense and defense, our coaching staff is young. BB misses guys like Weiss, RAC, and even Mangini and McD until last year.

    Coordinators are very important to coaching.

    World English Dictionary coordinate or co-ordinate   vb 1. ( tr ) to organize or integrate (diverse elements) in a harmonious operation 2. to place (things) in the same class or order, or (of things) to be placed in the same class or order 3. ( intr ) to work together, esp harmoniously 4. ( intr ) to take or be in the form of a harmonious order 5. chem to form or cause to form a coordinate bond
     
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    Re: GB Packers

    If BB misses all those OCs and DCs so much why doesn't he rehire them? They've all been available at various times.  You guys make up all sorts of bizarre excuses to deny the obvious.  The Pats have talent gaps on defense and in select positions on offense.  Brady is not a problem.  Neither is the play calling.  Neither are the assistants BB hires.  The problem is guys who either aren't talented enough to be difference makers or are hurt when you need them most.  That's not an indictment of Belichick.  It's just the reality of having to build a team with low draft picks and a salary cap.  BB has gone with a value strategy that has kept him in the running year after year.  But as I said before, there's a trade off with this strategy and sometimes the lack of enough elite talent has hurt the Pats in playoff games. 

     

     
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