Manning v Brady debate

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from freediro. Show freediro's posts

    Manning v Brady debate

    ok i am here to propose some good debate over this topic and not just sit her blasting Manning and praising Brady.

    All i want to say first and foremost, if in football all it comes down to is winning the game and most important thing is to win the SB every year, and that defines the best. Then how in the hell can you name Manning a better QB when Brady has 2 more SB rings with 2 of them back-to-back! Those numbers scream that Brady is a natural leader, he has the skills at any moment to overcome anything for the win. Manning also has a SB ring, but to be honest that was one of the lamest teams out of the NFC to play them.

    Secondly, yes, Manning will end up breaking all kinds of records, but what about Brady's records? Brady could set another record if his next two games are again over 300 yards passing? I don't get it . . . . .

    If we are talking pure passer QB and thats what QB's do, they pass the ball, than it's Manning. But if you're talking about a QB who is the true leader and driving force than its Brady. Brad spent years without top receivers, and one year when he had almost no real receiving threats at all. Manning has been nurtured almost his entire career with the personnel around him.

    So if football is all about your record and who wins the SB, isn't Brady better?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    Why, oh why do some folks persist in this argument?  This horse is being beaten and just won't die.  If you check this site, you will find MANY, MANY discussion strings going back months about this topic..  nothing new can be added here.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bearclaw. Show Bearclaw's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]All i want to say first and foremost, if in football all it comes down to is winning the game and most important thing is to win the SB every year, and that defines the best. Posted by freediro[/QUOTE]

    I think this is rubbish.

    If this were the criteria, to just ignore the regular season record, then Dan Marino is nothing but a bum quaterback huh?

    I'd argue he's a top 5.

    The SB is not like the World Series, it's a coin toss.

    As for Manning, he is the whole team, he's probably #1 of all time.

    Brady? no doubt he'll be among the best ever, but it won't be SB wins, that's just insulting to him in my book. You've got to consider the man's whole career.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdoggg. Show underdoggg's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    I've got to disagree as well.  Surprise, Surprise. 

    A superbowl victory is a team victory and there is no greater team sport than football.  As the most important player on the field, the QB still has less impact than a single player in basketball or a pitcher in baseball, for example. 

    Arguing who is better has to be a deeper question than who has more rings.  That puts Trent Dilfer ahead of Dan Marino. 

    I will also challenge this.  I think Brady is a better pure passer than Manning. 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    I really don't want to get suckered into another debate especially when both these guys have barely passed the halfway point in there careers so I'll just say this.

    Pats fans say Super Bowls are what really matters

    Colts fans say stats are what really matters

    It's both, you can't ignore either and thats why this debate never ends and won't unless something changes.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Re: Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]I've got to disagree as well.  Surprise, Surprise.  A superbowl victory is a team victory and there is no greater team sport than football.  As the most important player on the field, the QB still has less impact than a single player in basketball or a pitcher in baseball, for example.  Arguing who is better has to be a deeper question than who has more rings.  That puts Trent Dilfer ahead of Dan Marino.  I will also challenge this.  I think Brady is a better pure passer than Manning. 
    Posted by underdoggg[/QUOTE]
    I can't argue your Marino Dilfer example but conversely if SB's did not matter than you would see names like Daunte Cullpepper, Mcnair, etc ahead of Bradshaw, or Aikman.  Is Warren Moon better than Joe Montana?  None of these parallels fit Manning or Brady, Brady has put up passer records, Manning has won a SB.  There is no historical comparison. 

    Brady does not= Bradshaw
    Manning does not= Marino
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdoggg. Show underdoggg's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    Shen - your points are well taken. 

    To me it is not just a stats thing where Manning is concerned.  I see him as more of the OC than the OC.  Don't take this the wrong way, because in certain aspects I think Brady is a better QB than Manning, but when Brady has to go to his wristband in order to call a play, I know his command of the offense is not the same as Manning's. 

    Now it may have something to do with Brady's OC becoming an HC this year, but that almost happened with the colts and they were prepared to promote someone internally. 
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from NickC1188. Show NickC1188's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    again?
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Re: Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Manning v Brady debate : I think this is rubbish. If this were the criteria, to just ignore the regular season record, then Dan Marino is nothing but a bum quaterback huh? I'd argue he's a top 5. The SB is not like the World Series, it's a coin toss. As for Manning, he is the whole team, he's probably #1 of all time. Brady? no doubt he'll be among the best ever, but it won't be SB wins, that's just insulting to him in my book. You've got to consider the man's whole career.
    Posted by Bearclaw[/QUOTE]


    "THE SUPERBOWL IS A COIN TOSS"  thank you I haven't laughed like that in years.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Re: Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]Shen - your points are well taken.  To me it is not just a stats thing where Manning is concerned.  I see him as more of the OC than the OC.  Don't take this the wrong way, because in certain aspects I think Brady is a better QB than Manning, but when Brady has to go to his wristband in order to call a play, I know his command of the offense is not the same as Manning's.  Now it may have something to do with Brady's OC becoming an HC this year, but that almost happened with the colts and they were prepared to promote someone internally. 
    Posted by underdoggg[/QUOTE]

    Your offensive coach has been regarded as one of the best in the NFL for years. Brady is on his 3rd coordinator which actually has nothing to do with the wrist band and more to do with running different variations of the offense. The offense since 2001 has been completely overhauled. COMPLETELY.

    Manning has been in his offense for years. Years filled with lots of interceptions and a long growth period. Brady had very little growth period. He came on the scene and started winning. He has never stopped. I will take a QB that wins with a wrist band over one that loses without.

    Also before you begin with the whole "Brady had a better team" petty argument the Patriots were 5-11 and 0-1 before Brady became the QB. With that line of reasoning I guess the addition of 36 year old Bryan Cox was the real reason the Pats became a superbowl team in 2001 instead of the QB.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Evil2009. Show Evil2009's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Re: Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Manning v Brady debate : I think this is rubbish. If this were the criteria, to just ignore the regular season record, then Dan Marino is nothing but a bum quaterback huh? I'd argue he's a top 5. The SB is not like the World Series, it's a coin toss. As for Manning, he is the whole team, he's probably #1 of all time. Brady? no doubt he'll be among the best ever, but it won't be SB wins, that's just insulting to him in my book. You've got to consider the man's whole career.
    Posted by Bearclaw[/QUOTE]

    You mean they pick the winner by a coin toss then fix the game? Could you come up with a dumber statement?
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdoggg. Show underdoggg's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Re: Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Manning v Brady debate : Your offensive coach has been regarded as one of the best in the NFL for years. Brady is on his 3rd coordinator which actually has nothing to do with the wrist band and more to do with running different variations of the offense. The offense since 2001 has been completely overhauled. COMPLETELY. Manning has been in his offense for years. Years filled with lots of interceptions and a long growth period. Brady had very little growth period. He came on the scene and started winning. He has never stopped. I will take a QB that wins with a wrist band over one that loses without. Also before you begin with the whole "Brady had a better team" petty argument the Patriots were 5-11 and 0-1 before Brady became the QB. With that line of reasoning I guess the addition of 36 year old Bryan Cox was the real reason the Pats became a superbowl team in 2001 instead of the QB.
    Posted by TrueChamp[/QUOTE]

    TC - I see it my way and you see it yours and I complemented Brady's physical attributes. 

    But I will challenge some of your comments.  I just looked it up some history and it appears that Brady has had only 2 oc's - Weis and McDaniels, and McDaniels was Brady's QB Coach and was mentored by Weis.  Currently there is no OC, so I don't know who is calling the plays or what system they are running, but if it is the same system as in the past then I really don't understand the wristband. 

    As for your growth period comment, I am not sure where you get that.  Manning started Day 1 - so much for a growth period.  Brady sat the bench and learned for an entire year. 

    As for the record - in the year prior to brady starting, the pats were 5-11, and they lost only 2 games the entire year by more than 7 points.  The prior year they were 8-8.   

    On the other hand, the year prior to Manning being drafted, the colts were 3-13, losing 6 games by more than 7 points.  It was the reason they had the #1 pick, Manning.  Manning started day 1 and wen't 3-13 his rookie year.  He did have one other losing season 6-10. 

    I can't argue with the winning of Brady, but I consider winning and losing a team endeavor and not just the responsibility of one person.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from MarcW1. Show MarcW1's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]ok i am here to propose some good debate over this topic and not just sit her blasting Manning and praising Brady. All i want to say first and foremost, if in football all it comes down to is winning the game and most important thing is to win the SB every year, and that defines the best. Then how in the hell can you name Manning a better QB when Brady has 2 more SB rings with 2 of them back-to-back! Those numbers scream that Brady is a natural leader, he has the skills at any moment to overcome anything for the win. Manning also has a SB ring, but to be honest that was one of the lamest teams out of the NFC to play them. Secondly, yes, Manning will end up breaking all kinds of records, but what about Brady's records? Brady could set another record if his next two games are again over 300 yards passing? I don't get it . . . . . If we are talking pure passer QB and thats what QB's do, they pass the ball, than it's Manning. But if you're talking about a QB who is the true leader and driving force than its Brady. Brad spent years without top receivers, and one year when he had almost no real receiving threats at all. Manning has been nurtured almost his entire career with the personnel around him. So if football is all about your record and who wins the SB, isn't Brady better?
    Posted by freediro[/QUOTE]

    This rant screams of insecurity.  Who Cares?  Let it go.  Let's face it.  Both of these guys are good. 

    Manning has this but Brady did that.  How old are you?  19? 
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    Blah Blah Blah, everyone knows all the stats here are some Tom Brady Facts you probably don't know:
    • Some people wear a WWJD bracelet, Jesus wears a WWTBD bracelet.
    • Tom Brady once challenged Lance Armstrong in a "Who has more testicles?" contest. Tom Brady won by 5.
    • Tom Brady has the greatest Poker-Face of all time. He won the 1993 World Series of Poker, despite holding only a Joker, a Get out of Jail Free Monopoloy card, a 2 of clubs, 7 of spades and a green #4 card from the game UNO
    • Tom Brady ordered a Big Mac at Burger King, and got one
    • It takes Tom Brady 20 minutes to watch 60 Minutes.
    • Tom Brady played Russian Roulette with a fully loaded gun and won
    and all Peyton Manning has is a giant head.....case closed
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from crono420. Show crono420's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    All I can say is that if the Colts didn't choke so many times in the Playoffs, they'd be talking about rings instead of stats. Who cares about stats when it is all over, I care about winning the whole thing.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from mkulacz. Show mkulacz's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    Im a Pats fan. That said, a person is blind or dishonest if they say Manning isnt having a better season than Brady. Manning is in fact having a great season. I think he is even a better QB than Brady.

    But so what. Im pretty satisfied with Brady, 3 Superbowls, and a 17-1 season. Let the Colts have their Manning.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from FishTaco64. Show FishTaco64's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    Manning:
    271/388  69.8%     3,171 yards    6.4avg    21 TDS     9 INTs     102.7 Rating

    Brady:
    261/393  66.4%     3,049 yards    7.8avg     20 TDs    6 INTS   100.4 Rating


    Manning is slightly better in several catagories, but Brady has throw 33% fewer INTs then Manning and has a higher ypc average.
                       
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from m1020us. Show m1020us's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    In Response to Re: Manning v Brady debate:
    [QUOTE]Shen - your points are well taken.  To me it is not just a stats thing where Manning is concerned.  I see him as more of the OC than the OC.  Don't take this the wrong way, because in certain aspects I think Brady is a better QB than Manning, but when Brady has to go to his wristband in order to call a play, I know his command of the offense is not the same as Manning's.  Now it may have something to do with Brady's OC becoming an HC this year, but that almost happened with the colts and they were prepared to promote someone internally. 
    Posted by underdoggg[/QUOTE]


    Or Brady has to go to the band because of the Offense being more complicated than the Colts O.  The Pats change the plays to fit the competition every week....

    Last I checked, Belichick is the OC/HC....he appointed someone to be the assistant OC.  Once Indy loses more Offensive and defensive Coordinators, then you can come back and talk to us about being prepared.....
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from shenanigan. Show shenanigan's posts

    Re: Manning v Brady debate

    Peyton is the OC, Peyton calls his own plays?

    You hear this on comment boards a lot but the "experts" rarely bring it up or discount it.  Ever wonder why?

    I did a little amateur google research on this once and you might be surprised what Peyton Manning and Tom Moore have to say about this.  The issue is complex and I don't have time to explain the subtleties,(google-"does manning call his own plays") but I will tell you this:

    Does Manning call his own plays: not really Moore calls them, Manning can audible variations

    Does Brady Call his own plays:  Same as Manning, audibles

    Does anyone else in the NFL call thier own plays:  Yes
     
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