No Ground Game

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaPrince77. Show DaPrince77's posts

    No Ground Game

    Although the Patriots have ran the ball well at times, isn't time for Bill Belichick to draft a bonafide talent at the running -back position?

        It seems as if Bill Belichick and Co. do not put much value or stock into the running-back position. Let's face the facts, when Benjarvus Green-Elllis is your leading rusher, it is a clear indication of how weak the Pats are at running-back. This guy is a decent short-yardage runner but he does not have the ability or speed to make a play over 20 yards. Simply put, he is a role-player.
        Just as Greeen-Ellis should be a short-yardage specialist, Danny Woodhead is a real good  player who serves as a change-of-pace and third-down back.
        The Pats other backs are old and can not stay on the field (Fred Taylor, Sammy Morris).
        The perfect compliment on the Pats offense would be a dynamic-running-back who has the ability to break a big one every time he touches the ball, and could catch the ball coming out of the back-field.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    Why do you say "no ground game" and then proceed to act like this team has had great RBs to be successful?

    Woodhead has been a god send in for Faulk, so we know that role is solid.

    Morris hasn't even been used.

    Taylor has been hurt and could be close to returning.

    And BJGE is good when he actually gets carries. They ran all over MInny because they at least made an attempt to dictate with the run.

    In the games where they ignore the run, they basically eliminate it in the 2nd half, which in turn causes the passing game problems.

    I'd like to see them spread Pitt out off the coin toss and try go get up early.

    If they can do that, then try to run it with a concerted effort, not just abandoning it after one series.

    Logan Mankins returns after being known as a mauler, they have Gronk and Crump on the edges, Neal can still block well, and people want to say they have no ground game.

    I just don't buy it.

    When the playcalls even out on the stat sheets and they run it 20+ times without it being just obligatory carries, they usually win the game.

    Most teams use two RBs.  Most of it is skill set differences, but it's also health as to why teams need at least 2 legit backs.

    O'Brien needs to be more creative.

    Run with Woodhead MORE and maybe use Morris more, too. Pass out of the backfield on a check down to BJGE just to show you will.

    Stuff like that.


     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    I think that phase could stand improvement. NE's offense is GREAT at any one thing. They cannot simply run or pass at will, so they need to choose matchups.

    They certainly couldn't run last week straight up and needed to rely on spreading the offense out and letting Woody run draws and stuff. 

    The rest is execution. For teams that can stop I formation and 2TE runs, then you need, need, need for your WR to get open from time to time so that Woody can actually have open space to run within. 

    But as far as enforcing their will??? Ne won't be able to do that with the current offensive line. They just don't have pure power running personnel. They have an O-line that can do a few things well, but none GREAT. Just like their general offensive talent grouping (when healthy).
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaPrince77. Show DaPrince77's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    Although I love Fred Taylor's game, he can not stay on the field. So if the Pats Lose either BJGE or Danny Woodhead they will be in big trouble.

    Wouldn't Peyton Hillis look good in a Patriots uniform??

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from joerock22. Show joerock22's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    I agree with the original poster, and would like to see the Patriots invest a 1st or 2nd round pick in a RB.  The Patriots do not have a RB who can break a 50-yard run occassionally.  As a result, they have to rely on the passing game for big plays, which has been a problem.  Brady could throw more down the field if the Pats had a legitimate every-down back who could draw a safety into the box. 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from GEAUX-TIGRES. Show GEAUX-TIGRES's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    In Response to Re: No Ground Game:
    [QUOTE]Why do you say "no ground game" and then proceed to act like this team has had great RBs to be successful? Woodhead has been a god send in for Faulk, so we know that role is solid. Morris hasn't even been used. Taylor has been hurt and could be close to returning. And BJGE is good when he actually gets carries. They ran all over MInny because they at least made an attempt to dictate with the run. In the games where they ignore the run, they basically eliminate it in the 2nd half, which in turn causes the passing game problems. I'd like to see them spread Pitt out off the coin toss and try go get up early. If they can do that, then try to run it with a concerted effort, not just abandoning it after one series. Logan Mankins returns after being known as a mauler, they have Gronk and Crump on the edges, Neal can still block well, and people want to say they have no ground game. I just don't buy it. When the playcalls even out on the stat sheets and they run it 20+ times without it being just obligatory carries, they usually win the game. Most teams use two RBs.  Most of it is skill set differences, but it's also health as to why teams need at least 2 legit backs. O'Brien needs to be more creative. Run with Woodhead MORE and maybe use Morris more, too. Pass out of the backfield on a check down to BJGE just to show you will. Stuff like that.
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]
    Hate to disagree, but I don't see them having any ground game against the Steel Curtain. TB with have to win this one with his arm if he has time to throw.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from GEAUX-TIGRES. Show GEAUX-TIGRES's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    In Response to Re: No Ground Game:
    [QUOTE]Although I love Fred Taylor's game, he can not stay on the field. So if the Pats Lose either BJGE or Danny Woodhead they will be in big trouble. Wouldn't Peyton Hillis look good in a Patriots uniform??
    Posted by DaPrince77[/QUOTE]
    Yes he would. Reminds me of Alscott.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    I don;'t care what round it is, but of course they need depth at this position through the draft AND they'll need to sign a quality veteran (BB just tried to do it with Pierre Thomas in a trade).

    But to say they have "no ground game" is just silly.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ATJ. Show ATJ's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    No ground game; passing game has no receivers; oh woe is the Pats.  How in the name of time are they one of the top scoring teams in the league and have a 6-2 record? 

    Sheesh, is the sky really falling?

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from joerock22. Show joerock22's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    Maybe it's silly to say "no" ground game, but they definitely have a "weak" ground game.  It's not just depth at RB they need; they need a serious quality upgrade.  Woodhead/Faulk are fine on 3rd down, but BJGE should be more of a change-of-pace back who spells the primary guy. 

    Many of their successful runs are little draws.  Most of the time, they cannot simply line up and impose their will on people.  That is what you need to do to close out a good opponent.  Yes they ran on the Vikings, but Minnesota's run defense has not even been that good this year, and I would hardly call them a "good opponent." 
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Dessalines. Show Dessalines's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    In Response to Re: No Ground Game:
    [QUOTE]Why do you say "no ground game" and then proceed to act like this team has had great RBs to be successful? Woodhead has been a god send in for Faulk, so we know that role is solid. Morris hasn't even been used. Taylor has been hurt and could be close to returning. And BJGE is good when he actually gets carries. They ran all over MInny because they at least made an attempt to dictate with the run. In the games where they ignore the run, they basically eliminate it in the 2nd half, which in turn causes the passing game problems. I'd like to see them spread Pitt out off the coin toss and try go get up early. If they can do that, then try to run it with a concerted effort, not just abandoning it after one series. Logan Mankins returns after being known as a mauler, they have Gronk and Crump on the edges, Neal can still block well, and people want to say they have no ground game. I just don't buy it. When the playcalls even out on the stat sheets and they run it 20+ times without it being just obligatory carries, they usually win the game. Most teams use two RBs.  Most of it is skill set differences, but it's also health as to why teams need at least 2 legit backs. O'Brien needs to be more creative. Run with Woodhead MORE and maybe use Morris more, too. Pass out of the backfield on a check down to BJGE just to show you will. Stuff like that.
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]


    Good stuff...  An excellent description of what is going on with the running game in N.E....  Like you I think they need to commit to it more than they do and I agree that because they don't, it causes issues with the passing game.  Use Sammy Morris more, he can catch it out of the back field and he's not too bad in open space.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from beavis. Show beavis's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    If BB wants to pick up a few yards for a 1st down, he calls for a Brady short pass...O-line is always thinking pass-protection, no sure they know what run-blocking is...
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    In Response to Re: No Ground Game:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: No Ground Game : Good stuff...  An excellent description of what is going on with the running game in N.E....  Like you I think they need to commit to it more than they do and I agree that because they don't, it causes issues with the passing game.  Use Sammy Morris more, he can catch it out of the back field and he's not too bad in open space.
    Posted by Dessalines[/QUOTE]

    I don't know what the fear is.  I get Brady is great, but teams know this too so they prep for the pass gameplan and just hope NE won't mix in well designed runs.

    Their whole gameplan is to hold the fort against the pass and sniff out the run with the predictable BJGE sub. 

    I would use Morris more and run Woodhead as the feature back earlier in games.  This will allow them to show run more in the 1st half with additional backs that they may think are in for passing downs, only.

    Also, if they never pass to BJGE, then he is in there for one reason.  This is the same issue with Maroney.   Run, or decoy, never block or chip, etc. 

    Make BJGE a pass catcher so they see him used as one.

    Woodhead's skill set allows him to pounce for yards because he's adept at pass catching and can block.

    At some point, they have to open it up.



     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Tcal2. Show Tcal2's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    How did the last 1st round RB BB drafted work out for us?
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from danemcmenamin. Show danemcmenamin's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    Russ love the ideas man, who would you blame the predictability on?
    People are making the point that Brady's working a lot better out of the no huddle and that's obvious, the start of almost every game is pure proof. Apart from Sunday when he just seemed off would you place and of the blame of the slow starts on Brady. Personally I think it's O Brien's fault just wondering if you would agree maybe 75% on inept play calling and 25% on defences working just that bit harder at the start of the game. They need to try it all this week anyway they can't be predictable against that Pittsburg pass rush or Brady's guna get eaten up. I think they've been pretty predictable the past 2 years, O Brien really needs to go
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    If Fred Taylor doesn't come back AND stay healthy AND produce at a high level(UM) then we stay a one dimensional team on offense, our only hope is that with the addition of Mankins our O-line becomes Dominant which gives our young receiving core more time to get open, because right now I am scared to see what the Steelers do to our offense next week.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    What is your opinion of Cincy's offense compared to NE's? Or Miami's for that matter?

    Miami essentially beat Pitt 2 weeks ago minus a flat out blown call, and Cincy should have beaten Pitt by the sounds of things. 

    I think people think Pitt's D is the '85 Bears D a little too much.


     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaPrince77. Show DaPrince77's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    In Response to Re: No Ground Game:
    [QUOTE]What is your opinion of Cincy's offense compared to NE's? Or Miami's for that matter? Miami essentially beat Pitt 2 weeks ago minus a flat out blown call, and Cincy should have beaten Pitt by the sounds of things.  I think people think Pitt's D is the '85 Bears D a little too much.
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]

    Actually the Steelers dominated Cincy for most of the game, they were up 27-7 with 5:00 left in the 3rd, then Pitt got disinterested and let Palmer make a few long passes to TO. Yeah, they had a chance to win at the end, but the Steeler were clearly the better team and deserved to win.
    The Pats will not be able to run on the Steelers, but they could have some success by spreading them out, and actually have had a lot of success doing  that to them in the past. Also, the Pats TE's could present a problem for Pitt, specifically Aaron Hernandez.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    I would agree. I would also add NE allowed CIncy to come back in to the game in a soft zone and people here flipped out.

    I slightly disagree on the run game aspect, though.  I don't see any team looking good against a front with two TE stacks.  I just don't.  Crunpler and Gronk coming down on an OLB and a support DB is pretty nasty.

    We just don't see it enough.

    Maybe with Mankins back, we do?

    Maybe Taylor gets some looks?
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaPrince77. Show DaPrince77's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    In Response to Re: No Ground Game:
    [QUOTE]I would agree. I would also add NE allowed CIncy to come back in to the game in a soft zone and people here flipped out. I slightly disagree on the run game aspect, though.  I don't see any team looking good against a front with two TE stacks.  I just don't.  Crunpler and Gronk coming down on an OLB and a support DB is pretty nasty. We just don't see it enough. Maybe with Mankins back, we do? Maybe Taylor gets some looks?
    Posted by BBReigns[/QUOTE]

    When I used the term "no ground game," I really meant I would like to see them make some upgrades and create some more depth at the RB position. I know they can run, and especially in a 2-TE set with Mankins back,(like having 7 O-lineman) definitely a recipe for smash-mouth football. If Fred Taylor's toe would get better and he could stay healthy, it would be a huge boost to the Pats.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    you would think that with the game Hillis had last week, it would quiet the need to spend a first round draft choice on a RB.   
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    The problem is we wont run. 1st down we run(out of the exact same formation aslmost everytime) we get stopped and then we go shotgun (yawn) its the same sht.

    Russ, to answer your question I think the Steelers are even better then they have looked on defense. I think the other poster nailed it. they are almost so dominant on defense they appeared disinterested by half time. the offense has its weakness's but so does ours to say the least. At the very least Pitt will run Mendehall 20 times in power run formations to wear down a Defense. I cannot say the same for us.

    Also to people that think we do run a lot, I say running Wood or faulk out of shotgun formations is not wearing down a defense as much as putting your beefy 2 or 3 TE sets out there and cramming the ball down the other teams throats. Smash mouth football....we don't have it. Other teams do.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BBReigns. Show BBReigns's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    Oh, I see. My bad, Prince. I thought you meant they don't have one, period.

    We see the same thing, really.

    1. They have one and need to implement more of it.
    2. They need to supplant aging RBs on the roster in the future.

    Reiss seems to think Taylor was being rested due to the injury and it may be a blessing in disguise since the rest of his body will be fresh.

    We'll see.   I don;t mind if they do a 2 TE set, two WR split, and a Taylor predicting run, because you have two TEs, and two Guards who can really maul.

    Even if they play action off a predictable run with Taylor, it can be effective.

    It's not like the two WRs, say Tate and Branch or the two TEs with Crump and Gronk, you still have to respect those  passing options on play action.

    Or, as you just said, even if teams load up on a hammer with Taylor and the two TEs, guessing run, how easy will that be to stop over and over?

    It's not.  I'd argue Mankins and Neal are the two best Guards in the AFC in terms of run blocking.




     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    have the Pats been "saving" Taylor for this game? Will he play? If the Pats want to run 20-25 times in this game, Taylor and Morris need to be in the game plan.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from SilverSun. Show SilverSun's posts

    Re: No Ground Game

    DaPrince77 - you are onto something here, but I think it involves OLines as much as RB position and propose the following:

    Maybe Offense should be draft priority next year?  OLine was pitiful v Brownies - no holes for RB and we actually gave up trying the run.  Light, Neal, Koppen need to go next year and we need lots of O help.

    Let's get Julio Jones of Bama and the big OT from BC in the first round next year
    2rd Round OLB Kerrigan from Purdue and OG Henry of Nebraska
    3rd round RB Clay from Wisconsin and C O'Dowd from Cal or C from Ohio State - Brewer

    Let's load up on O and go huntin!
     

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