This is not negativity

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    This is not negativity

    Wow. Someone mentioned the trade as changing a $20 for 4 $5's. I think the Pats got 3 5's from this draft.

    I expected any WR that was drafted to be a redshirt player with a hard time grasping the offense. I don't have a hard time with the WR choice. Where is the DT help? Another S? After drafting Wilson and signing Wilson? I understand the need for a LB, but with the teams first draft choice? With so many question marks on his desire (read Bedard report). 

    I really expected a different outcome in this draft. The tone in the building has been " this year the draft is going to be different than past drafts", which I interpreted to be the Pats would actually going to surprise us with a bold move. 

    I honestly would have been ecstatic to trade up and grab Milliner or Richardson for the 1 and 3 the Pats had this year. 

    I will try to with hold further opinion until I am at camp watching with my own eyes, but really disappointed last night with the outcome. 

     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    Oh well - I really like the first three picks - 

    Everyone wants help with the pass rush - so we draft the fastest OLB/DE hybrid who just happens to have a 41.5" vertical (at 250lbs!) on top of a 6'3 frame with long arms and has experience playing as a DB - so he upgrades pass rush, disruption of passing lanes, and underneath coverage of TEs and RBs. Might help against the read option as well. - Check

    Everyone wants a tall WR and a fast WR - so we draft a guy with A+ hands, a big body, 6"3 height, speed (3.37 at his pro day), good football IQ, decent route running, AND no red flags. - Check

    Need depth in the defensive backfield - so we pick up an aggressive CB, and stretch for an aggressive S - Not all that exciting but ... 3rd rounders never are until they prove that they are good, and only at best 1 in 4 of them ever do (closer to 1 in 10 by the back end of the round)

    Do I want a DT and some OLine depth - sure, but we have three new DL already on the roster and a fair amount of depth players so after the top of the first round, not sure how much real help was out there. And with Scar working his magic, 4th rounders and later on the OLine is about what I expected.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    Misleading thread title hey.....

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to TrueChamp's comment:

    Misleading thread title hey.....



    Hey - my post wasn't negative!

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from rkarp. Show rkarp's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to mia76's comment:

    Oh well - I really like the first three picks - 

    Everyone wants help with the pass rush - so we draft the fastest OLB/DE hybrid who just happens to have a 41.5" vertical (at 250lbs!) on top of a 6'3 frame with long arms and has experience playing as a DB - so he upgrades pass rush, disruption of passing lanes, and underneath coverage of TEs and RBs. Might help against the read option as well. - Check

    Everyone wants a tall WR and a fast WR - so we draft a guy with A+ hands, a big body, 6"3 height, speed (3.37 at his pro day), good football IQ, decent route running, AND no red flags. - Check

    Need depth in the defensive backfield - so we pick up an aggressive CB, and stretch for an aggressive S - Not all that exciting but ... 3rd rounders never are until they prove that they are good, and only at best 1 in 4 of them ever do (closer to 1 in 10 by the back end of the round)

    Do I want a DT and some OLine depth - sure, but we have three new DL already on the roster and a fair amount of depth players so after the top of the first round, not sure how much real help was out there. And with Scar working his magic, 4th rounders and later on the OLine is about what I expected.



    Mia,

    Honestly, I haven't seen much of these players other than some tapes after they were drafted. Bedards blurb regarding Collin's really bothered me. Great athlete, no doubt, but sounds like he has some serious dog in him, which to me is a major red flag. 

    Dobson is a project. Every young WR that comes to this team is, unless they are top 5 talent, which Dobson is not. That's fine however, as the Pats need to develop some WR's even if it takes 2-3 years. I have no problem with his selection.

    How many CB's do you expect the team to keep? I think it will be 5. We have to assume Talib, Dennerd and Arrington are locks. Ras has more talent than the Rutgers CB, not that it means Ras is a lock. But lets face it, the Pats keep 2 of 3 between Ras, Cole and Ryan. I also think they keep 5 safeties. McCourty, Wilson, Wilson are locks. 2of 3 between Ebner, Gregory and Harmon will stick. 

    I would have much preferred a number 1 pick that was a potential player in the rotation every Sunday. I don't think we can say these draft choices will dress every Sunday. Collins and Dobson obviously are locks to make the team. I think it remains to be seen with the balance of these choices. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from TrueChamp. Show TrueChamp's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to mia76's comment:

    Oh well - I really like the first three picks - 

    Everyone wants help with the pass rush - so we draft the fastest OLB/DE hybrid who just happens to have a 41.5" vertical (at 250lbs!) on top of a 6'3 frame with long arms and has experience playing as a DB - so he upgrades pass rush, disruption of passing lanes, and underneath coverage of TEs and RBs. Might help against the read option as well. - Check

    Everyone wants a tall WR and a fast WR - so we draft a guy with A+ hands, a big body, 6"3 height, speed (3.37 at his pro day), good football IQ, decent route running, AND no red flags. - Check

    Need depth in the defensive backfield - so we pick up an aggressive CB, and stretch for an aggressive S - Not all that exciting but ... 3rd rounders never are until they prove that they are good, and only at best 1 in 4 of them ever do (closer to 1 in 10 by the back end of the round)

    Do I want a DT and some OLine depth - sure, but we have three new DL already on the roster and a fair amount of depth players so after the top of the first round, not sure how much real help was out there. And with Scar working his magic, 4th rounders and later on the OLine is about what I expected.



    Sorry Mia76, I agree with your sentiments. I was taking a dig at karp...he knows he deserves it!

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from portfolio1. Show portfolio1's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to mia76's comment:

     

    Oh well - I really like the first three picks - 

    Everyone wants help with the pass rush - so we draft the fastest OLB/DE hybrid who just happens to have a 41.5" vertical (at 250lbs!) on top of a 6'3 frame with long arms and has experience playing as a DB - so he upgrades pass rush, disruption of passing lanes, and underneath coverage of TEs and RBs. Might help against the read option as well. - Check

    Everyone wants a tall WR and a fast WR - so we draft a guy with A+ hands, a big body, 6"3 height, speed (3.37 at his pro day), good football IQ, decent route running, AND no red flags. - Check

    Need depth in the defensive backfield - so we pick up an aggressive CB, and stretch for an aggressive S - Not all that exciting but ... 3rd rounders never are until they prove that they are good, and only at best 1 in 4 of them ever do (closer to 1 in 10 by the back end of the round)

    Do I want a DT and some OLine depth - sure, but we have three new DL already on the roster and a fair amount of depth players so after the top of the first round, not sure how much real help was out there. And with Scar working his magic, 4th rounders and later on the OLine is about what I expected.

     



    Mia,

     

    Honestly, I haven't seen much of these players other than some tapes after they were drafted. Bedards blurb regarding Collin's really bothered me. Great athlete, no doubt, but sounds like he has some serious dog in him, which to me is a major red flag. 

    Dobson is a project. Every young WR that comes to this team is, unless they are top 5 talent, which Dobson is not. That's fine however, as the Pats need to develop some WR's even if it takes 2-3 years. I have no problem with his selection.

    How many CB's do you expect the team to keep? I think it will be 5. We have to assume Talib, Dennerd and Arrington are locks. Ras has more talent than the Rutgers CB, not that it means Ras is a lock. But lets face it, the Pats keep 2 of 3 between Ras, Cole and Ryan. I also think they keep 5 safeties. McCourty, Wilson, Wilson are locks. 2of 3 between Ebner, Gregory and Harmon will stick. 

    I would have much preferred a number 1 pick that was a potential player in the rotation every Sunday. I don't think we can say these draft choices will dress every Sunday. Collins and Dobson obviously are locks to make the team. I think it remains to be seen with the balance of these choices. 



    Actually I have read some people saying Dobson was their first choice at WR in this very good group of WRs!

    Still, I think any WR will have troubles in his first 1-2 years in this system unless they are especially savy.

     

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from rtuinila. Show rtuinila's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    rkarp,

    all you ever do on this board is spew negativity. Let me sum up your typical comment's

    Player X is is lousy with no talent, I would have picked player y who would be an immediate impact player.

    BB doesn't know how to pick anything but lousy players, reaching on all his picks.

    We didn't need that D player with that pick, he would have been there at pick yada-yada, we should have picked player hoop-de-do who would have been an obvious impact playeron the O side of the  ball.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    RKarp - pretty solid analysis.

    I actually think one or both of Dobson and Boyce will be significant contributors this year - there is a real need and I like what they both bring. I'm thinking 50/700 between them.

    And I saw that 'dogging' rap on Collins - and I don't buy it. That was a dreadful team that was getting beaten up every week, and the offense wasn't helping the defense. Add to it that he was probably getting a lot of attention and double teams on pretty much every play as the best defender - by the second half of games he was probably pretty exhausted. And 10 sacks/20 tackles for loss from a dogger doesn't quite compute. BB had a personal workout with him which is more than Bedard did. And speed at the LB/DE position is a major need. I see a fair amount of 3rd down action for Collins and prehaps some earlier down action as well.

    Agree about the DBs - not that impressed with Cole - if RasI is healthy, I think Cole is probably gone. And I think it will be an interesting competition at safety - and I think Wilson and McCourty are the only guarantees with A. Wilson probably the third if he still has it.

    I think the only real 'starting job' openings on this team is WR. the rest of the starters are pretty well set and you are looking at rotational depth, nickel and dime personel (representing half the defensive snaps) and week to week changes in the 'base' look, and adjustments to the offensive sets from jumbo through 4 wide.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rkarp1. Show Rkarp1's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to rtuinila's comment:

    rkarp,

    all you ever do on this board is spew negativity. Let me sum up your typical comment's

    Player X is is lousy with no talent, I would have picked player y who would be an immediate impact player.

    BB doesn't know how to pick anything but lousy players, reaching on all his picks.

    We didn't need that D player with that pick, he would have been there at pick yada-yada, we should have picked player hoop-de-do who would have been an obvious impact playeron the O side of the  ball.



    First of all, I have never said anyone is lousy. I am simply sick of all the depth picks. This team has 11 rush ends. 9 of them are depth/mediocre. This team has 7 CB's and 6 them are average and there is Talib whom most likely is one and done. 

    Every now and then I would like to see a reach for a play making stud. Whether it be free agency or the draft, take a shot. 

    If you feel it is spewing negativity, either pass my post or put me on ignore.

     
  12. This post has been removed.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Muzwell. Show Muzwell's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to Rkarp1's comment:

    ...

    First of all, I have never said anyone is lousy. I am simply sick of all the depth picks. This team has 11 rush ends. 9 of them are depth/mediocre. This team has 7 CB's and 6 them are average and there is Talib whom most likely is one and done. 

     

    Every now and then I would like to see a reach for a play making stud. Whether it be free agency or the draft, take a shot. 

    If you feel it is spewing negativity, either pass my post or put me on ignore.

     

    [QUOTE]

    Yeah, but you're not rkarp.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to mia76's comment:

     

    Oh well - I really like the first three picks - 

    Everyone wants help with the pass rush - so we draft the fastest OLB/DE hybrid who just happens to have a 41.5" vertical (at 250lbs!) on top of a 6'3 frame with long arms and has experience playing as a DB - so he upgrades pass rush, disruption of passing lanes, and underneath coverage of TEs and RBs. Might help against the read option as well. - Check

    Everyone wants a tall WR and a fast WR - so we draft a guy with A+ hands, a big body, 6"3 height, speed (3.37 at his pro day), good football IQ, decent route running, AND no red flags. - Check

    Need depth in the defensive backfield - so we pick up an aggressive CB, and stretch for an aggressive S - Not all that exciting but ... 3rd rounders never are until they prove that they are good, and only at best 1 in 4 of them ever do (closer to 1 in 10 by the back end of the round)

    Do I want a DT and some OLine depth - sure, but we have three new DL already on the roster and a fair amount of depth players so after the top of the first round, not sure how much real help was out there. And with Scar working his magic, 4th rounders and later on the OLine is about what I expected.

     



    Mia,

     

    Honestly, I haven't seen much of these players other than some tapes after they were drafted. Bedards blurb regarding Collin's really bothered me. Great athlete, no doubt, but sounds like he has some serious dog in him, which to me is a major red flag. 

    Dobson is a project. Every young WR that comes to this team is, unless they are top 5 talent, which Dobson is not. That's fine however, as the Pats need to develop some WR's even if it takes 2-3 years. I have no problem with his selection.

    How many CB's do you expect the team to keep? I think it will be 5. We have to assume Talib, Dennerd and Arrington are locks. Ras has more talent than the Rutgers CB, not that it means Ras is a lock. But lets face it, the Pats keep 2 of 3 between Ras, Cole and Ryan. I also think they keep 5 safeties. McCourty, Wilson, Wilson are locks. 2of 3 between Ebner, Gregory and Harmon will stick. 

    I would have much preferred a number 1 pick that was a potential player in the rotation every Sunday. I don't think we can say these draft choices will dress every Sunday. Collins and Dobson obviously are locks to make the team. I think it remains to be seen with the balance of these choices. 




    If you go 0-12 lets see you not dog it.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from prolate0spheroid. Show prolate0spheroid's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to Rkarp1's comment:

    In response to rtuinila's comment:

     

    rkarp,

    all you ever do on this board is spew negativity. Let me sum up your typical comment's

    Player X is is lousy with no talent, I would have picked player y who would be an immediate impact player.

    BB doesn't know how to pick anything but lousy players, reaching on all his picks.

    We didn't need that D player with that pick, he would have been there at pick yada-yada, we should have picked player hoop-de-do who would have been an obvious impact playeron the O side of the  ball.

     



    First of all, I have never said anyone is lousy. I am simply sick of all the depth picks. This team has 11 rush ends. 9 of them are depth/mediocre. This team has 7 CB's and 6 them are average and there is Talib whom most likely is one and done. 

     

    Every now and then I would like to see a reach for a play making stud. Whether it be free agency or the draft, take a shot. 

    If you feel it is spewing negativity, either pass my post or put me on ignore.



    Rkarp, I would like them to reach for a stud too--and they sort of did last year twice.  I think the reason they didn't do it this year was (1) they weren't that confident that many of the guys were studs and (2) they didn't have a lot of picks to work with.  Given their few (and kind of lousy) picks this year, they would have had a hard time trading up.  So they traded down and went for depth.  I really think it was the right strategy and like where they ended up:

    • They need at least three decent receivers.  They now have two drafted rookies (plus apparently some UDRFAs), Jones, Jenkins, Amendola, Edelmen, Ebert, Holmes, Aiken.  I think Stallworth and maybe even Branch will be in camp too.  I think they will find three decent contributors out of that group and will also end up with decent depth.
    • I really like the potential Collins brings.  The big difference between him and the edge guys they have now is he seems to have coverage skills.  That's what they've lacked in edge players to date,  and a guy who can both rush and drop back would really improve the team if he can play.  Buchanan seems to offer the same.  
    • Drafting half the Rutgers defensive backfield was a neat idea--you've got two guys who are used to working with each other and have a reputation for being smart and good communicators.  The Pats need depth there and I think drafting a "team" was an interesting idea that may pay off, especially when you think of what a good communicator ex-Rutgers player McCourty is. 
    • The ILB i(Beauharnais) s supposed to be like a smarter version of Spikes.  Spikes is a free agent next year.  I think that says all you need to know . . .
    • I'm not sure about Blount, but really for a late seventh rounder and a guy who probably isn't playing football until after the next summer Olympics, you really can't complain.  He's competition for Bolden.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BuzyDizzyIzzy. Show BuzyDizzyIzzy's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    This years draft class overall sucked.........IMO the Pats were smart...........dump the 1st round pick for multiple picks........pretty much all the first/second rounders would have been mid to low round drafts any other year. In reality the talent in the first and second round was really no better than the talent found in the mid and later rounds, no real studs at all. This draft was all about projects and depth for the roster only. THe only 2 players who have a legit shot at making an impact on the field this year is Dobson and Boyce..........wide recievers at the position we need the most help at out of the gate. Those 2 picks were very good.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Rkarp1. Show Rkarp1's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to Muzwell's comment:

    In response to Rkarp1's comment:

    ...

    First of all, I have never said anyone is lousy. I am simply sick of all the depth picks. This team has 11 rush ends. 9 of them are depth/mediocre. This team has 7 CB's and 6 them are average and there is Talib whom most likely is one and done. 

     

    Every now and then I would like to see a reach for a play making stud. Whether it be free agency or the draft, take a shot. 

    If you feel it is spewing negativity, either pass my post or put me on ignore.

     

    [QUOTE]

    Yeah, but you're not rkarp.

     



    Muzzy, it's me. Had issues with my sign in and had to re register

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    Wow. Someone mentioned the trade as changing a $20 for 4 $5's. I think the Pats got 3 5's from this draft.

    I expected any WR that was drafted to be a redshirt player with a hard time grasping the offense. I don't have a hard time with the WR choice. Where is the DT help? Another S? After drafting Wilson and signing Wilson? I understand the need for a LB, but with the teams first draft choice? With so many question marks on his desire (read Bedard report). 

    I really expected a different outcome in this draft. The tone in the building has been " this year the draft is going to be different than past drafts", which I interpreted to be the Pats would actually going to surprise us with a bold move. 

    I honestly would have been ecstatic to trade up and grab Milliner or Richardson for the 1 and 3 the Pats had this year. 

    I will try to with hold further opinion until I am at camp watching with my own eyes, but really disappointed last night with the outcome. 



    I see it as changing a $10 (the #29 pick) for three $5 bills (Collins, Boyce and Ryan) and a $2 bill (Buchanan)

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from mia76. Show mia76's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to rameakap's comment:

    I see it as changing a $10 (the #29 pick) for three $5 bills (Collins, Boyce and Ryan) and a $2 bill (Buchanan)

     




    I like it! And I would add that a top ten is like a benjamin ($100) So where the Pats started the draft - a $10, 2 $5s and a $2, there was no way to get one of those benjamins that everyone thought they should get (a stud player).

    And I think when they checked the $10 bill they were given, they realized that the ink was smudged and it read Unted Stites of Amerca so they weren't really sure it was real. So they just used it with another team instead of trying to cash it in at the bank.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    It may not be negavity but it's wrong. 

    Why put all your eggs in one basket when it comes to drafting receivers when BB has struggled so much in that area? I don't trust BB on his drafting of receivers (or cornerbacks for that matter) that will hack it in the Pats system, so I'd personally rather see s couple of picks there than one. 

    On the other hand you could be right - that's the thing about drafts. You feel bad, but it ends up being good. You feel good, you end up being wrong. 

    But on this board we're handing out Super Bowl rings to other teams like the Broncos now. 

    Drafting is not BB's weakness, sorry to break it to you. His weakness is in player retention, overly rigid contract negotiations, and insistence of "value contracts" in (almost) all cases rather than bringing in marquee talent that is proven NFL talent. 

    Yeah, BB has draft quirks, occasionally will take someone way higher than he should, but overall he's been a top five/seven drafter last few years. His other draft quirk, getting fixated on a "best player" based on his own ratings, was not in evidence this year as he drafted based on need. And yet no one is happy. 

    I was way more annoyed by the bungling of the Sanders contract than I am by this year's draft. 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42AND46. Show 42AND46's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to BostonTrollSpanker's comment:

     

    It may not be negavity but it's wrong. 

    Why put all your eggs in one basket when it comes to drafting receivers when BB has struggled so much in that area? I don't trust BB on his drafting of receivers (or cornerbacks for that matter) that will hack it in the Pats system, so I'd personally rather see s couple of picks there than one. 

    On the other hand you could be right - that's the thing about drafts. You feel bad, but it ends up being good. You feel good, you end up being wrong. 

    But on this board we're handing out Super Bowl rings to other teams like the Broncos now. 

    Drafting is not BB's weakness, sorry to break it to you. His weakness is in player retention, overly rigid contract negotiations, and insistence of "value contracts" in (almost) all cases rather than bringing in marquee talent that is proven NFL talent. 

    Yeah, BB has draft quirks, occasionally will take someone way higher than he should, but overall he's been a top five/seven drafter last few years. His other draft quirk, getting fixated on a "best player" based on his own ratings, was not in evidence this year as he drafted based on need. And yet no one is happy. 

    I was way more annoyed by the bungling of the Sanders contract than I am by this year's draft. 

     



    this will drive Rusty and a few of his disciples crazy but this is about the sanest most accurate perspective/assessment of a GM one is likely to get

     

     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    I honestly would have been ecstatic to trade up and grab Milliner or Richardson for the 1 and 3 the Pats had this year. 


    You are living in fantasy land.  The Dolphins parted with a 2nd round pick to move up 9 spots and most people think they got good value.  Yet you think we could have moved up twice as many spots with a 3rd rounder? 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from pcmIV. Show pcmIV's posts

    Re: This is not negativity

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    I honestly would have been ecstatic to trade up and grab Milliner or Richardson for the 1 and 3 the Pats had this year.



    And of course the fact that you highlight the two Jets choices is amusing to say the least.  If only we could draft more like New Jersey.

     
  25. This post has been removed.

     

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