O-line

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from wozzy. Show wozzy's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to TheTinMan's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    2012

    season: 27 sacks, 72 hits

    1st 7:  14 sacks, 31 hits 

    hits are pretty much on pace to be equal to 2012, but number of sacks has doubled so far.  But what can you make of it?  Is it because the play calling is too predicitable, and D's are teeing off?  is Brady holding the ball longer (and does that mean he's having problems with reads, or the receivers can't get open, or D's have good coverage?)? Is it that the Oline is bad this year?

    I doubt there is just one thing you can point to.  Seems to me it's a blend of all these things, pointing to the entire O just not playing well.  It isn't one guy, or one part of the O.  The entire thing is out of whack right now, from the gameplan and playcalling to the execution.

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    Brady holding the ball too long waiting for the young guys, play calling that has constantly looking for the long ball instead of using more quick strike because the slot receivers and Vereen have been injured...

    Pro Football Focus just named Solder and Vollmer to their midseason pro bowl team, considering opposing teams know Brady has been struggling with the young receivers, we've played teams that have been solid against the run, that we are likely to take more sacks is no surprise.  The offense struggling extends to all positions including the guy calling the plays. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: O-line

    I think it a mistake to draw conclusions based on sacks. Also look at PFF OL grades for a read on how these guys are playing. Wendel and Connolly especially poor. 

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Low-FB-IQ. Show Low-FB-IQ's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think it a mistake to draw conclusions based on sacks. Also look at PFF OL grades for a read on how these guys are playing. Wendel and Connolly especially poor. 

    [/QUOTE]

    An even better conclusion would be to not rely on PFF ratings.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think it a mistake to draw conclusions based on sacks. Also look at PFF OL grades for a read on how these guys are playing. Wendel and Connolly especially poor. 

    [/QUOTE]


    Sacks certainly aren't the only relevant statistic, but I don't think there are many great lines giving up lots of sacks per pass attempt and vice versa.  As for PFF while I appreciate what they are doing, to me they are just another data point and hardly anything definitive.  There are too many plays imo that without knowing what was called it is impossible to assign credit or blame.  Case in point last season they said Talib was one of the worst CBs in football after coming to NE.  And of course they give Spikes much higher grades than our other LBs because they have no way of adjusting for the fact that he gets taken off the field in unfavorable situations (as far as I can tell).

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to pcmIV's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rkarp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think it a mistake to draw conclusions based on sacks. Also look at PFF OL grades for a read on how these guys are playing. Wendel and Connolly especially poor. 

    [/QUOTE]


    Sacks certainly aren't the only relevant statistic, but I don't think there are many great lines giving up lots of sacks per pass attempt and vice versa.  As for PFF while I appreciate what they are doing, to me they are just another data point and hardly anything definitive.  There are too many plays imo that without knowing what was called it is impossible to assign credit or blame.  Case in point last season they said Talib was one of the worst CBs in football after coming to NE.  And of course they give Spikes much higher grades than our other LBs because they have no way of adjusting for the fact that he gets taken off the field in unfavorable situations (as far as I can tell).

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    why does anyone need PFF or any fancy website to be able to spot Bad O line play? For the 1st time we saw Logan chewing out his line. Because they were good? Do we need an expert or film study to see a Free Rusher?? I dont get it...Maybe the coverage sacks need more breaking down but there were enough free rushers for me to say they werent good. We dont allow free rushers here. Thats worse than a fumbling RB in BBs eyes...

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to TripleOG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    why does anyone need PFF or any fancy website to be able to spot Bad O line play? For the 1st time we saw Logan chewing out his line. Because they were good? Do we need an expert or film study to see a Free Rusher?? I dont get it...Maybe the coverage sacks need more breaking down but there were enough free rushers for me to say they werent good. We dont allow free rushers here. Thats worse than a fumbling RB in BBs eyes...

    [/QUOTE]

    The line hasn't been up to par the past few games.  I don't think anyone thinks they have been great over that period.  If you read my earlier posts you'll see that I don't think it necessarily means it is going to be a season long issue.  They have had rough stretches in the past.  If we're willing to give Brady the benefit of the doubt surely we ought to give the offensive line that has been one of the top units in football the past few seasons a little slack as well.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from pezz4pats. Show pezz4pats's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to pcmIV's comment:
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    In response to pezz4pats' comment:
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    27 sacks and 34 hits, in 7 games, says so.  At this rate it will be 60/75. pfft

    [/QUOTE]

    Oh look.  Someone is making shyte up again.  Brady has not been sacked 27 times this year.

    Did you know that after 3 games in 2011 Brady was on pace to throw 27 picks.  Of course you did because you (correctly) blasted Rusty for using such a ridiculous tactic (as did I so please spare me from the ridiculous claims that I am Rusty), yet you are doing the exact same thing with the offensive line.  You have no problem doing all of the things you whine about with Rusty when it suits your Belichick bashing agenda.  You are two sides of the same coin.  LMAO.

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    Well, you are right it is 20.  I was thinking 27 times as it was all last year.

    This is 7 games not 3 and not a good comparison.  3 games is ridiculous but of course it fits your agenda of being a complete and total azz.

    The O- line is ranked 22nd right now, do they get back to last years 6th as Brady did to keep his down after 3 whole games?

    Doubtful unless you believe in fairies.

    Do you believe in fairies?

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from mthurl. Show mthurl's posts

    Re: O-line

    I think Solder is getting beat too much at this point, now people can point out how Matt Loght struggled early in his career and needed a lot of help with chip blocks from backs and tightends, but he was drafted a round lower than Solder. Solder is being expected to be our franchise tackle...we traded a key marque player for him...he's not doing enough right now. I'm hopefull he'll turn it around (out of all the people we have drafted recently, I thought he was the best blue chip talent we acquired).

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ghostofjri37. Show ghostofjri37's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to mthurl's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think Solder is getting beat too much at this point, now people can point out how Matt Loght struggled early in his career and needed a lot of help with chip blocks from backs and tightends, but he was drafted a round lower than Solder. Solder is being expected to be our franchise tackle...we traded a key marque player for him...he's not doing enough right now. I'm hopefull he'll turn it around (out of all the people we have drafted recently, I thought he was the best blue chip talent we acquired).

    [/QUOTE]

    I would agree that Solder had a pretty bad game against the Jet's but for the balance of the season he has been pretty good.

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/10/09/ranking-the-2013-offensive-lines-first-quarter/

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2013/10/09/ranking-the-2013-offensive-lines-first-quarter/

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: O-line

    In response to TripleOG's comment:
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    In response to wozzy's comment:
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    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:
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    It's NOT THE OLINE!

    My god. When all the offense wants to do is pass, pass, pass, the DLineman pin there ears back and go, making the job harder. On top of that, making your OLineman CONSTANTLY playing on their heels is exhausting for them.

    And finally...

    The complete lack of committment to any run game allows the DLine to set the tone by virtue of absentia! LET THESE PIGS GO HIT SOMEONE FOR A WHILE!

    The Oline has NOT been a problem. Totally innefectice, uninventive, predictable playcalling is the problem.

    Why would an opposing D commit to stopping the run? They wouldn't. If the Pats actually started RUNNING the ball, that would change.

    ALso, Brady isn't even good this year, so why worry about committing 7 guys to coverage? BRING MORE!

    The cure to BOTH of those is RUNNING THE BALL! It's SO FKING OBVIOUS!

    4th quarter and OT last game: 22 PASSES and 4 RUNS! NYJ had the ball for 46....FORTY-SIX MINUTES!

    Problems:

    1) McDaniels

    2) Brady

    3) New receivers

    4) Something I'm surely forgetting

    5) Still not the OLine

    6) Poor stadium acoustics

    7) Somewhere down here or lower, OLine.

    [/QUOTE]

    Agreed, the O Line is the least of our worries...

    [/QUOTE]


    Dude, are you serious??  Im gonna let you think that over...maybe edit it out later. Least of our worries!??!you watch the game drunk like rusty and assume Brady is S*cking..No, I know you are smarter than that. If you understand D-line play and its importance, how can you not understand the O-line allowing free rushers being a bad thing?

    [/QUOTE]

    How can you not see horrendous, predictable playcalling with no commitment to the run makes the DLineman's job infinitely easier? THey have ONE responsibility against the Pats, KILL BRADY! Don't worry about the run, even if a D is giving up 5 per carry, the Pats will stop themselves around 20 carries total, so no need to even concern yourself with it.

    ANd to rkarp...don't blame Brady at all? Wow. So it was Gronk's fault Brady threw behind him leading to that pick 6. It was Dobson's fault for not being 10 feet tall when streaking dow the sideline and Brady threw it over his head, well out of bounds. It was Amendola's fault when Brady underthrew him a week ago causing him to fall at the 1. Then those 3 straight passes from the 1 were certainly not Brady's fault, I'm sure the OLine and WRs failed him in every way, 3 straight times. I read that 1% line and kind of skipped over the rest of the post dismissing it out of hand. To not see Brady as a problem, and his 55% completion and sub-80 rating is....I don't know what that is. It centers around delusion.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from TripleOG. Show TripleOG's posts

    Re: O-line

    [/QUOTE]

    Agreed, the O Line is the least of our worries...

    [/QUOTE]


    Dude, are you serious??  Im gonna let you think that over...maybe edit it out later. Least of our worries!??!you watch the game drunk like rusty and assume Brady is S*cking..No, I know you are smarter than that. If you understand D-line play and its importance, how can you not understand the O-line allowing free rushers being a bad thing?

    [/QUOTE]

    How can you not see horrendous, predictable playcalling with no commitment to the run makes the DLineman's job infinitely easier? THey have ONE responsibility against the Pats, KILL BRADY! Don't worry about the run, even if a D is giving up 5 per carry, the Pats will stop themselves around 20 carries total, so no need to even concern yourself with it.

    ANd to rkarp...don't blame Brady at all? Wow. So it was Gronk's fault Brady threw behind him leading to that pick 6. It was Dobson's fault for not being 10 feet tall when streaking dow the sideline and Brady threw it over his head, well out of bounds. It was Amendola's fault when Brady underthrew him a week ago causing him to fall at the 1. Then those 3 straight passes from the 1 were certainly not Brady's fault, I'm sure the OLine and WRs failed him in every way, 3 straight times. I read that 1% line and kind of skipped over the rest of the post dismissing it out of hand. To not see Brady as a problem, and his 55% completion and sub-80 rating is....I don't know what that is. It centers around delusion.

    [/QUOTE]


     

    I can certainly agree the bad playcalling has an effect. O lines need to run block early and get in rythm. I mentioned in another thread,. play action pass from your own 10 to start the game is a horrendous call. (Did Joshy call O'bie for that playcall?)

    YOu need to run 1st before you try to trick someone on playaction. Yes, Josh is an Eediot. Im just saying, YOu cant Allow Free Rushers EVER! Weve had this lopsided offense for 5 years now and never consistently allowed free rushers as weve seen recently. Bottom line, they are drafted, coached,etc to pass block. Its not ideal but they know what the plan is going in. To just let a guy run past without touching him is unnacceptable. Thats why there are 5 of them. They need to work in unison. I imagine the fact that the Jets had 3 guys on the line who were dominant played an effect but the O-line still deserves a D iMO. Brady a D as well. If your unit puts up 14 pts it cant be a failure or F grade.

     

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