Kind of a crazy thought...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Kind of a crazy thought...

    I have for the most part bashed our defense over the last 4 years, saying that at their best they were average and at their worst they were much worse than that. So what I have really wanted was to improve that unit, thinking that we would never win a Super Bowl without a Super Bowl caliber unit. I was thinking we should funnel all our resources towards that side of the ball...

    Now this is the crazy thought...don't. Don't do it. Where are we better? Offense, correct? Yet most of us know we are not perfect on offense. What if we spent the money on the offense? You got to figure that is the more sure bet that the funds would be used to their maximum potential. We almost won a Super two years ago with a defense that was the definition of average. On offense we were missing our best weapon both playoff runs (Gronk), I've got to think he would of made a difference. What if we spent to get an outside threat that was a true outside threat? What if we got a true feature back? This is pure outside the box...hypothetical type of stuff.

    People always point to Brady doing it during the regular season and then not being able to do it in the post season (as if he's suppossed to carry the team)...well he can do it during the regular season when his weapons are for the most part there and healthy. And for the most part you face much better defenses in the playoffs and we've all seen how they tend to call games in the post season - they allow a lot more stuff. What if we could roll out Hernandez, Gronk, Lloyd, a true outside threat and a better runner?

    As for the defense, I've kind of lost hope that we are going to go into free agency in grab a young pass rushing defensive tackle or end, and they are going to be here for a few seasons. People can point to Andre Carter, but he walked through our doors late into the pre season and played well for ten games before going down....he was gone after that. You can talk about Anderson, but he was effective for maybe 5 games and then left after the season. So what I'm saying is, unless we are going to go out and get a talented guy in his prime that will help us for a few years, why not just go all in on the offense? We are closer there. It could be cheaper - we all saw what Mario Williams got to go to Buffalo last season.

    Again, just outside the box type of stuff.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    Andre Carter, Anderson, both linebackers, if not in name but certainly in size.  Mario Williams is an outside linebacker in the 3/4 or a 4/3 defensive end with massive tackles next to him...

    We need a 6'2"-6'5" 320-340 pound monster who, despite his size and mass, has a high motor, incredible leverage, can't be blocked by one player and doesn't run out of gas.  People think "defensive line" and start to rattle off all these unconventional D line players; we need a defensive tackle.  We should package our entire draft if need be to move up and grab this guy.

    When (and if) this happens you will see a huge change in our defense, players like Jones and Ninc will double their sack totals (or more) from last season, the Pat's will rise to the top of the NFL in team sacks, the defensive backs will magically become good at "coverage" because opposing QB's will hear the footsteps and will make mistakes or let loose the ball early.

    We need a monster in the middle next to Wilfork, add that to what we already have and this defense will be one of the best in the NFL.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    It is out of the box but I just don't see it helping in the end. Since 07' a lot of the focus has been around the O until recently but come the playoffs it always comes down to a grind match between the best teams. When it turns into the punch in the mouth grind fest spending heavy on O hasn't gotten us anywhere with the O performing, as expected given competition, well below their season average. I still believe grind feasts are won and lost on field position, limiting ToP for the opponent, and turn over battles. Most of that can be controlled on the D side of the field and has been seen that when we lose it's because the other teams D dictated the pace of the game while our #1 O hasn't been able to break through. You can claim Gronk hurt all you want but injures happen and the great teams find a way to rise above it. Just look at the recent SB winners:

    • Ravens - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • NYG - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • Packers - D that caused turn overs and controlled the pace (that one year at least)
    • Saints - The one exception
    • Pitt - D that controlled the opponents pace


    In reality 4 out of the past 5 have strong D's that controlled to pace of the game in the playoff runs. Now the SBs are always high scoring events but the D's that won forced their opponent to do something different then what they were use to and I see that trend continuing. The answer isn't more O it's having an adaptive O that can win grinders or shoot outs and a D that can win in a grinder. Now I think the O is closer to reaching that goal but that's the problem is that they are closer. A grinder is determined by a handful of plays and if no improvements are made I trust the O as it currently stands to make more then they drop most of those plays but I don't trust the D to do it at all. That's why the resources need to go to the weakest link not to the strongest

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    Andre Carter, Anderson, both linebackers, if not in name but certainly in size.  Mario Williams is an outside linebacker in the 3/4 or a 4/3 defensive end with massive tackles next to him...

    We need a 6'2"-6'5" 320-340 pound monster who, despite his size and mass, has a high motor, incredible leverage, can't be blocked by one player and doesn't run out of gas.  People think "defensive line" and start to rattle off all these unconventional D line players; we need a defensive tackle.  We should package our entire draft if need be to move up and grab this guy.

    When (and if) this happens you will see a huge change in our defense, players like Jones and Ninc will double their sack totals (or more) from last season, the Pat's will rise to the top of the NFL in team sacks, the defensive backs will magically become good at "coverage" because opposing QB's will hear the footsteps and will make mistakes or let loose the ball early.

    We need a monster in the middle next to Wilfork, add that to what we already have and this defense will be one of the best in the NFL.

     




    I agree, but how hard has it been to find a guy like you are talking about? They don't grow on trees and they certainly don't come cheap. We draft towards the end of every round and every team in the elague is looking for the guy you're talking about. So what I was thinking was more of an outside the box thing. I watched the Ravens line up three recievers that couldn't be covered by anyone, their worst weapon was a tight end that was still a guy who could catch 50 passes a year for most teams...they even had two runners that could not only run, but catch.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from MordecaiBloodmoon. Show MordecaiBloodmoon's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    In response to wozzy's comment:

     

    Andre Carter, Anderson, both linebackers, if not in name but certainly in size.  Mario Williams is an outside linebacker in the 3/4 or a 4/3 defensive end with massive tackles next to him...

    We need a 6'2"-6'5" 320-340 pound monster who, despite his size and mass, has a high motor, incredible leverage, can't be blocked by one player and doesn't run out of gas.  People think "defensive line" and start to rattle off all these unconventional D line players; we need a defensive tackle.  We should package our entire draft if need be to move up and grab this guy.

    When (and if) this happens you will see a huge change in our defense, players like Jones and Ninc will double their sack totals (or more) from last season, the Pat's will rise to the top of the NFL in team sacks, the defensive backs will magically become good at "coverage" because opposing QB's will hear the footsteps and will make mistakes or let loose the ball early.

    We need a monster in the middle next to Wilfork, add that to what we already have and this defense will be one of the best in the NFL.

     

     


    I agree, but how hard has it been to find a guy like you are talking about? They don't grow on trees and they certainly don't come cheap. We draft towards the end of every round and every team in the elague is looking for the guy you're talking about. So what I was thinking was more of an outside the box thing. I watched the Ravens line up three recievers that couldn't be covered by anyone, their worst weapon was a tight end that was still a guy who could catch 50 passes a year for most teams...they even had two runners that could not only run, but catch.

     

     

     

    And yet our O out performed them all year long. We had the best O in the league. So it is tough to argue that their WRs are better. It doesnt help when our best redzone threat is out for the 2nd playoffs in a row in Gronk. I agree a better WR would help. That is why I am on the side of letting Welker go and getting a BIG WR with the same money. Welker may be the best from the 20-20 yard lines, but he doesnt get us points. We need to be able to finish and a big WR can do that.

     




     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    It is out of the box but I just don't see it helping in the end. Since 07' a lot of the focus has been around the O until recently but come the playoffs it always comes down to a grind match between the best teams. When it turns into the punch in the mouth grind fest spending heavy on O hasn't gotten us anywhere with the O performing, as expected given competition, well below their season average. I still believe grind feasts are won and lost on field position, limiting ToP for the opponent, and turn over battles. Most of that can be controlled on the D side of the field and has been seen that when we lose it's because the other teams D dictated the pace of the game while our #1 O hasn't been able to break through. You can claim Gronk hurt all you want but injures happen and the great teams find a way to rise above it. Just look at the recent SB winners:

    • Ravens - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • NYG - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • Packers - D that caused turn overs and controlled the pace (that one year at least)
    • Saints - The one exception
    • Pitt - D that controlled the opponents pace


    In reality 4 out of the past 5 have strong D's that controlled to pace of the game in the playoff runs. Now the SBs are always high scoring events but the D's that won forced their opponent to do something different then what they were use to and I see that trend continuing. The answer isn't more O it's having an adaptive O that can win grinders or shoot outs and a D that can win in a grinder. Now I think the O is closer to reaching that goal but that's the problem is that they are closer. A grinder is determined by a handful of plays and if no improvements are made I trust the O as it currently stands to make more then they drop most of those plays but I don't trust the D to do it at all. That's why the resources need to go to the weakest link not to the strongest




    Now I agree and honestly I've used some of the same words when describing what a defense should be able to do, or what a good defense has done to us...punch us in the face. My thought is that in our quest to build/make a defense that will control a game and punch a team in the mouth, it will come at the expense of the offense. How will we resign Welker, Vollmer? How can we add an outside threat, etc?

    I think a balanced team is certainly the best way ultimately, but keep in mind in 07 we were one drive away from winning another Super Bowl. We went through the regular season like a hot knife through butter. I really thought that building a balanced team would be the way to go, but this is what it could look like...we let Welker go, replace him with a cheaper alternative, we let Vollmer go and put Cannon in there...our offense loses Gronk or Hernadez for stretches during the regualr season and playoffs due to injury...the Welker replacement is not nearly enough, our above average at best runners play like average...and our offense can't score very well. Now if (and that's a big if) the money spent on defense actually worked we may win playoff games, but if that money/those signings don't pan out...we will get beat worse than ever before.   

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to MordecaiBloodmoon's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    In response to wozzy's comment:

     

    Andre Carter, Anderson, both linebackers, if not in name but certainly in size.  Mario Williams is an outside linebacker in the 3/4 or a 4/3 defensive end with massive tackles next to him...

    We need a 6'2"-6'5" 320-340 pound monster who, despite his size and mass, has a high motor, incredible leverage, can't be blocked by one player and doesn't run out of gas.  People think "defensive line" and start to rattle off all these unconventional D line players; we need a defensive tackle.  We should package our entire draft if need be to move up and grab this guy.

    When (and if) this happens you will see a huge change in our defense, players like Jones and Ninc will double their sack totals (or more) from last season, the Pat's will rise to the top of the NFL in team sacks, the defensive backs will magically become good at "coverage" because opposing QB's will hear the footsteps and will make mistakes or let loose the ball early.

    We need a monster in the middle next to Wilfork, add that to what we already have and this defense will be one of the best in the NFL.

     

     

    And yet our O out performed them all year long.  We had the best O in the league.  So it is tough to argue that their WRs are better.  It doesnt help when our best redzone threat is out for the 2nd playoffs in a row in Gronk.  I agree a better WR would help.  That is why I am on the side of letting Welker go and getting a BIG WR with the same money.  Welker may be the best from the 20-20 yard lines, but he doesnt get us points.  We need to be able to finish and a big WR can do that. 


    I agree, but how hard has it been to find a guy like you are talking about? They don't grow on trees and they certainly don't come cheap. We draft towards the end of every round and every team in the elague is looking for the guy you're talking about. So what I was thinking was more of an outside the box thing. I watched the Ravens line up three recievers that couldn't be covered by anyone, their worst weapon was a tight end that was still a guy who could catch 50 passes a year for most teams...they even had two runners that could not only run, but catch.

     

     




     




    And you may be right, however you can't discount the lack of ability for our tight ends to be/stay healthy for a long season. Those two take hits...lots of them. Perhaps a outside threat would take the focus off of them a bit and at the very least allow the ball to go to different parts of the field - if and when they go down, at least you have something on the outside to go to. 

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    IMO BB proved last year that with the rookie salary scaling he's not against trading up. I also wish for that mamoth D lineman and or a OLB. I think that with a better passrush our corners would look all pro being they would only have to cover for about 3 seconds. otherwise we get QB's like Flacco chucking it downfield deep on us.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

     

    It is out of the box but I just don't see it helping in the end. Since 07' a lot of the focus has been around the O until recently but come the playoffs it always comes down to a grind match between the best teams. When it turns into the punch in the mouth grind fest spending heavy on O hasn't gotten us anywhere with the O performing, as expected given competition, well below their season average. I still believe grind feasts are won and lost on field position, limiting ToP for the opponent, and turn over battles. Most of that can be controlled on the D side of the field and has been seen that when we lose it's because the other teams D dictated the pace of the game while our #1 O hasn't been able to break through. You can claim Gronk hurt all you want but injures happen and the great teams find a way to rise above it. Just look at the recent SB winners:

    • Ravens - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • NYG - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • Packers - D that caused turn overs and controlled the pace (that one year at least)
    • Saints - The one exception
    • Pitt - D that controlled the opponents pace


    In reality 4 out of the past 5 have strong D's that controlled to pace of the game in the playoff runs. Now the SBs are always high scoring events but the D's that won forced their opponent to do something different then what they were use to and I see that trend continuing. The answer isn't more O it's having an adaptive O that can win grinders or shoot outs and a D that can win in a grinder. Now I think the O is closer to reaching that goal but that's the problem is that they are closer. A grinder is determined by a handful of plays and if no improvements are made I trust the O as it currently stands to make more then they drop most of those plays but I don't trust the D to do it at all. That's why the resources need to go to the weakest link not to the strongest

     




    Now I agree and honestly I've used some of the same words when describing what a defense should be able to do, or what a good defense has done to us...punch us in the face. My thought is that in our quest to build/make a defense that will control a game and punch a team in the mouth, it will come at the expense of the offense. How will we resign Welker, Vollmer? How can we add an outside threat, etc?

     

    I think a balanced team is certainly the best way ultimately, but keep in mind in 07 we were one drive away from winning another Super Bowl. We went through the regular season like a hot knife through butter. I really thought that building a balanced team would be the way to go, but this is what it could look like...we let Welker go, replace him with a cheaper alternative, we let Vollmer go and put Cannon in there...our offense loses Gronk or Hernadez for stretches during the regualr season and playoffs due to injury...the Welker replacement is not nearly enough, our above average at best runners play like average...and our offense can't score very well. Now if (and that's a big if) the money spent on defense actually worked we may win playoff games, but if that money/those signings don't pan out...we will get beat worse than ever before.   




    I'm coming at it from a couple of different perspectives:

    1) The future - Brady's only got a limited amount of time and the best way I can see to give him the best shot at another SB is to take some of the burden off of him and let the D win some games. Additionally having a strong D will make the transition from Brady to the next QB that much easier. But without that D we might be looking at a situation where we might win one more at the expense of a 10 year mid of the road team

    2) Replacing Welker - Given Welkers recent drops I do think they need a more traditional Z flanker or a speedier X WR on the team. But, if you replace Welker with any WR there still is a huge question mark if they can perform on the team. With the Pats, WR is one of the positions the Pats have always had trouble finding whether through FA or draf. Going O with the capital could result in overpaying for mediocre performance that could have a net result in hurting the team as a whole. To me given the O how it currently is I see much less risk and greater benefit spreading those funds over the D


    Now if you are asking who replaces Welker I think the solution is already on the team in Hern and resigning Edelman. Between those two at least 1 will be healthy at all times and both have shown with good reps to be able to replace Welkers numbers, though not all of them. However, if you get a larger WR in the draft in the 2nd or 3rd round and convert Demps to a WR, provided his hands and route running is up to speed, now I think you have a more divise receiving core and have the cap flexibility to put those resources to the D. That money can be used to get a Goldson and a coverage LB or slot CB. Now I think there is a lot less risk Goldson would fit into the system and the benefit of having a true SS along with a coverage LB is much more to the team then the slight drop off from losing Welker and relying on Hern/Edelman combo. Additionally you replace Hern with Ballard in the two TE set and I see that as a huge plus. Now you have two similarly sized TE's who both can stay in and be extra OL or release for catches in the seem. That is extremely hard to defend against and hard to gameplan for. Before you could have a S spy Hern and rush him with a DE to nuetralize his blocking ability and quick releases. You can't do that with someone like Gronk or Ballard.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    That money can be used to get a Goldson and a coverage LB or slot CB. 

     

     

    Id trade Welker for that combo.  That would make up for the production loss. The thing that the ravens had on everyone , Denver , us , sf is their receivers would go up after the ball and get it.  The throws were there but 90% of the reception you credit the wr. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsEng. Show PatsEng's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to Philskiw1's comment:

    That money can be used to get a Goldson and a coverage LB or slot CB. 

     

     

    Id trade Welker for that combo.  That would make up for the production loss. The thing that the ravens had on everyone , Denver , us , sf is their receivers would go up after the ball and get it.  The throws were there but 90% of the reception you credit the wr. 




    Phil not sure if you were being sarcastic or not but a better slot CB and a better SS would help against other teams receivers. If you were being sarcastic then I don't see two WR's on the market that you can get for Welkers money to give you Balts WR's production in the post-season.

    Realistically Goldson is looking at a $5-7mil/yr average which would make him one of the top paid S's in the game. so with the $3-5mil remaining you saved off of Welker you could get a Hartline type of WR, maybe Boldin because of age but that's about it. I'd much rather have a stable secondary to shut down an opponents passing game then try to make major changes and reinvest into the #1 O in the league leaving our secondary a wet paper bag

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    ....Just look at the recent SB winners:

    • Ravens - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • NYG - D that controlled the opponents pace
    • Packers - D that caused turn overs and controlled the pace (that one year at least)
    • Saints - The one exception
    • Pitt - D that controlled the opponents pace


    In reality 4 out of the past 5 have strong D's that controlled to pace of the game in the playoff runs. ...



    To me the only thing this shows is that it's better to just get by during the season, do just enough to get into the playoffs, get exceptionally lucky and then use deer antler dust or whatever it takes to turn it on and play your best for a few games in the postseason.  

    Baltimore's defense was quite possibly the worst Baltimore defense in Ray Lewis's career. They were 17th ranked. Nothing special, nothing remarkable about them.  They got exceptionally lucky when Rahim Moore and Tony Carter made career-defining mistakes.  They played well in the playoffs, but they weren't a great team.

    The Giants were 27th ranked in 2011, they were 9-7. Once again, they got hot at the right time, got exceptionally lucky when Kyle Williams fumbled a couple of punts and Welker dropped....you know that part.    

    Green Bay was a good defensive team, 5th ranked in 2010. But overall, they were not a great team that year.  They were really fortuntate to even make the playoffs as a wild card.  It took a bad call in a game between Tampa Bay and Detroit for them to even get in to the dance. They got hot and took care of business.

    Pittsburgh and New Orleans were both solid teams all year, kind of mirror images though. One great defensively and meh offensively, the other pretty much the opposite. Pittsburgh nearly lost to a 9-7 Arizona team that got hot and made a great playoff run.

    Lady Luck and Big Mo play as much of a role as anything else.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Philskiw1. Show Philskiw1's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to PatsEng's comment:

    In response to Philskiw1's comment:

     

    That money can be used to get a Goldson and a coverage LB or slot CB. 

     

     

    Id trade Welker for that combo.  That would make up for the production loss. The thing that the ravens had on everyone , Denver , us , sf is their receivers would go up after the ball and get it.  The throws were there but 90% of the reception you credit the wr. 

     




    Phil not sure if you were being sarcastic or not but a better slot CB and a better SS would help against other teams receivers. If you were being sarcastic then I don't see two WR's on the market that you can get for Welkers money to give you Balts WR's production in the post-season.

     

    Realistically Goldson is looking at a $5-7mil/yr average which would make him one of the top paid S's in the game. so with the $3-5mil remaining you saved off of Welker you could get a Hartline type of WR, maybe Boldin because of age but that's about it. I'd much rather have a stable secondary to shut down an opponents passing game then try to make major changes and reinvest into the #1 O in the league leaving our secondary a wet paper bag



    My point was to trade Welker for the 2 defenders    If I was to go fter a receiver for the Welker money I'd try to get Brandon Marshall from Chicago in a trade. 

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from BabeParilli. Show BabeParilli's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    Minus Brady and Gronk, the whole damned team adds up to MEDIOCRE.

     

    Your guess is as good as anybody's as to where we should place our chips, as the clock has just about run out.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from fl+adam,. Show fl+adam,'s posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    I wonder what Mike Wallace gets...He is the guy you spend the Welker money on if you go WR.  I also agree another option is a huge DT/DE type like Wilfolk.  The third is a Goldson/Talib combo to go with Dennard, Mccourty, and Arrington.  How BB goes is anyones guess, but I would love to see a Hartline, Talib, Volmer, Goldson, Lawson, move up in draft and take a Big DT/DE with a mid round pick.  I think that gives us a better chance at winning than trying to resign Welker.  As much as I love the guy, he doesn't fit the Patriot way very well.  Other than Brady and Folk, BB does not agree with top of the league scale very often.  That is just not how to be competitive every year with the Salary cap.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from garytx. Show garytx's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    There are fixes that need to be done on both sides of the ball.  Gronk goes out and so does the offense.  Something is wrong there.  Outside of that, sure the defense needs fixing.  Anybody can see that with the exception of Rusty perhaps.  

    For the draft Hankins and Jenkins (both DTs) are around where the Pats are drafting in the 1st round.  We'll see how long that holds.  A nice fit with Wilfork for sure.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Minus Brady and Gronk, the whole damned team adds up to MEDIOCRE.

     

    Your guess is as good as anybody's as to where we should place our chips, as the clock has just about run out.




    I'd add Wilfork into that equation.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

     

    Minus Brady and Gronk, the whole damned team adds up to MEDIOCRE.

     

    Your guess is as good as anybody's as to where we should place our chips, as the clock has just about run out.

     




    I'd add Wilfork into that equation.

     



    wow Hurl! look how nice this thread has gone along without Rusty!

    no name-calling, no disparaging personal comments, no hijacking to say get spoiled brat TB under center, no fighting....wow!

    amazing how it happens without queenie

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to wozzy's comment:

    Andre Carter, Anderson, both linebackers, if not in name but certainly in size.  Mario Williams is an outside linebacker in the 3/4 or a 4/3 defensive end with massive tackles next to him...

    We need a 6'2"-6'5" 320-340 pound monster who, despite his size and mass, has a high motor, incredible leverage, can't be blocked by one player and doesn't run out of gas.  People think "defensive line" and start to rattle off all these unconventional D line players; we need a defensive tackle.  We should package our entire draft if need be to move up and grab this guy.

    When (and if) this happens you will see a huge change in our defense, players like Jones and Ninc will double their sack totals (or more) from last season, the Pat's will rise to the top of the NFL in team sacks, the defensive backs will magically become good at "coverage" because opposing QB's will hear the footsteps and will make mistakes or let loose the ball early.

    We need a monster in the middle next to Wilfork, add that to what we already have and this defense will be one of the best in the NFL.

     



    The only DT that fits that bill with no exception is Star L. Doubt bb cashes everything in to get him, he is a lock to be a top 5 pick. However, there are 2-3 that may be hanging around at 20-29. If we needed to move up 2-4 spots and grab Hankins, I might do it. I got to think Hankins and vw inside with jones and maybe nink / dederick / armstead on the end may be pretty good. Of course another good de would be nice. That also frees us up to play more big 3 man lines with vw, Hankins and love/deaderick/armstead. 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to 42AND46's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

     

    Minus Brady and Gronk, the whole damned team adds up to MEDIOCRE.

     

    Your guess is as good as anybody's as to where we should place our chips, as the clock has just about run out.

     




    I'd add Wilfork into that equation.

     

     



    wow Hurl! look how nice this thread has gone along without Rusty!

     

    no name-calling, no disparaging personal comments, no hijacking to say get spoiled brat TB under center, no fighting....wow!

    amazing how it happens without queenie




    I know, we should start a fight. I'll begin...hey 42 and 46, did you go to college? I'm thinking the associate degree in liberal arts will enhance your career at Dairy Queen...I'm just trying to help. Then you can come back and tell my how the jets shaved 30 million off their salary cap today by cutting old and useless players. Then I'll tell you salary cap hell will come to get them. I'll tell you that Rex Ryan absolutely has to stand in front of the bathroom mirror tonight with the lights off and say...salary cap, salary cap, salary cap...then the commisioner will appear standing behind him with a bloody ice pick. Scary stuff for sure!

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from palookaski. Show palookaski's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to 42AND46's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Minus Brady and Gronk, the whole damned team adds up to MEDIOCRE.

    Your guess is as good as anybody's as to where we should place our chips, as the clock has just about run out.


    I'd add Wilfork into that equation.

    wow Hurl! look how nice this thread has gone along without Rusty!

    no name-calling, no disparaging personal comments, no hijacking to say get spoiled brat TB under center, no fighting....wow!

    amazing how it happens without queenie

    I know, we should start a fight. I'll begin...hey 42 and 46, did you go to college? I'm thinking the associate degree in liberal arts will enhance your career at Dairy Queen...I'm just trying to help. Then you can come back and tell my how the jets shaved 30 million off their salary cap today by cutting old and useless players. Then I'll tell you salary cap hell will come to get them. I'll tell you that Rex Ryan absolutely has to stand in front of the bathroom mirror tonight with the lights off and say...salary cap, salary cap, salary cap...then the commisioner will appear standing behind him with a bloody ice pick. Scary stuff for sure!



    Another "crazy thought" Mthurl. This thread was going nicely but you and your gang decide to throw away comments from 8 good posters - of whom I/we enjoy reading. Then you go phishing for Rusty, again. Shame is what it is. You now can never accuse Rusty of spoiling a thread ever again. You spoil your own. Guilty dogs always return to their own vomit.

    People here are'nt stupid to see right through this. It's no wonder many good posters have gone away and many more just rarely comment now and then. Grow up. Carry on.

    Enjoy your evening .... ;-)))

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to palookaski's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    In response to 42AND46's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    In response to BabeParilli's comment:

    Minus Brady and Gronk, the whole damned team adds up to MEDIOCRE.

    Your guess is as good as anybody's as to where we should place our chips, as the clock has just about run out.


    I'd add Wilfork into that equation.

    wow Hurl! look how nice this thread has gone along without Rusty!

    no name-calling, no disparaging personal comments, no hijacking to say get spoiled brat TB under center, no fighting....wow!

    amazing how it happens without queenie

    I know, we should start a fight. I'll begin...hey 42 and 46, did you go to college? I'm thinking the associate degree in liberal arts will enhance your career at Dairy Queen...I'm just trying to help. Then you can come back and tell my how the jets shaved 30 million off their salary cap today by cutting old and useless players. Then I'll tell you salary cap hell will come to get them. I'll tell you that Rex Ryan absolutely has to stand in front of the bathroom mirror tonight with the lights off and say...salary cap, salary cap, salary cap...then the commisioner will appear standing behind him with a bloody ice pick. Scary stuff for sure!

     



    Another "crazy thought" Mthurl. This thread was going nicely but you and your gang decide to throw away comments from 8 good posters - of whom I/we enjoy reading. Then you go phishing for Rusty, again. Shame is what it is. You now can never accuse Rusty of spoiling a thread ever again. You spoil your own. Guilty dogs always return to their own vomit.

     

    People here are'nt stupid to see right through this. It's no wonder many good posters have gone away and many more just rarely comment now and then. Grow up. Carry on.

    Enjoy your evening .... ;-)))

     




    You have a good night too.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    Another crazy thought, anyone else see what is available for free agent wide recievers lately? Not much in terms of young, complete outside threats. Maybe we should try to get one more year out of Welker? Or maybe they should sign him to a back loaded, bloated three year deal where they can cut him that third year. The Patriots have 15 people capable of creating a contract that is creative enough to release him down the road.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to mthurl's comment:

    Another crazy thought, anyone else see what is available for free agent wide recievers lately? Not much in terms of young, complete outside threats. Maybe we should try to get one more year out of Welker? Or maybe they should sign him to a back loaded, bloated three year deal where they can cut him that third year. The Patriots have 15 people capable of creating a contract that is creative enough to release him down the road.



    I am not sure I am following you on the contract part.

    Are you suggesting theres a way to somehow backload a contract to where he gets paid at the end even if he is cut/released but it still does not become a big dead money cap hit? Contract/salary cap stuff is not my fortay but I never heard of that.

    If you are suggesting backloading so you can release Welker later and not get paid I would simply ask why would Welker or his agent agree to that?

    Not my words, but from what you read from some places there might not be as many big spenders this year in FA? I have no idea but if it was true they might let Welker test the market and come back to them to see if they can work something out.

    The Pats obviously have a number in mind for his value at this point in his career and expected role going forward. If they can not get there or close enough with him, you know they will just let him walk. They've shown to have no fear in that.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: Kind of a crazy thought...

    In response to Low-FB-IQ's comment:

    In response to mthurl's comment:

     

    Another crazy thought, anyone else see what is available for free agent wide recievers lately? Not much in terms of young, complete outside threats. Maybe we should try to get one more year out of Welker? Or maybe they should sign him to a back loaded, bloated three year deal where they can cut him that third year. The Patriots have 15 people capable of creating a contract that is creative enough to release him down the road.

     



    I am not sure I am following you on the contract part.

     

    Are you suggesting theres a way to somehow backload a contract to where he gets paid at the end even if he is cut/released but it still does not become a big dead money cap hit? Contract/salary cap stuff is not my fortay but I never heard of that.

    If you are suggesting backloading so you can release Welker later and not get paid I would simply ask why would Welker or his agent agree to that?

    Not my words, but from what you read from some places there might not be as many big spenders this year in FA? I have no idea but if it was true they might let Welker test the market and come back to them to see if they can work something out.

    The Pats obviously have a number in mind for his value at this point in his career and expected role going forward. If they can not get there or close enough with him, you know they will just let him walk. They've shown to have no fear in that.




    What I was thinking was we could pay Welker fairly for two seasons and the third year can be a higher level to save him and his agent face on his contract. Now you are probably right...Welker wouldn't go for it and you may be right about letting him test the market as well. And I am probably wrong about back loading a three year deal, my thinking was that in three years the cap will probably go up by say 5-10 million -  we could get Welker to take a pay cut at the age of 36 and reduce the hit, or we could outright release a 36 year old reciever at that point.

    Your idea makes more sense. 

     

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