Glover Quin (S)

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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    I heard they will tag him...

    According to The Sideline View's Adam Caplan, the Texans "badly" want to re-sign free agent SS Glover Quin.
    We already knew keeping Quin was Houston's top in-house priority, but it's sounding like there's a good chance he's franchise tagged ahead of Monday's deadline if a long-term deal cannot be reached. The tag for safeties is an affordable $6.916 million.

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    Quin is like Hou version of McCourty. A former CB who was tossed back into the FS position and seemed to excel. He's a nice option but he's very similar to McCourty and provides the same play. If we are targetting S, which we should, imo we need to target a SS since we have McCourty or a vet to play the Harrison role of being a leader in the secondary and a mentor to McCourty. Reed fits the vet option but not the SS option. Moore or Goldson would fit the SS option. Another lower end name who might be interesting is Chris Clemons. A younger SS with decent coverage ability and was overall solid but the more important part only commited 2 penalties all year

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    Here is the thing.  Yesterday someone made the point that there really is no great safeties out there anymore.  You have a handful, but no true difference makers at leat IMO.  I really think you try and get CB's that make a difference.  Now I would obviously love a younger tandom of Quinn and McCourty for the next 5 years or so, but as we were talking about yesterday Russ I think Talib or a few good CB's is necessary going forward.  Maybe we should let Tavon Wilson prove why he was a 2nd round pick, and bring in a vet like Reed to share time back there.  Obviously if we singed Quin I would be extremely excited, but I still think CB is what is needed on this team.   

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    He is a good player. I saw good things from him the last couple years but he didnt do much in either of the games we played. Dont know if thats just Brady being Brady or if he just isnt that special and plays on a good D. I think he is a good player but just not the difference maker WE need. Good player but doesnt show up vs the better QBs

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to Getzo's comment:

     

    Here is the thing.  Yesterday someone made the point that there really is no great safeties out there anymore.  You have a handful, but no true difference makers at leat IMO.  I really think you try and get CB's that make a difference.  Now I would obviously love a younger tandom of Quinn and McCourty for the next 5 years or so, but as we were talking about yesterday Russ I think Talib or a few good CB's is necessary going forward.  Maybe we should let Tavon Wilson prove why he was a 2nd round pick, and bring in a vet like Reed to share time back there.  Obviously if we singed Quin I would be extremely excited, but I still think CB is what is needed on this team.   

     



    Well, I am thinking if they commit to Talib, whether it be long term or with the tag, that's upwards of 9 million in 2013 with probably around 5 for a Safety.

     

    They're going to need about 15 million, give or take, to apply to CB and Safety in order to solidify the secondary. Or, they think they can get a Safety or CB they really like in Rd 1, which is the other possibility, obviously. That just seems like more of a risk at this point, though.

     



    Maybe it's my frustration speaking, but I don't think I can wait or 'risk' TB's best years anymore.  The biggest issue on this D has been pass-rush and secondary.  They help eachother at different points of the games and throughout the year. 

    It's time to shore up the CB spots.  Pats finally drafted a good CB in Dennard, and I ahve no idea what happened to McCourty at that spot.  Good thing he found a place to play on this defense, and can play the CB spot in a pinch.  As I was saying I really hope they actually bring back Talib or 2 proven vets to be honest.  I really think Dunta Robinson would be a vet at a reasonable price...

    I understand your financial out look and it makes sense.  But do you really want to go into the season with question marks at CB again?  They have more talent at safety right now then they do corners.  And we both admitted the difference Talib brought to this D. 

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to Getzo's comment:

     

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    Here is the thing.  Yesterday someone made the point that there really is no great safeties out there anymore.  You have a handful, but no true difference makers at leat IMO.  I really think you try and get CB's that make a difference.  Now I would obviously love a younger tandom of Quinn and McCourty for the next 5 years or so, but as we were talking about yesterday Russ I think Talib or a few good CB's is necessary going forward.  Maybe we should let Tavon Wilson prove why he was a 2nd round pick, and bring in a vet like Reed to share time back there.  Obviously if we singed Quin I would be extremely excited, but I still think CB is what is needed on this team.   

     



    Well, I am thinking if they commit to Talib, whether it be long term or with the tag, that's upwards of 9 million in 2013 with probably around 5 for a Safety.

     

    They're going to need about 15 million, give or take, to apply to CB and Safety in order to solidify the secondary. Or, they think they can get a Safety or CB they really like in Rd 1, which is the other possibility, obviously. That just seems like more of a risk at this point, though.

     

     



    Maybe it's my frustration speaking, but I don't think I can wait or 'risk' TB's best years anymore.  The biggest issue on this D has been pass-rush and secondary.  They help eachother at different points of the games and throughout the year. 

     

    It's time to shore up the CB spots.  Pats finally drafted a good CB in Dennard, and I ahve no idea what happened to McCourty at that spot.  Good thing he found a place to play on this defense, and can play the CB spot in a pinch.  As I was saying I really hope they actually bring back Talib or 2 proven vets to be honest.  I really think Dunta Robinson would be a vet at a reasonable price...

    I understand your financial out look and it makes sense.  But do you really want to go into the season with question marks at CB again?  They have more talent at safety right now then they do corners.  And we both admitted the difference Talib brought to this D. 

     



    No, I don't. 

     

    Would you be happy with (and these are examples for discussion points) Derek Cox, Quin at Safety and resigning Arrington for the slot?

    They might be able to do something like that for under 10 million, giving each extended deals (2-3 years).

    I hate to bring it up, because with what you are saying which I agree with, Wes Welker sits there basically holding the team captive trying to address these kinds of positions in FA.

    It's sort of a catch 22. If you overpay Welker, then you can forget about two impact FAs at both S and CB.

    So, basically, Welker's desires in the market (rumored to be 10 mil per) are actually jeopardizing Tom Brady's SB desires.

     

     



    Ok I follow you... so bascially if they took the course of action on your first example I would be extremely happy, because they spent some money and at least tried to shore up the secondary with proven players.  Now I am not sure about Cox and how much of an impact he would make, but it shows me BB is ready to solidy the group.  That's all I can ask for as a fan.  Bring back the old school Patriots D that brought some fear and swagger.

    Going to your point about Welker.  If they sign Welker and that stops the Pats from making a move on safety then I am all for it, as long as the Pats still have money for a true number 1 CB.  I feel there is enough back there and it is time for Wilson to take the next step (2nd year BB says is the biggest year of improvement, right?).  That should be were the Pats take their calculated risk, or even better yet - bring in a reasonable priced vet like Reed or another camp casualty if you want more bodies there.  Get the impact CB for sure - and worry about the safety spot later. 

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to Getzo's comment:

     

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

     

    In response to Getzo's comment:

     

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

     

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    Here is the thing.  Yesterday someone made the point that there really is no great safeties out there anymore.  You have a handful, but no true difference makers at leat IMO.  I really think you try and get CB's that make a difference.  Now I would obviously love a younger tandom of Quinn and McCourty for the next 5 years or so, but as we were talking about yesterday Russ I think Talib or a few good CB's is necessary going forward.  Maybe we should let Tavon Wilson prove why he was a 2nd round pick, and bring in a vet like Reed to share time back there.  Obviously if we singed Quin I would be extremely excited, but I still think CB is what is needed on this team.   

     



    Well, I am thinking if they commit to Talib, whether it be long term or with the tag, that's upwards of 9 million in 2013 with probably around 5 for a Safety.

     

    They're going to need about 15 million, give or take, to apply to CB and Safety in order to solidify the secondary. Or, they think they can get a Safety or CB they really like in Rd 1, which is the other possibility, obviously. That just seems like more of a risk at this point, though.

     

     



    Maybe it's my frustration speaking, but I don't think I can wait or 'risk' TB's best years anymore.  The biggest issue on this D has been pass-rush and secondary.  They help eachother at different points of the games and throughout the year. 

     

    It's time to shore up the CB spots.  Pats finally drafted a good CB in Dennard, and I ahve no idea what happened to McCourty at that spot.  Good thing he found a place to play on this defense, and can play the CB spot in a pinch.  As I was saying I really hope they actually bring back Talib or 2 proven vets to be honest.  I really think Dunta Robinson would be a vet at a reasonable price...

    I understand your financial out look and it makes sense.  But do you really want to go into the season with question marks at CB again?  They have more talent at safety right now then they do corners.  And we both admitted the difference Talib brought to this D. 

     



    No, I don't. 

     

    Would you be happy with (and these are examples for discussion points) Derek Cox, Quin at Safety and resigning Arrington for the slot?

    They might be able to do something like that for under 10 million, giving each extended deals (2-3 years).

    I hate to bring it up, because with what you are saying which I agree with, Wes Welker sits there basically holding the team captive trying to address these kinds of positions in FA.

    It's sort of a catch 22. If you overpay Welker, then you can forget about two impact FAs at both S and CB.

    So, basically, Welker's desires in the market (rumored to be 10 mil per) are actually jeopardizing Tom Brady's SB desires.

     

     

     



    Ok I follow you... so bascially if they took the course of action on your first example I would be extremely happy, because they spent some money and at least tried to shore up the secondary with proven players.  Now I am not sure about Cox and how much of an impact he would make, but it shows me BB is ready to solidy the group.  That's all I can ask for as a fan.  Bring back the old school Patriots D that brought some fear and swagger.

     

    Going to your point about Welker.  If they sign Welker and that stops the Pats from making a move on safety then I am all for it, as long as the Pats still have money for a true number 1 CB.  I feel there is enough back there and it is time for Wilson to take the next step (2nd year BB says is the biggest year of improvement, right?).  That should be were the Pats take their calculated risk, or even better yet - bring in a reasonable priced vet like Reed or another camp casualty if you want more bodies there.  Get the impact CB for sure - and worry about the safety spot later. 

     



    With so many vet CBs available they should be able to get a good one at around 6. Ed Reed could be had for as low as 3 for just even 1 year. The question is, does Reed simply not want to leave Balt and play fo the vet minimum there or would he want to play for BB and leave the family behind at the end of his career?  Considering he just won a SB, I am wondering if he just stays put.


    So, it appears CB is the top priority over S which is not a bad thing. Just 2-3 years ago the going rate for a top CB was 10 million per, which was clearly ridiculous.

     

     

     

     




    I agree and that's why Asante is no longer a Pat.  But inshort yes - CB is a priority over safety.  I would say WR is a priority over safety right now for me. 

    CB - WR(Because we only have Slater, lol) - Dline (pass-rush) - Oline (Vollmer) - Safety

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to TripleOG's comment:

     

    He is a good player. I saw good things from him the last couple years but he didnt do much in either of the games we played. Dont know if thats just Brady being Brady or if he just isnt that special and plays on a good D. I think he is a good player but just not the difference maker WE need. Good player but doesnt show up vs the better QBs

     I just noticed the ignore button is back so happy trails again Rusty. I wish you well in life.




    Yet, you are praising LaRon Landry?  What exactly has he done other than play in the box and make some tackles within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage? We need a Safety that can play a consistent position with McCourty. McCourty has range, so does Quin.

     

    It's a passing league. Guys like Landry are being phased out.  The guy has very limited range.

    Landry gets absolutely lit up as a liability in coverage agaisnt the good QBs.

     




     

    Its not even a question anymore of wether you will try put words in my mouth or not, its just a matter of what BS you try to attach to my name!  For the life of me I cant understand you. You run around attacking every thing that differs from what you like. This is a forum of differing opinions. This is why you have to make fake accounts for people to agree with you because u have a complex??  Please point out where I praised Landry??? I mentioned him amongst a bunch of names of guys who can come help. You are still wrong as well. He went to the jets so of course he is no good to you but we sure could have used him to imtimidate WRs over the middle. I dont wanna get into it with you again about Landry cuz all you do is lie when you dont like someone so its not worth but just like the other ignorant people who said he wouldnt last 4 games last year I proved you wrong as well. At the end of the day, it wont matter who you and I like anyway. BB DID bring in Landry so he thought about it, no?

     

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    In Russ' defense man I think it's how to approach his opinion.  If you read my posts, I pretty much disagree with him in this tread.

    Og you bring good stuff here, and Russ does too.  It's just sad sometimes we get into pissing contests.  We come here for Pats, and everyone should realize that and respect others opinions.  I'm not syaing he doesn't start it, but we all want the best for the Pats at the end of the day. 

     

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    In response to RidingWithTheKing's comment:

    In response to Getzo's comment:

     

    In Russ' defense man I think it's how to approach his opinion.  If you read my posts, I pretty much disagree with him in this tread.

    Og you bring good stuff here, and Russ does too.  It's just sad sometimes we get into pissing contests.  We come here for Pats, and everyone should realize that and respect others opinions.  I'm not syaing he doesn't start it, but we all want the best for the Pats at the end of the day. 

     

     



    What did I start?  Keep in mind, he is disagreeing with Quin as an option (which is fine) but implying that his choice and odd obssession with muscle bound roid freak Landry somehow performs well in coverage against the elite QBs?

     

    Why is it that I see TEs and WRs running past he and Bell all year then?

    We don't need an in the box Safety here. We need someone who can help McCourty so he's not alone in terms of quality and providing range in coverage.   That's really what is needed in a passing league.

    I would agree that a physical player with that range is needed, too, so I get that part.  Reed provides that, Goldson.  Quin isn't as physical, but he can cover and tackle with a nose for the ball, IMO.

     

    I agree that he and Mt Hurl use this mocking type approach thinking they're superior in analyzing the game or a player, which is them thinking they're innocent in all of this is so funny.

    What's even more scary is they claim I lie and have multiple board names because when challenged they can't counter, so they play the victim role and hope they get support from others.

    It's what they all try to do when challenged. Instead of saying "yeah, Landry really isn't that great in coverage", they lash out.

     

     



    I get your point... and keeping it football related.. I actually feel Goldson is not the best coverage safety either.  I like him in the box, but I don't see throwing money his way as a good option. 

    That's why with money considered I still like Reed as a stop gap while Pats groom Wilson. 

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    I was about to post that too.  There will be other options than a big signing to address the pats safety needs. 

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    Reed will probably take a hometown discount to stay a Raven so he isn't signing anywhere else for less than about 5M. And at that price he isn't worth it. If you want the vet safety Woodson is probably the option in the 3M range.

    Pats need two CBs since both Talib and Arrington are UFAs at this moment. Talib is a problem of trust on anything but a short term deal but there are other options out there that could be signed longer term with resulting year 1 and 2 caps in the 4-6M range going up later. The same would probably be true with Moore or Quin at safety in the 3-5M first year cap number - Goldson is likely more expensive. So it would be possible for the Pats to sign two quality DBs with something like a 8-10M cap hit and a third for a total of 12-14M.

    That would leave them only enough money to sign one big ticket item and Welker or another option would be that FA.

    As far as Welker holding them hostage - they are doing the same to him. I think they have a fixed number in mind and are not going to budge above it. I wouldn't be surprised if it is about 16M guaranteed over two years with the contract length 3,4 or 5 years and a big signing bonus but limited cap hit this year and next. That could come in again in the 4-6M range and leave them room to target some budget FAs like a Nelson or some rent a vet DL help or a cover LB after the draft.

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    Good stuff Mia.  I think they already have Dane Fletcher in that coverage LB department and he is already under contract as he singed this off season I believe. 

    Welker I think is hammering out a deal as we speak that really is fair for both sides.  6-7/yr with a good bonus.   

    If the Pats use 12-14mill on their secondary then good.  It's needed.  As you stated there are good options for FA safeties already and amybe more ahead.  I guess the same could be said about the CB market, but I think they must get one true game chnager at the position. 

     
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    Re: Glover Quin (S)

    ESPN's Adam Schefter doesn't expect free agent FS Dashon Goldson to re-sign with the 49ers.

    "Goldson's going to be gone," tweeted Schefter. The 49ers refused to franchise tag Goldson for the second straight year, and he is reportedly seeking $8 million annually. Keeping him is thought to be a priority for San Francisco, but he may be too rich for their tastes. The 49ers could use the No. 34 pick they got from the Chiefs to find Goldson's replacement in what appears to be a deep safety class.  

      I don't think he is worth $6 nevermind $8mill.....  These Free Agents are just losing seight of reality.    I really think Pats should get a CB throught FA, and then draft the best safety available IF they don't feel Wilson can take the next step.

     

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