Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

         Here's an article discussing it. For the Pats...it seems to be pass-rushing ability. Yet, the author of this article disagrees: http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/2010-Super-Bowl-NFL-contenders-weakest-positions
     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    I don't know where this guy is coming from.  No arguement or discussion about Edelman or Hernandez who may play some slot?  With a new set of TEs and some help at 3rd WR I don't know if Welker would get his old numbers if he was well.  I'm sticking with the pass rush.

    I do like the premise of the article but it looks like he's guessing in spots.  Nice to know that he thinks NE is one of those teams to go to the SB.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from titletownfan. Show titletownfan's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    How is slot receiver a bigger concern than RB.  It's not the weakest link on offense even, let alone the entire team.  I mean, Edelman, Holt, and Hernandez should be fine in place of Welker for about 1/2 the season.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from KyleCleric2. Show KyleCleric2's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    I do have a concern for the third receiver spot, but that's mostly just early in the season. Welker should be back at some point. At the slot, Edelman can fill that role. Can he or one of the other receivers fill the outside receiver spot on the opposite side from Moss? If Edelman plays that spot, it isn't all that concerning to manufacture a slot role. The Pats can manufacture that type of offense from the weapons currently there.

    On offense, my biggest concern is the health at right guard. How many games do we get from Stephen Neal? How will his eventual replacement this season do? Health at RB would be the second concern. Can we go into the season with just four or is a 5th necessary? As long as Neal is there, the running game will be effective.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Tcal2. Show Tcal2's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    BB knows what he's doing.  The Offense is stacked and will be putting up huge numbers this year, mark my words.  The Defense should gel by week 12 and be good enough to complement a Great Offence on it way to a 4th Super Bowl.

     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    someone can upload the links
     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
         Here's an article discussing it. For the Pats...it seems to be pass-rushing ability. Yet, the author of this article disagrees: http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/2010-Super-Bowl-NFL-contenders-weakest-positions
    Posted by TexasPat3


    I think it's a tie between pass rush, offensive line, and secondary :)

    One could make arguments for and against each of these areas as to why they would help the team most.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BubbaInHawaii. Show BubbaInHawaii's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
    BB knows what he's doing.  The Offense is stacked and will be putting up huge numbers this year, mark my words.  The Defense should gel by week 12 and be good enough to complement a Great Offence on it way to a 4th Super Bowl.
    Posted by Tcal2


    With Wes Welker out for the first half of the season (at a minimum), and no improvement in the rush game or our offensive line - just out of curiosity, why do you feel our offense is stacked? I agree that we have some rookie and second year WRs and two new rookie TEs, but even Brady is trying to quell how much impact they'll likely have on the game. That being said, if the TEs do more than blocking - and BB includes the TE in the passing game....then I think they may hold their own.  But that still leaves the running game.  Crumpler should help, but we have no true FB, and the remainder of the RB corp is basically the same as last year...old and injury prone...and one helluva dancer.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Tcal2. Show Tcal2's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In 2007 A healthy Brady threw 50 TD's without a running game and Thump (Watson) at TE.  Now we have a nice mix of outstanding Veteran's and exciting young talent, even without Welker, for Brady to target. 

    I'm calling it now our Offense, with a fully recovered Brady (knee,shoulder,finger), is going to put up numbers that may pass those of 2007.

    Of course Brady is down playing it.  That's how you answer questions.  You never give your hand away.....come on.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    A healthy Brady makes most any offense stacked.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from isurfvb35. Show isurfvb35's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
         Here's an article discussing it. For the Pats...it seems to be pass-rushing ability. Yet, the author of this article disagrees: http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/2010-Super-Bowl-NFL-contenders-weakest-positions
    Posted by TexasPat3


    AND ON ANOTHER NOTE, THE CELTICS JUST SENT LEBRON HOME PACKING!!!! RAJON RONDO WAS THE BEST PLAYER ON THE COURT IN THE SERIES!!!! NEXT STOP ORLAND SUNDAY 330!!! LETS GO CELTICS! PATS, B'S AND SOX!!!!
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Wizardsjag. Show Wizardsjag's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    Pats weakest link is pass rush. Even though I don't see the offense at 2007 levels they'll be better than last year. Adding Holt, and re-loading at TE will help. Vollmer at LT all next year should help the o-line. Brady another year removed from his knee injury won't have the rust to shake off this year. The defense is a work in progress with a lot of open positions. If they can come together quickly this team could be very dangerous next year. Be nice if they can put the heat on a QB without having to resort to a blitz.

    Other teams that we play in '10 weakest links

    Miami - DB
    NYJ - QB
    Indy - OLine
    SD - DB
    Pitt - (Rothlisberger's sex drive) or OLine
    Minn - DB
    GB - Oline





     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
    Pats weakest link is pass rush. Even though I don't see the offense at 2007 levels they'll be better than last year. Adding Holt, and re-loading at TE will help. Vollmer at LT all next year should help the o-line. Brady another year removed from his knee injury won't have the rust to shake off this year. The defense is a work in progress with a lot of open positions. If they can come together quickly this team could be very dangerous next year. Be nice if they can put the heat on a QB without having to resort to a blitz. Other teams that we play in '10 weakest links Miami - DB NYJ - QB Indy - OLine SD - DB Pitt - (Rothlisberger's sex drive) or OLine Minn - DB GB - Oline
    Posted by Wizardsjag


         Interesting post, Wiz. Here's my thoughts on the weaknesses of the so-called contenders:

    1.) Miami Dolphins: I like their draft. The 'Fins did a great job of addressing needs, except at FS. Consequently, the 'Fins' secondary will still be vulnerable to big plays. That said, the additions of Jared Odrick, AJ Edds, and Karlos Dansby should strengthen their run defense. If Utah DE/OLB Koa Misi can replace the fading Jason Taylor and Joey Porter as a pass-rushing terror, the 'Fins could be a legitimate divisional threat. Offensively, the addition of WR Brandon Marshall should make their offense more balanced, and more explosive. 

    2.) NY Jets: Their hopes literally ride on the shoulder and the knees of their young QB, Mark Sanchez. If Sanchez is not 100%, or fails to improve, it will be another in a series of major let-downs for the Gotham Geeks. Though I liked their draft, I didn't like their decision to jettison productive RB Thomas Jones, in favor of the fading LT. Continuity in an OL is usually important. It may suffer from the Jets decision to release the supposedly fading Alan Faneca. Losing the skills of Leon Washington to injury really hurt their offense. They hope that USC rookie Joe McKnight will be a reasonable facsimile of Washington. WR Santonio Holmes, if he can stay out of trouble, should help balance the Jets' offensive attack. It remains to be seen if Jason Taylor has anything left. 

    3.) Indianapolis Colts: Peyton Manning was rarely touched last season, and was sacked a league low 13 times. So, how can anyone refer to the Colts' OL as "a weakness"? The play of the interior of their OL, guards and center, are a concern. How much longer can 34 year old Jeff Saturday hold up? Their guards are being blamed for the failure of the offense to succeed on third and short. Former 2009 #1 pick, rookie RB Donald Brown, was somewhat of a disappointment. But young WRs Austin Collie and Pierre Garcon more than took up the slack. Garcon in particular looks like pro-bowl material. The return of WR Anthony Gonzalez to the WR mix has to help. On defense, I loved the selection of OLB/DE Jerry Hughes. His presence should allow the Colts the luxury of giving veteran OLB/DEs Robert Mathis and Dwight Freeney fewer snaps...keeping them fresh throughout the season. Will Bob Sanders ever return? CB may be a weakness, as the Colts lost former #1 pick, Marlin Jackson through free agency, and rookie CB Kevin Thomas to injury. Indy again appears to be the team to beat in the AFC. 

    4.) San Diego Chargers: One has to wonder about their defense. OLB/DE Shawne Merriman is no where near the disruptive force he once was, during his steroid days. Merriman wants out of San Diego, and the Chargers want to be rid of him. Not good. There's going to be a ton of pressure of the huge tummy of rookie NT Cam Thomas, to fill in for the departed Jamal Williams. OLB Shawn Phillips hasn't been the same pass rushing menace since 2004. At CB, the Chargers feel that they accomplished an addition by subtraction in ridding themselves of their former play making CB, Antonio Cromartie...but this remains to be seen. If RB Ryan Matthews is as good as they suspect, their offense should be formidable again. 

    5.) Pittsburgh Steelers: Could be a team in decline. Their situation at WR is a mess. Santonio Holmes is gone, Limas Sweed is out for the season, and Hines Ward has started to show his age. Though rookie Maurkice Pouncey helps the interior of their OL, their OTs have had QB Ben Roethlisberger running for his life over the past two years. Then, of course, is the whole Big Ben mess. My guess is that he'll be traded before next season. On defense, James Harrison and James Farrior are older than dirt. CB is a major concern...despite the signing of former Steeler, Brian McFadden. No one knows whether the condition of Troy Polamalu's knee will allow him to return to form.  

    6.) Minnesota Vikings: I'm going to assume that Brett Favre returns. But, it's hard to imagine him having as good or better a season than he had in 2009. No matter how flashy or powerful a RB is, he's worthless if he fumbles. Such appears to be the case with Adrian Peterson. His fumbling problems cost the Vikings a trip to the SB last year. On defense, The Williams' Wall (DTs Pat and Kevin Williams) will miss the first four games due to suspension. Unless the Vikings are able to add an Albert Haynesworth via a trade, they'll be vunerable early in the season. Though the Vikings added a DB Chris Cook through the draft, Cook appeared to be a reach.  DE Everson Griffen will allow the Vikings to rotate DEs Ray Edwards (who may yet bolt through free agency) and Jared Allen, keeping them fresh. 

    7.) Green Bay Packers: The Pack has an excellent chance of surpassing the Vikings this season. The addition of RT Bryan Bulaga should help keep Aaron Rodgers upright long enough to do more damage. The main question for the Pack appears to be their talented, but aging secondary. CB Al Harris, is 35, coming off of  ACL surgery last November. Though CB Charles Woodson won Defensive Player of the Year, he'll be 34 in October. It remains to be seen whether that unit can squeeze out another quality season.        

    8.) New England Patriots: Despite what appears to many to be a decent draft, the Pats still have substantial holes. They desperately need to find someone who can pressure the opposing passers. WR is a major question mark, if for no other reason than none of us know whether Wes Welker will ever be 100% again. The Patriots would be wise to be extremely cautious with him. I felt that they might have rushed back rookie Brandon Tate last season. Tate, who was recovering from a serious knee injury...re-injured the knee. If the Pats get anything out of rookie Taylor Price, it's a major bonus. At RB, the Pats have to wonder where Laurence Maroney's head is? Maroney seriously regressed last season, turning into a fumbling machine. The rest of the Pats' backs are old and tired. Their kick return game must improve. Right DE is still a question mark, as is the OL.
          
          Thoughts? 
       
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
    BB knows what he's doing.  The Offense is stacked and will be putting up huge numbers this year, mark my words.  The Defense should gel by week 12 and be good enough to complement a Great Offence on it way to a 4th Super Bowl.
    Posted by Tcal2


         How do you figure that the offense is "stacked"?
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

         Here's a discussion on the potential areas of concern for the Indianapolis Colts:


          "
    It is hard to find fault in a team that won 14 regular season games in a row to start the season and really did not lose a game they tried to win until the Super Bowl. My one concern would be age. Some of the better Colts that are starting to get up there in age are Manning (34), C Jeff Saturday (34), Wayne (32), Clark (31) and Freeney (30). If those players are not productive in 2010, this team is not going to be very effective. The Colts have won 12 or more games each season since 2003, but in order to accomplish that you have to keep a core group of players together for a number of seasons, and the Colts are nearing the end of this run with this group. They won nine of their 14 games by 10 points or less, including six games by four points or less. They probably have another year or two of Super Bowl-contending football as is and have done well to begin adding youngsters, such as WR Pierre Garcon, WR Austin Collie and RB Donald Brown. There are no guarantees that those players become All-Pro players, and these next couples of drafts are going to determine if the Colts remain at the very top of the NFL."

         Apparently the Patriots aren't the only team with aging players.

     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
         Here's an article discussing it. For the Pats...it seems to be pass-rushing ability. Yet, the author of this article disagrees: http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/2010-Super-Bowl-NFL-contenders-weakest-positions
    Posted by TexasPat3


    I think the author has a reasonable argument. The pass rush is a big problem, but last year the offense was anemic too.  Late in the season Brady had no one to throw to other than Welker it seemed.  Moss wasn't getting open and the other wideout (Aiken or Stanback or whoever they stuck in that position) was a complete nonfactor. I think there's a possibility that Holt and Patten and the draft picks will improve the passing game, but a bunch of old guys and a bunch of rookies can't be considered a sure bet. 
     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
    ...a fully recovered Brady (knee,shoulder,finger), is going to put up numbers that may pass those of 2007. Of course Brady is down playing it...
    Posted by Tcal2


    RESPONSE: A bold prediction indeed, Tcal2. Hope you're right.    
     
  18. This post has been removed.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams


    Russ,
    As much as I don't like the Jets, it's hard to argue with their D production last year and where they were ranked. What I like about the Jets D is that they play aggressively and good team defense. Where they get shredded like any defense would, is when QB's like Manning for example make them play fast and don't give them time to set up and blitz. I think the longer you hold their D at the line, the bigger advantage you give them. 
    Brady is a wizard at clock management (although you couldn't tell last year). I think the way Brady beats the Jets D is simple. Mess with their tempo, don't allow them to sub, and play a lot of hurry up offense, dink and dunk, play action, run to their weak side, occasionally hit Moss deep, stretch their CB's and look underneath to Gronk, Herby, Holt and Edelman. 

    The team that I think could make a big splash in the AFC East this year are the Fins. I think they made some moves on paper that make them stronger all the way around. This years should be a battle between the Pats, Jets and Fins. Whatever team comes out of the AFC East this year will go on to the AFC Championship game. Mark it down. 
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from TexasPat3. Show TexasPat3's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

         There's a ton of optimism from many of you regarding the Patriots' new TEs. Let me just caution you that Gronk and Hernandez have yet to play a down. There's no telling how well they'll adapt to the NFL game, or how soon. Gronkowski hasn't played any football for months, and is recovering from back surgery. 

         To refer to the WRs as deep and talented is extremely premature. Randy Moss should be ready to go. But, there's no telling whether Wes Welker will  ever return to form...or that he'll be 100% in 2010. Who knows what Torrey Holt, at age 34, has left? Taylor Price can run...but is raw, and had questionable hands in college. Who can say whether Brandon Tate, coming off his second knee surgery in two years, will ever be able to contribute.

         Lots of "ifs" are never a good thing.   
     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
         There's a ton of optimism from many of you regarding the Patriots' new TEs. Let me just caution you that Gronk and Hernandez have yet to play a down. There's no telling how well they'll adapt to the NFL game, or how soon. Gronkowski hasn't played any football for months, and is recovering from back surgery.       To refer to the WRs as deep and talented is extremely premature. Randy Moss should be ready to go. But, there's no telling whether Wes Welker will  ever return to form...or that he'll be 100% in 2010. Who knows what Torrey Holt, at age 34, has left? Taylor Price can run...but is raw, and had questionable hands in college. Who can say whether Brandon Tate, coming off his second knee surgery in two years, will ever be able to contribute.      Lots of "ifs" are never a good thing.   
    Posted by TexasPat3

    well said on all fronts...its nice to see some constructive criticism on the team
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from PatsLifer. Show PatsLifer's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams


    Tex,
    Lots of "ifs", but the key word is "lots". Of all the players you mentioned, we only need 2-4 to step up. So, Edelman, Holt, Tate, Patton, Price, Gronk, Herby, Crump. It's hard to believe at least 2 of the 7 won't provide a threat. It's even more realistic to think 4 of the 7 can step up. If we get contribution from 2-4 players, that is lightyears ahead of where we were last year. I'm good with those odds. 

    I think we are going to see positive contributions from Edelman, Holt, Tate, Gronk, Crump and Herby. Of the 6, I think Edelman, Holt and Gronk will have the largest contributions, with Crump, Herby and Tate behind. Still, better than last year.
     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
    I do have a concern for the third receiver spot, but that's mostly just early in the season. Welker should be back at some point. At the slot, Edelman can fill that role. Can he or one of the other receivers fill the outside receiver spot on the opposite side from Moss? If Edelman plays that spot, it isn't all that concerning to manufacture a slot role. The Pats can manufacture that type of offense from the weapons currently there. On offense, my biggest concern is the health at right guard. How many games do we get from Stephen Neal? How will his eventual replacement this season do? Health at RB would be the second concern. Can we go into the season with just four or is a 5th necessary? As long as Neal is there, the running game will be effective.
    Posted by KyleCleric2


    I would move Nick Kaczur in at RG if Steven can't play.  Nick is a road grader and would be a beast at RG.  Oakland moved Kevin Gogan in at RG and he burried people just like Nick will be able to do at RG. 
     
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    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams : I said this in another thread about Indy. Everyone acts like Polian is so great, but his last 2 drafts are no better than NE's last 2.  In fact, you start looking at theat O Line and they have some problems. Ugoh is a bust in the early 2nd rd and Lilja went to KC.   Manning isn't gettng any younger either.  That extra second he likes, may not be there as frequently as it used to be.  Garcon and Collie look good, but they don't appear to be Pro Bowl level. As for the Jets, a team everyone thinks is some kind of slam dunk division winner, compare their DEs to ours and then compare their OLBs to ours. If Spikes ascends or McKenzie, I have no issue easily comparing Mao and one of them to the Harris/Scott MLB duo. NE has better all round quality and depth here, not to mention a superior NT.
    Posted by russgriswold


    I don't know if we can fully evaluate the drafts from the last 2 years, but here is what Polian has done:

    09
    1st - D Brown - spot duty but effective when played 
    3rd - J Powers - 12 starts - 10 PD's, 1 int, 1 FF
    4th - A Collie - 60 catches 7 TD's. 
    7th - P McAfee - starting punter
    UDFA - J Lacey - 9 starts - 13 PD's, 3 ints

    08
    2nd - M Pollak - 13 starts '08; 7 starts '09 -
    3rd - P Wheeler - 7 starts '09
    6th - P Garcon - 47 catches 4 TD's 765 yds.
    7th - J Richard - 7 starts '08

    As for Ugoh, he was definitely in the doghouse last year and may not pan out, in the 2 prior years he start 11 games in 07 (4 games out due to injury); in 08 he started 12. 

    Save Ugoh, can the pats match that kind of production for players either drafted or picked up out of college as an FA over the last 2 years? 
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Jimmy42Jack0. Show Jimmy42Jack0's posts

    Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams

    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams:
    In Response to Re: Weakest Links For Patriots, and Other Top Teams : Well, he's right about ifs, but he's wrong about which direction this batch of talent leans. That is for sure. His premise could be addressed to 80% of NFL offenses. Almost every analyst predicts Gronkowski to be a starter from day 1.  This is my opinion as well.  That alone is an upgrade over Watson.  Crumpler is a pro. I have no way of envisioning Crumpler at worst being the 2nd or 3rd TE as a blocker or a goal line player in reserve.  He'll help. I might remind you that the TE position was not used enough and not very strong in this offense for many years. Hernandez was clearly a steal in Round 4. Again, more competition at a WEAK position. This is the key. ONE player will upgrade this position. NE needs ONE FLANKER to emerge opposite Moss.  This is Holt or Tate, and at worst case, it's Patten or Price. Galloway did not emerge because he didn't adjust to what is needed in this offense and that is route running.  Not speed, but route running. Also, Tate wasn't ready last year and Aiken and Slater were only STS guys. Edelman ascended but got hurt. Apparently, we disagree how impressive Julian Edelman is in the slot role. He may not be Welker, but he sure is a good looking young slot WR who gets it. Clearly, on paper, the WR position is far deeper as is the TE position. This should not even be a debate. There is nothing wrong with constructive criticism, but there is something wrong with contrarian behavior with irrational logic.
    Posted by russgriswold

    its not about the talent "lean"...its about the fact they are rookies and judging them against proven talent is fool hearty

    not many people here are going to argue about the talent picked up...but how they are used and their production has yet to be seen and until that happens...i have a very hard time putting gronkowski or hernandez's talent over what you had in watson and baker

     

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