Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    Coach BB is or perhaps was one the greatest coaches in recent history. Yet, I can't help but think his EGO is hurting this Pats team. He simply can't do it all like he thinks he can. And what happened to his specialty: defence.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Patsman3. Show Patsman3's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    signed and agreed.  Does anyone remember BB in Cleveland???  Why was BB a success in NY (Giants) and NE but not in Cleveland.  --- Bad owner, bad players, bad front office in Cleveland.  All good in NY and NE-- when he started.

    Now he is trying to do way to much O and D co-ordinator, GM, and coach.  I think his next move is a power play to buy the team from Kraft and make himself owner.  Dude is going to turn into Al Davis if he isn't careful. 

    Please BB go back to coaching, hire real front office personal and GM, and get some legit co-ordinators.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from PAULICAS1975. Show PAULICAS1975's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    BB is 5-3 and if the Defense didnt have stupid penalties near the end of games or if they played how BB tells them to this team would have a better record. Yet Some fans in here just complain about what BB has done. I know 1 thing. None of you complaining on here would do a better job then what BB has done. Just stop your complaining like litte girls and be happy thats what we have. Thats what going to be til next season. Have you people maybe thought that BB did this so tht he has some money for next year Free agency???
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    Well, I think he is still a good defensive coach, but his grocery list stinks and is stale and outdated.

    Thats the problem. These not very talented players arent grasping schemes and are hit or miss. Some week they seem to execute zone defense ok and we have a chance and other times they are all over the place.

    Its hard to go from Rodney Harrison to Chung who is good but just too young. Remember when Rodney came here he was an 11 year vet who saw it all.

    We have no Willie Mac!  No body that makes a difference. Noone that loves football so much they are willing to sacrifice anything to win.

    You cant expect there to be Troy Brown in 2011 because the generation is different and B.B. aint exaclty bridging the gap, so to speak.

    Meriweather didnt care enough.  Mayo is a hard worker but isnt making plays due to being out of place.

    Ninkovich, God love em, but c'mon.  When he is the most consistent Backer in terms of snaps played, you are in trouble.

    Who wanted Kyle Arrington.  Atleast he has been coached up, but these guys in the back end , Barret, Brown I mean they had lackluster collegiate careers and we expect them to play at a high level in the NFL

    I dont...

    B.B. created this problem, so I guess its still him but he needs to realize, NOW is the time to get TALENTED players, as there arent many "run thru a wall for you players" left. Eventually you need playmakers and we havent got many right now
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from No-Mercy-Defence. Show No-Mercy-Defence's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    DO YOUR JOB......DO YOUR JOB...
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from darwk. Show darwk's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    YES. I think BB's ego is getting in his and the team's way.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]BB is 5-3 and if the Defense didnt have stupid penalties near the end of games or if they played how BB tells them to this team would have a better record. Yet Some fans in here just complain about what BB has done. I know 1 thing. None of you complaining on here would do a better job then what BB has done. Just stop your complaining like litte girls and be happy thats what we have. Thats what going to be til next season. Have you people maybe thought that BB did this so tht he has some money for next year Free agency???
    Posted by PAULICAS1975[/QUOTE]

    But they don't have a better record. And the defence is suspect. And the offense is struggling. And its not complaining its being objective about what we see. And none of us claim we could do a better job. That is not the discussion here. The last Super Bowl win, 2005. It is almost 2012. In 08 he as the coach made no adjustments coming out for the second half in that game. None. He has taken on way too many responsibilities. You can't seem to see the forest through the trees pauli. The problem is he keeps getting a pass for all his previous work: 2005 and before.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]Well, I think he is still a good defensive coach, but his grocery list stinks and is stale and outdated. Thats the problem. These not very talented players arent grasping schemes and are hit or miss. Some week they seem to execute zone defense ok and we have a chance and other times they are all over the place. Its hard to go from Rodney Harrison to Chung who is good but just too young. Remember when Rodney came here he was an 11 year vet who saw it all. We have no Willie Mac!  No body that makes a difference. Noone that loves football so much they are willing to sacrifice anything to win. You cant expect there to be Troy Brown in 2011 because the generation is different and B.B. aint exaclty bridging the gap, so to speak. Meriweather didnt care enough.  Mayo is a hard worker but isnt making plays due to being out of place. Ninkovich, God love em, but c'mon.  When he is the most consistent Backer in terms of snaps played, you are in trouble. Who wanted Kyle Arrington.  Atleast he has been coached up, but these guys in the back end , Barret, Brown I mean they had lackluster collegiate careers and we expect them to play at a high level in the NFL I dont... B.B. created this problem, so I guess its still him but he needs to realize, NOW is the time to get TALENTED players, as there arent many "run thru a wall for you players" left. Eventually you need playmakers and we havent got many right now
    Posted by JayShizzle45[/QUOTE]

    Agreed. But part of the problem is the Pats get rid of talent in bunches. Leading me to think his Ego gets in the way of the Pats chances of winning and getting further than the first round in the playoffs.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from hardright. Show hardright's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    Do any of us sit in the meeting rooms? Do any of the media?

    The answer to both questions is no.

    The bottom line is that we have no idea whatsoever how much BB is taking on, and how much his assistants are doing.

    My guess is that BB's not doing that much more than the average NFL coach does.

    The media makes a big deal out of the "no coordinators" stuff, but those are just titles. Patricia and O'Brien are the de-facto coordinators, and I'm sure they're doing what all DC's and OC's in the NFL do every week.

    And this "ego" stuff is more media-driven nonsense. Just like the "arrogance" stuff. Some media members don't like BB, so the word "arrogant" gets thrown out to explain everything he does; like the 4th and 2 call at Indy two years ago was "arrogance," but Sean Payton's surprise onsides kick at the start of the 3rd quarter in the Super Bowl was "brilliant and bold", right?

    How much of an "ego" did he have when Crennel and Weis were here and they had the DC/OC titles? Does anyone really believe that BB WANTED those two to leave him, and that if they hadn't left they wouldn't still be his coordinators today? You're dreaming if you think BB would NOT want those two guys to still be here. Why they weren't rehired immediately after 2009 when both were free is a mystery, but then again, how do we know they wanted to come back and coach in BB's shadow again? Weis, for sure, still has head coaching aspirations--not sure about Crennel, but he had  a chance to work for a guy he knew in KC (Pioli), so he took it.

    Basically BB's coaching staff has been picked to the bone since 2004, and now he's got two guys who he thinks have potential, and he's trying to develop them as full-time coordinators. Maybe he's not giving them the official title because he's afraid other teams will come pillaging his staff again?

    I don't have the answer to that.

    But I do know that none of us have a clue as to what goes on behind closed doors down there in Foxboro, and so none of us is qualified to say that BB is "trying to do too much...it's his ego."
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    Nope, not at all.

    He has been coach of the decade. He has been coach of the year three times, won three super bowls and the AFC championship 4 times. Had a perfect regular season in 2007. Won 11 games with a QB that hadn't started a football game since HS in 2008. Etc, etc. His coaching staff and front office has been raided mercilessly over that time.

    He's not kicking tons of coaches out the door.

    Just a few notables to remember of people making career advancement of their own accord...

    Weis moved on to greener pastures.
    Romeo same thing.
    Mangini same thing. (Year Mangini left he was D coordinator and knew Pats opinion on Revis and out bid the Pats in the bidding war to trade up to get him. Coincidence? I think not!)
    McDaniels same thing. (Took the special teams coach with him and made him assistant head coach similar to Scar here, also went after and got some Patriot FA's)
    Pioli same thing. (Took others from the department with him offering better positions/opportunities)
    Dimitrov same thing. (Took a number of others from the scouting department with them offering better positions/opportunities)

    He's had Dom Capers in working with him. No one can assume it was BB who didn't want Capers as his D coordinator. BB has a system. Continuity is extremely important. Capers is a successful Coordinator in his own right running his "own" system. BB could have offered to have Capers run his D system for him and Capers might have said no thanks I have an opportunity to go run what I know and want out in Greenbay. No one knows.

    After Romeo was out of football BB offered him the coordinator job back and Romeo would have but simply had already agreed to be KC's coordinator and didn't want to burn a bridge.

    He's brought in and still has Floyd Reese to the best of my knowledge who has been a successful GM. Yes Reese publicly is supposedly more involved in the contract side but does anyone really think BB doesn't listen to any opinion Reese might have on such matters?

    If you have a player who is not buying in or refuses to do what they are told you don't play them and if you aren't going to play you don't keep them. Try coaching something at any level and play a player who has all the talent but never does what they are suppose to and see how fast your hair turns grey and how quickly you sit that player. ...At least in teams sports where a unit has to work collectively together.

    I'd like to know if anyone knows of any other organization that has sustained even close to the turnover the Patriots have sustained in the past decade due to "success" and people leaving of their own accord for career advancement? All while still maintaining a winning team and keeping offensive and defensive system continuity.

    These are just some of the things that fly in the face of him having an ego that is detrimental to the team.

    Have the Pats made some player personnel blunders? Yep. Can anyone name an organization that hasnen't? Are all those other organizations blunders due to some coach or GM's ego? Come on people.

    Is BB perfect, nope far from it. Does the team/organization do some things that drive me crazy as an outsider not knowing the facts. On the surface, absolutely. Do I think it simply boils down to BB's ego? No Way!!
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Patsman3. Show Patsman3's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]Nope, not at all. He has been coach of the decade. He has been coach of the year three times, won three super bowls and the AFC championship 4 times. Had a perfect regular season in 2007. Won 11 games with a QB that hadn't started a football game since HS in 2008. Etc, etc. His coaching staff and front office has been raided mercilessly over that time. He's not kicking tons of coaches out the door. Just a few notables to remember of people making career advancement of their own accord... Weis moved on to greener pastures. Romeo same thing. Mangini same thing. (Year Mangini left he was D coordinator and knew Pats opinion on Revis and out bid the Pats in the bidding war to trade up to get him. Coincidence? I think not!) McDaniels same thing. (Took the special teams coach with him and made him assistant head coach similar to Scar here, also went after and got some Patriot FA's) Pioli same thing. (Took others from the department with him offering better positions/opportunities) Dimitrov same thing. (Took a number of others from the scouting department with them offering better positions/opportunities) He's had Dom Capers in working with him. No one can assume it was BB who didn't want Capers as his D coordinator. BB has a system. Continuity is extremely important. Capers is a successful Coordinator in his own right running his "own" system. BB could have offered to have Capers run his D system for him and Capers might have said no thanks I have an opportunity to go run what I know and want out in Greenbay. No one knows. After Romeo was out of football BB offered him the coordinator job back and Romeo would have but simply had already agreed to be KC's coordinator and didn't want to burn a bridge. He's brought in and still has Floyd Reese to the best of my knowledge who has been a successful GM. Yes Reese publicly is supposedly more involved in the contract side but does anyone really think BB doesn't listen to any opinion Reese might have on such matters? If you have a player who is not buying in or refuses to do what they are told you don't play them and if you aren't going to play you don't keep them. Try coaching something at any level and play a player who has all the talent but never does what they are suppose to and see how fast your hair turns grey and how quickly you sit that player. ...At least in teams sports where a unit has to work collectively together. I'd like to know if anyone knows of any other organization that has sustained even close to the turnover the Patriots have sustained in the past decade due to "success" and people leaving of their own accord for career advancement? All while still maintaining a winning team and keeping offensive and defensive system continuity. These are just some of the things that fly in the face of him having an ego that is detrimental to the team. Have the Pats made some player personnel blunders? Yep. Can anyone name an organization that hasnen't? Are all those other organizations blunders due to some coach or GM's ego? Come on people. Is BB perfect, nope far from it. Does the team/organization do some things that drive me crazy as an outsider not knowing the facts. On the surface, absolutely. Do I think it simply boils down to BB's ego? No Way!!
    Posted by Low-FB-IQ[/QUOTE]

    There are alot of good points in there but it glides right over the problem that since 2004, when the gang broke up they have been to 1 SB in 7 years.  Worse then that (since getting to a SB is dam hard) is there continual decline in the play-offs from the SB to losing in the second round, to 2 first round exits.  There is a downward tratectory that at the moment has them in 3rd place in the division and out of the play-offs.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from smorgan86. Show smorgan86's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]Coach BB is or perhaps was one the greatest coaches in recent history. Yet, I can't help but think his EGO is hurting this Pats team. He simply can't do it all like he thinks he can. And what happened to his specialty: defence.
    Posted by antiqueman1[/QUOTE]

    yes, absolutely!..His ego has gotten in the way for the last couple of years. His thinking that you can get rid of talent and replace it with "plug-ins" is ridiculous, his drafting stinks, his bargain shopping for talent is absurd, plus I'm soooo tired of hearing how this guy is a "defensive guru, genius, or whatever other lofty title you want to bestow upon him. That's a bunch of garbage when you consistently have on of the WORST defenses in the league!
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS : There are alot of good points in there but it glides right over the problem that since 2004, when the gang broke up they have been to 1 SB in 7 years.  Worse then that (since getting to a SB is dam hard) is there continual decline in the play-offs from the SB to losing in the second round, to 2 first round exits.  There is a downward tratectory that at the moment has them in 3rd place in the division and out of the play-offs.
    Posted by Patsman3[/QUOTE]


    What am I glossing over exactly? The point of the thread was a statement that it was all ego driven that the pats lost the last two playoff games.

    Wies and Romeo left in 2004.

    2006 had the best statistical defense so that happened after the band broke up. They made it to the AFC championship game.

    2007 they made it to the superbowl with a perfect regular season and the D only gave up 17 points. That too was after the band broke up.

    I am not following your point at all. Does this team have some issues. Yes. Are they not continually picking near the bottom in the draft year after year for the last decade? Yep.

    Greenbay won the superbowl last year. Prior to that they had not been in one in twelve years. Was it because of someones ego they weren't? It's been 4 years since the pats were last in the superbowl and the way it looks right now, likely 5 years coming. FIVE. Take a look around the league. Look how many years teams like the Bengals, 49ers, Lions, etc have been picking at the top of the draft year after year. Its a parity league its suppose to work this way.

    I simply fail to see how everything that's been mentioned is the cause of ONE mans ego. Don't see it. ...and that was the point of the thread.
     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from mighty2012. Show mighty2012's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    Hardright and Low FB IQ got it right.  There needs to be a separate forum for posters like them so we can have worthwhile discussions instead of this nonsense.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from patsbandwagonsince76. Show patsbandwagonsince76's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS


    Brady and BB have big ego's but I think they would both be willing to make adjustments, no matter what they were to improve the team.

    Brady essentially has had some horrendous stretches of plays this year...don't think we will see a repeat of the first 3Q of last game again this year.

    BB is going to make some hard decsions in the next few weeks...you will see.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Davedsone. Show Davedsone's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]Coach BB is or perhaps was one the greatest coaches in recent history. Yet, I can't help but think his EGO is hurting this Pats team. He simply can't do it all like he thinks he can. And what happened to his specialty: defence.
    Posted by antiqueman1[/QUOTE]


    And YOUR ego is so big you think you know better than he does?  And want to tell the world?  AND use the British spelling for defense? (I'm giving you credit here; It's either that or you can't spell)  Whhooo hooo the Pot is calling the Kettle black!
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    Whatever Davedsone. It was just a question. So many of you can't have discussions without just bashing the person for asking the question. You all carry it way beyond the discussion point. It is like as Pats fans we can never say a bad word about the team. It appears more like you want to maintain your inflated ego by knocking others for just asking a simple question. All you have to do is give your response. Why you feel the need to attack another poster is beyond me. I don't know you and you don't know me, so why make it personal. It makes no sense.
     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    Good points King. I believe NE will win. And I also believe Ocho catches his first TD.
     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS : There's a lot more proof it's Brady and not BB. Look at the all the little geeks here following the anti-BB media's lead. The D is improved dramatically over last year's but all we here is how bad it is. Run D, red zone D, and pass rush = All improved. These are facts.  In the last 3 games, the NE 3rd down D?   Outstanding. The media is afraid to challenge and question Brady, so we end up with Gasper behind his keyboard and his small wee-wee writing about how BB doesn't know hwo to draft, coach, develop players, or hire coordinators. SO, we also end up with his minions doing the same thing here, totally unable to analyze this game. Here are 3 dead giveaways that prove it's not BB, but Brady: 1. BB traded Brady's binky (Moss) last year.  NE's offense became more balanced, NE rolled into the postseason with the best D in the NFL for the month of Dec.  I think they overthought the gameplan with Brady winning out, and the base shotgun spread failed miserably. He also drafted two TEs, brought back Branch, brough into Ochocinco and took two RBs.  Maybe if we threw less than 45 times in a game, Ridley can help? 2. We start the Oakland game in the shotgun spread formation, where our O Line is totally blasted off the line by a gacked up, aging Seymour, who hasn't played with that kind of energy, before or since.  A timeout is called. We then switch to running the ball and essentially taking over the game on that first drive. I think BB called that timeout, not Brady or O'Brien. I also think BB reined in Brady after the horrendous display in Buffalo. I think thhey let Brady try run his Addiction Offense in Oakland, BB saw Oakland's linneup and just pulled the plug right then and there. 3. Fast forward to Dallas.  BJGE up the middle, 9 yards. Brady to the shotgun.  hard to ignore this...B rady takes a sack. Again. 3rd and long, a timeout. Who called that timeout? BB. They draw up a play they think can work to bail them out, but what if that hadn't have happened and BB lets O'Brien call some shitgun play and we punt? Do we win that game? I don't think so. In Pitt, no run game even attempted in man coverage, late to adjust, Brady wants to be a hero throwing again on national tv. It's becoming way too obvious. Didn't Brady seem distant after the great, physical Raiders and Jets wins, postgame? The fact is, the media makes more money off of this anti-BB crusade, they can't see the elephant in the room is really Brady. Not BB. BB was coach of the year last year, should have been executive of the year and is constantly trying to what is best for the team. Is Brady?  Does Brady see what he's doing? I agree none of us know, but I write this, because the media plays BB out to be a bad guy, Brady has ZERO accountability here, and we see little geeks like Mt. Hurl, Babe Parillo and the Brady Ballwashers all buy into premises by Gasper, ESPN, Mazz/Felger, instead of actually watching these games. We are witnessing the worst stretch of BRady's career, so let's see if he backs up his statment about "seeing how tough we are" this week. Yup. Let's see, Tom.  Let's see if you can realize how sad it is educated Pats fans see the the problems more than you do. I just saw Reiss's breakdown of the Pats game and on Brady's 2nd INT on 2nd and 3 to start the half, Ochocinco was wide open. Uh-huh.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]

    I think at some point you just have to ask yourself...just how far did mom drop me? I know her milk never came in, but couldn't she just used formula? And what was that experimental drug she was on while she was in her third trimester?

    You worry me, you really do. You don't drive a car do you? The defense is much improved over last year? We are dead last! How can that be an improvement? You can't get any worse than last...you sure you went to college?
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS

    In Response to Re: Is coach BB's EGO hurting the PATS:
    [QUOTE]Well, I think he is still a good defensive coach, but his grocery list stinks and is stale and outdated. Thats the problem. These not very talented players arent grasping schemes and are hit or miss. Some week they seem to execute zone defense ok and we have a chance and other times they are all over the place. Its hard to go from Rodney Harrison to Chung who is good but just too young. Remember when Rodney came here he was an 11 year vet who saw it all. We have no Willie Mac!  No body that makes a difference. Noone that loves football so much they are willing to sacrifice anything to win. You cant expect there to be Troy Brown in 2011 because the generation is different and B.B. aint exaclty bridging the gap, so to speak. Meriweather didnt care enough.  Mayo is a hard worker but isnt making plays due to being out of place. Ninkovich, God love em, but c'mon.  When he is the most consistent Backer in terms of snaps played, you are in trouble. Who wanted Kyle Arrington.  Atleast he has been coached up, but these guys in the back end , Barret, Brown I mean they had lackluster collegiate careers and we expect them to play at a high level in the NFL I dont... B.B. created this problem, so I guess its still him but he needs to realize, NOW is the time to get TALENTED players, as there arent many "run thru a wall for you players" left. Eventually you need playmakers and we havent got many right now
    Posted by JayShizzle45[/QUOTE]

    jay,
    agree with your post except for 1 thing. the time for getting talented players was 3 years ago. now its just 3 years wasted of brady window.

     

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