Vince Redd

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dx7. Show dx7's posts

    Vince Redd

    I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that Vince Redd will replace Vrable as the Pats new starting OLB this year. There are a few scouts who expect great thing from Redd. He has all of the measurables: 6'6", 260 plus pounds, decent speed, and smarts.

    Redd has been in the system for 1 year, so we should see a jump in his production. This is somewhat uncharted territory, since the Pats don't usually have rookie starters or second year guys at LB. But take a look at Mayo and Guyton in their rookie year. Redd has a chance to play and play well as a starter. P. Woods is a career backup and Tully is nothing more than a situational pass rusher. I think Crables sqrawny legs may stunt his development. Give him a few years and Crable may also become a starter.

    -- dx
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from pyegian. Show pyegian's posts

    Vince Redd

    I like Redd as a prospect, but I think Crable is much more likely to pick up the spot. There's a reason he was drafted in the 3rd round while Redd was undrafted. He's a better player. He does have skinny legs but he has ridiculous upper body strength, and I'm sure he's been working those legs this offseason. I'd like to see Redd stick around, but if, and this is a big if, Vrabel's replacement is someone already on the roster, I'd bet it is Crable.
     
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    Vince Redd

    Yeah, I'm really high on Vince Redd. YouTube him, and you'll find a long series of plays, none of which are really "highlights" but all of which show off good speed, nice strength at the point of attack, and good awareness in space. I think he's what I'd term a careful player, in that he appears to over-analyze his responsibilities at times, relying on his athleticism to remain in the play. I imagine that with another year in our system, he could develop into more of a reactive player; the physical tools are there, but the rawness shows. If he can allow his natural instincts to translate into playmaking ability, then I certainly do think he could win the starting spot. But we'll see what happens.
     
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    Vince Redd

    Yeah, the knock on Big Redd is upper body strength. He only put up 13 reps at the combine which was weak.

    He also worked in the Groh's 3-4 before his transfer.

    I won't write off anyone who makes the Patriots team. But I would have to say Crable would be more likely to get the nod, just based on experience and overall physical ability.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from DayWooo763. Show DayWooo763's posts

    Vince Redd

    I believe that at leats one of these players if not both will turn into solid players. Crable was fantastic at Michigan and some even thought he was better than Lamar Woodley who is now tearing it up in Blitzburgh opposite James Harrison. Let's not forget that Vrabel is not the only one we have to replace. Adalius is a true freak of nature, but he is on the worng side of 30 and though he didn't play much early on in Baltimore, he is still not young by any means. I believe that if one of these guys steps up next year (Crable), then that doesn't necesarily mean the death of the other's career. If Redd isn;t ready next year, than I think by the time Adalius needs help he will have had ample to time prove himself. So l think that there is still upside for BOTH players, and a spot for BOTH of them on the roster.
     
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    Vince Redd

    I also want to add that the description of Vince Redd's speed as "decent" is beyond modest. He ran a 4.58 at 263lbs!!!! That is blazing fast for a linebacker!! While his playing speed is someting that we can't yet judge at this early stage in his career, his physical tools are undeniable.
    Same goes for Crable
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Vince Redd

    The "arm tackling" was mostly from the DBs. Outside of Meriweather, not one of them has a clue how to break down in the open field.

    That and Pierre Woods who is a shabby tackler.

    It is a huge area that needs to be addressed this offseason.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BrooklineRob. Show BrooklineRob's posts

    Vince Redd

    Hate to say it, but until I see proof on the field from Redd or Crable that they're legit NFL players, I'll scratch my head at the loss of Vrabel. Surely Bill has something in mind to fill holes at OLB other than to rely on unproven players? The NFL is full of guys that were great college players but that didn't amount to a hill of beans in the pros. Were Crable or Redd great college players? Maybe above average or good--but not great. Let's not call them the answer to our prayers until they prove it on the field.
     
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    Vince Redd

    Why do we insist this is the best OLB class in years? Only one of the top ten OLBs in this draft actually played OLB in a 3-4 scheme. Most colleges employ a 4-3, and even if the DEs occasionally stood up, most were not responsible for coverages.

    Of course, I'm splitting hairs. =p I do like your take on things, Faucet, and I tend to agree with you fairly often. I just don't see how we pass on players already in the system, who might still amount to something (cf. Cassel) in hopes of lucking out in the draft for a player who has to change positions.

    Then again, I'm biased, because I like Vince Redd a lot. I heard good reports of him throughout the year, and the fact that BB promoted him from the practice squad has to mean something. If he can make the team again this year, I think he has a shot to start--certainly he can't be worse than Woods.
     
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    Vince Redd

    Crable was one of the best college players when he came out. His draft stock was hurt because the Michigan team defense wasn't very good. But coming in a few people had him much higher than he went. You don't luck your way into 28 takcles for a loss and 7.5 sacks.

    Redd? Well he played at Liberty, which is practically a community college.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from zbellino. Show zbellino's posts

    Vince Redd

    The fact that BB promoted Redd means that Crable was injured. That is the only reason he came up. That and the other injuries.

    As prospects they aren't really close. Although we will have to wait for camp to see how it shakes out.

    And getting an OLB doesn't mean passing on either player. You need two starting OLBs. And while AT has quite a bit of playing time left, the clock is ticking overall. Why not start developing them now?

    I think adding one more on day one is just prudent.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ush. Show ush's posts

    Vince Redd

    It's apparent that BB and co. like someone or a couple guys that they feel they can get at OLB in the draft who can step right in.
     
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    Vince Redd

    Surely Bill has something in mind to fill holes at OLB other than to rely on unproven players?

    I can think of two "unproven" players BB plugged in and did pretty good...Brady and Cassel! I'll admit LB is a different animal. Mayo was another "unproven" guy who did well, though. But just because these guys didn't get much PT doesn't mean they won't improve over the offseason. They'll have to compete in camp, and I don't know what FA they'd bring in. I doubt a starting quality LB will fall to 23. Maybe they're thinking JT to bolster the crew. He'd probably not ask too much. I don't see Ray Lewis here, either. So it may well be what you see is what you get! Although with BB anything could happen in the next two months.
     
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    Vince Redd

    Hard to tell considering the kid never played a down in an NFL game. I wish him luck though.

     
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    Vince Redd

    A lot of you guys make sense with your points. All I'm saying is that let's not overhype the young guys based on a few plays in preseason and good college careers. I hope the young guys pan out, but this team is poised to win now and the only real additions have come on the offensive side of the ball. Last I checked, this team scored points--even with Cassel having to jump in and make the transition to starter. I'm not saying that the Pats are done collecting players, I just hope that the plans B and C that materialize after losing Vrabel don't amount to the LB equivalent of Deltha O'Neal and the other reclaimation projects that failed last year. At this point, I think they need bodies on D, and I hope they address the need through free agency and the draft with players who are legit--not superstars--just legit. I'm usually one to preach patience. Maybe I should just relax a bit here and wait and see.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from dx7. Show dx7's posts

    Vince Redd

    [Quote]The fact that BB promoted Redd means that Crable was injured. That is the only reason he came up. That and the other injuries.

    As prospects they aren't really close. Although we will have to wait for camp to see how it shakes out.

    And getting an OLB doesn't mean passing on either player. You need two starting OLBs. And while AT has quite a bit of playing time left, the clock is ticking overall. Why not start developing them now?

    I think adding one more on day one is just prudent.[/Quote]

    Tom Brady was a sixth round pick and not considered a star in college. I don't understand why anyone would put so much weight on what a player did in college. Your performance in college is not an accurate indicator of how you will perform as a pro! Redd has all of the physical attributes and the intangibles to be a better player than Crabel. Redd would have been promoted even if there had been no LB injuries last year. The Patriots were very happy with his progress.

    -- dx
     
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    Vince Redd

    m
     
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    Vince Redd

    Vince Redd was only called up cause of the massive list of injurys we had at LB last season.
     
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    Vince Redd

    " Redd would have been promoted even if there had been no LB injuries last year." - dx


    dx are you a coach for the Pats? if so can you get me a disscount on my season tickets? whats that? you are not a coach for this team and you have no real idea whether what you just said is true or not? Thats what i thought. You have no idea whether or not the pats would have called Redd up if we didnt have all those injurys the same way we dont know either so dont state it as if its fact cause you have no clue. I mean unless you work for ESPN in which case please continue to state what you THINK as fact.
     
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    Vince Redd

    dx7,

    Thanks for replying.

    Why do people put weight on college performance? Ummm, because it works? Nothing is 100% but it is fairly accurate. Take all the players at the pro-bowl.

    At last year's probowl, there were . . .
    39 first round selections
    19 second and thrid round selections
    8 second day selections
    and
    10 undrafted among which are Jeff Feagles, Sean Morey, John Carney, Clifton Smith, Brendon Ayenbajo.

    Kurt Warner, Tony Romo, James Harrison, Wes Welker and Antonio Gates are the other players.

    So minus special teams players, there are five full time players who failed to make the cut but became very productive players. James Harrison and Antonio Gates are and were athletes that are elite. Much better than Redd. Gates was a basketball player, and Harrison took until he was 29 to really learn how to be a linebacker.

    I would say the odds are heavily stacked against Redd ever emerging as anything special. Although there is always a very small chance.

    Otherwise you are basically saying the draft system is meaningless, and the statistics lie?

    The is a very strong correalation with draft position and success. For every Tom Brady there are 50 first day picks who do pan out and likely a third of that that become excellent. Most 6th round picks are cut. It is an anomaly.

    The chances of Redd every amounting to anything are even less. For every player who is undrafted there are 15 draft players who excel when we look at the probowl. And that doesn't even count making a roster. Where undrafted players are like tissues.

    Second, unless you can prove Redd would have been promoted, it really is a non-point. You and I only have the facts to look at.

    The fact is that he was only promoted from the practice squad after a rash of injuries (including Crable) and even then, saw little real action, and was a backup to Rosie Colvin who was signed off of his couch.

    And as far as tangibles, again I am not sure that is correct. He doesn't play up to his size in any respect. That is and was the biggest knock on him coming out of college.

    That is why he is a practice squad guy (for now) and was undrafted. And for all of the cracks on Crable's skinny legs, Redd lacks anything close to the upper body strength to play against NFL tackles. Old spaghetti arms had less bench reps than most wide recievers.

    It is good that you like Redd, but I really am struggling to see on what you can base a prediction that he is future at OLB other than the fact that he came off the practice squad when every other OLB option had been exhausted.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from reamer. Show reamer's posts

    Vince Redd

    How do you know the Patriots were happy with Redd's progress? Not doubting you, but I'd like to know what gives you that indication. Right now, as much as I like him, I'm just hoping that he'll do well. I have nothing concrete to go off, only speculation. So if you have information, I'm all ears. :)
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from pyegian. Show pyegian's posts

    Vince Redd

    Thinking Vince Redd will amount to more than Shawn Crable as an NFL player is an assertion that can be based on nothing but pure hope and speculation. Crable is a far better prospect who undoubtedly would have been on the roster over Redd if he had been healthy.

    As Zb stated, Redd is extremely weak in the upper body while Crable in an absolute monster, putting up 29 reps at the combine. Say what you will about his legs but he's far more prepared to take on NFL offensive lineman than Redd is.

    Bottom line: BB thought Crable was worthy of a 3rd round pick, and didn't think Redd was even worthy of a 7th round pick. What more do you need to know?
     

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