2012 Red Sox contract issues

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    2012 Red Sox contract issues

    From MLBTraderumors.com:

    The Red Sox are next in our 2012 Contract Issues series.  Here's what the team faces after the 2011 season:

    Eligible For Free Agency (6)

    • J.D. Drew owns a line of .268/.376/.468 in 2,243 plate appearances as a member of the Red Sox.  Drew has provided value, but he'll be 36 in November and his power is declining.  In March he talked about retirement as a possibility.  There's a good chance the Red Sox look outside the organization for a replacement.
    • Designated hitter David Ortiz had been a slow starter since 2008, but he was decent in April this year and has been killing it in May.  Ortiz wants to finish his career with the Red Sox, but Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports wrote in March that the team is "itching to abandon a full-time DH and initiate a rotation at that position."  Last offseason the decision on Ortiz's option was entirely in the team's hands, but this winter he could field offers elsewhere, especially if the Sox remain reluctant to guarantee two years.
    • Closer Jonathan Papelbon has been dominant, with an 11.8 K/9 and 1.3 BB/9 in 20 2/3 innings.  Daniel Bard has been solid, but other possible late-inning holdovers like Bobby Jenks and Dan Wheeler have not.  Papelbon would be a big loss, but in free agency he figures to seek at least a three-year deal in the $36MM range.  In March, Papelbon told Rosenthal it's "50-50" and "a tossup" that he will remain in Boston.
    • Mike Cameron has served mainly as Drew's platoon partner this year, appearing in 15 games overall.  Cameron hinted to WEEI's Alex Speier that he hasn't ruled out retirement after the season, but now is not the time for that decision.
    • Catcher Jason Varitek told MLB.com's Ian Browne in February he wants to play into his 40s, so he'll probably re-sign as Boston's backup if they'll have him.
    • Tim Wakefield replaced John Lackey in the rotation, though Lackey may come off the DL on June 5th.  Wakefield's stance on retiring after the season seems to have softened, given comments made in October, December, and January.  The active career wins leader by a long shot, Wakefield is only six from 200. 

    Contract Options (2)

    • Marco Scutaro: $6MM club option/$3MM player option with a $1.5MM buyout.  Scutaro is often mentioned as a trade candidate.  His club seems likely to decline their end of the option.  In that case Scutaro may prefer to take the buyout and have the flexibility to choose his team.
    • Dan Wheeler: $3MM+ vesting option.  Wheeler has struggled this year in terms of home runs and hits allowed, but his 2012 option vests with 53 more appearances.  A May stint on the disabled list probably means he'll be a free agent after the season.

    Arbitration Eligible (9)

    Bard, Lowrie, Ellsbury, and Saltalamacchia are the biggest cases here, though the Sox may end up tendering contracts to all but Atchison.  I'll put the group as a whole around $14MM.

    2012 Payroll Obligation

    Boston's 2012 payroll obligation, according to Cot's, is $126.934MM including Scutaro's buyout.  Throw in $14MM for arbitration eligibles, and we're about $23MM shy of this year's payroll before accounting for minimum salary players.  Possible needs include right field, designated hitter, the rotation, and the bullpen.  It would be hard to add premium players in free agency to fill these needs if the flexibility is around $23MM in 2012 salaries.

    Of course, the Red Sox do not calculate payroll in the simplistic way I just did.  Perhaps no team does, but Boston's payroll requires extra maneuvering because of the luxury tax.  Still, the use of AAVs instead of salaries again puts the Sox around $125MM in commitments before arbitration eligibles are accounted for.  I think the Red Sox will have to raise payroll or backload the contract if they are to get involved on, say, C.C. Sabathia.  Perhaps instead of free agency the Red Sox will lean toward trades, where the main expenditure would be prospects rather than money.    

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    I don't understand where 'Drew has provided value.'

    I get "value" out of those sneakers I got at half off, which have lasted for 5 years.

    They paid for a guy who should be hitting close to .300 with about 25 homers and 110 RBI's. They are getting a defensive specialist who never throws any runners out.

    You want to talk value, lets' talk about KFC. Drew was no bargain, good riddance.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from the-yazzer. Show the-yazzer's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    ZILLA speaks the truth.
    DREW defenders simply amaze me. are there 2 DREWS on the SOX?
    am i watching the wrong one?

    i will repeat what i've stated more than once: "the 5 year/70 million contract given to DREW was the worst free agency non-pitching signing ever!"

    however, the 7 year/140 million given to CRAWFORD has the potential to top that one.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxSoldRed. Show SoxSoldRed's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    Wakefield and Varitek need to be gone, years ago.

    Drew and Cameron are simply aging out. Drew has value as a 4th OF'er, since he's a LHB. They are in the 4th OF'er small one year contract portions of their careers. Either would be good to have in that role, at a cheap one year price.

    The Red Sox have 3 main needs, not in order of importance, for 2012:

    1. Solid young slugging RH OF'er (team is unbalanced on lefty overload)

    2. Solid MLB proven defensive not too old catcher (team has enough offense)

    3. Solid defensive everyday SS (team has enough offense) 

    FA is almost never the way to fill everyday player needs. The Red Sox need to find trading partners to fill need 1 and 2, and Iggy should be slotted for #3.

    1. Decline Suctaro's option and, if he gets healthy this year, make him an early offer at year end for  a cheap one year UIF deal to mentor and work with Iggy

    2. Find a trading partner for a solid young RH OF slugger (Kemp, J. Upton, etc)

    3. Find a trading partner for a solid defensive catcher

    With arbitration years drawing down and value declining by narrowing the trade market beyond the small market teams, as such, the following players should be on the winter trade block:

    1. Ellsbury (Crawford can take over leadoff spot)
    2. Lowrie (Iggy and a cheap one year veteran SS deal to Scutaro, ect)

    Do not sign or extend Ellsbury or Lowrie. Sign a veteran to a cheap one year 4th OF'er deal and promote the best defensive LH OF'er from the farm, Kalish, etc., and acquire a solid MLB proven RH slugging OF'er with solid overall career hitting averages. Promote Iggy and sign a veteran UIF'er to a cheap one year deal.

    Frankly, these are the very same needs that were put off this year in hopes of a better trade market for current short termers who are not likely to be extended or signed as FA's.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    In Response to Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues:
    [QUOTE]I don't understand where 'Drew has provided value.' I get "value" out of those sneakers I got at half off, which have lasted for 5 years. They paid for a guy who should be hitting close to .300 with about 25 homers and 110 RBI's. They are getting a defensive specialist who never throws any runners out. You want to talk value, lets' talk about KFC. Drew was no bargain, good riddance.
    Posted by ZILLAGOD[/QUOTE]


    How do you get value out of half a sneaker?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    It would be hard to add premium players in free agency to fill these needs if the flexibility is around $23MM in 2012 salaries.

    Tell that to the fans who think the CC contract is not crippling.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    In Response to Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues:
    [QUOTE]It would be hard to add premium players in free agency to fill these needs if the flexibility is around $23MM in 2012 salaries. Tell that to the fans who think the CC contract is not crippling.
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]There is no doubt that this was a go for it kind of year and the contract is, if CC under delivers a bigger issue than JD Drew ever was.

    Now the big question is when push comes to shove are the RS willing to become a perinnal CBT spender? If so it is a $6M a year over payment and not crippling at all. 

    Nobody is sure exactly where their (the RS ownership) threshold of pain is. They have carefully managed around CBT but that may well have been as much the principle of not paying "tax" as it is can't afford it.

    None of the owners of most sports franchises feed their familes based on franchise income. They are usually in it for the love of owning a sports franchise, the ego gratification it brings and measure their success by how much equity the franchise can accumulate over time and how successful their franchise is on the field.

    So it is possible that the RS could expand their budget beyond what most assume is the limitation set by CBT.

    If not Crawford is a very expensive luxury, unlike A-Gon whose value to both the baseball operation and the business operation is easily defined. On the flip side it isn't like the Rs would have had a ton of wiggle room  if we assume Crawford is maybe $6M a year over paid. And depending what they had to do to man the OF this year beyond Ells-Cam-Drew if it was a one year fix they would likely need to add at least one OF to their shopping list which will include an IF, OF DH, Closer and very possibly a starting pitcher if as many fear Dice K is TJ bound.

    Just saw the Crawford HR as I watch MLB Tonight on MLB TV. Harness I would have described the pitch as in the zone low and middle to inside. It is for most LH hitters right in their wheelhouse.

    That said he put a hurt on that ball and it was a pitch 3 weeks ago he doesn't square up. He was very quick into the zone and strong.  Rattled through all the highlights by fast forwarding the game on my MLB TV package through my Apple TV after that.

    The Indians got awful pitching today which is not shocking given the score. To the RS credit whether it was the struggling Pedey, CC or AAAA Drew Sutton they did what they were supposed to do to it. And Lester did what your ace does with a ton of run support.
     
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    It was a nice breakout game.

    I think Theo is "banking" on some of these kids (or in-house solutions) to fill some crucial roles in 2012 and just have to fill maybe 2 by free agency:

    Drew /> Kalish/Reddick
    Cam /> Reddick/Linares
    Papelbon /> Bard (Jenks)
    Ortiz /> Lavarnway (Youk/Lowrie)
    Wake /> Doubront (Aceves)
    VTek /> Lavarnway
    Scutty /> Iglesias/Navarro (Lowrie)
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    I pretty much agree with UR take Katz. I was watching the replay while finding out my dad just went into the hospital. So, my attention was compromised a bit.
    On the game, I think it was a combination of facing the Tribe's lack of depth - along with the Sox playing at a high level.

    On the future budgets, I think you make a valid point. The team will address their needs so long as it's reasonable. Theo didn't feel over-paying for last year's BP needs were valid by July 31st. He was right. If they have a great shot at another ring and have to go over the tax limit a bit, I believe it won't deter them.
    I don't see how 6-7 mil a year over-spending on CC will dictate protocol.
    They have the core in place to compensate for unforeseen "tweaks".

    But I do think it's wise to acknowledge the fact that the loophole in dishing out big $$$ in the draft is closing. It will affect the farm for both Boston & NY, which gives NY an obvious edge in the future FA sweepstakes.
    Henry is worth 852 Mil - about what the team would sell for.
    I'm sure Henry loves the position he's currently in. But he's a business man, and a damn good one. And if he sees he's got an aging club not drawing 5 years from now, with a payroll stuck on limited leverage, I say he sells instead of watching bandbox revenue sink, taking a monster loss.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jeffh102082. Show jeffh102082's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    In Response to 2012 Red Sox contract issues:
    [QUOTE]From MLBTraderumors.com: The Red Sox are next in our 2012 Contract Issues series .  Here's what the team faces after the 2011 season: Eligible For Free Agency (6) J.D. Drew owns a line of .268/.376/.468 in 2,243 plate appearances as a member of the Red Sox.  Drew has provided value, but he'll be 36 in November and his power is declining.  In March he talked about retirement as a possibility.  There's a good chance the Red Sox look outside the organization for a replacement. Designated hitter David Ortiz had been a slow starter since 2008, but he was decent in April this year and has been killing it in May.  Ortiz wants to finish his career with the Red Sox, but Ken Rosenthal of FOX Sports wrote in March that the team is "itching to abandon a full-time DH and initiate a rotation at that position."  Last offseason the decision on Ortiz's option was entirely in the team's hands, but this winter he could field offers elsewhere, especially if the Sox remain reluctant to guarantee two years. Closer Jonathan Papelbon has been dominant, with an 11.8 K/9 and 1.3 BB/9 in 20 2/3 innings.  Daniel Bard has been solid, but other possible late-inning holdovers like Bobby Jenks and Dan Wheeler have not.  Papelbon would be a big loss, but in free agency he figures to seek at least a three-year deal in the $36MM range.  In March, Papelbon told Rosenthal it's "50-50" and "a tossup" that he will remain in Boston. Mike Cameron has served mainly as Drew's platoon partner this year, appearing in 15 games overall.  Cameron hinted to WEEI's Alex Speier that he hasn't ruled out retirement after the season, but now is not the time for that decision. Catcher Jason Varitek told MLB.com's Ian Browne in February he wants to play into his 40s, so he'll probably re-sign as Boston's backup if they'll have him. Tim Wakefield replaced John Lackey in the rotation, though Lackey may come off the DL on June 5th.  Wakefield's stance on retiring after the season seems to have softened, given comments made in October , December , and January .  The active career wins leader by a long shot, Wakefield is only six from 200.  Contract Options (2) Marco Scutaro : $6MM club option/$3MM player option with a $1.5MM buyout.  Scutaro is often mentioned as a trade candidate.  His club seems likely to decline their end of the option.  In that case Scutaro may prefer to take the buyout and have the flexibility to choose his team. Dan Wheeler : $3MM+ vesting option.  Wheeler has struggled this year in terms of home runs and hits allowed, but his 2012 option vests with 53 more appearances.  A May stint on the disabled list probably means he'll be a free agent after the season. Arbitration Eligible (9) First time: Alfredo Aceves , Daniel Bard , Scott Atchison , Jed Lowrie , Franklin Morales Second time: Jacoby Ellsbury , Jarrod Saltalamacchia , Rich Hill      Third time: Matt Albers Bard, Lowrie, Ellsbury, and Saltalamacchia are the biggest cases here, though the Sox may end up tendering contracts to all but Atchison.  I'll put the group as a whole around $14MM. 2012 Payroll Obligation Boston's 2012 payroll obligation, according to Cot's , is $126.934MM including Scutaro's buyout.  Throw in $14MM for arbitration eligibles, and we're about $23MM shy of this year's payroll before accounting for minimum salary players.  Possible needs include right field, designated hitter, the rotation, and the bullpen.  It would be hard to add premium players in free agency to fill these needs if the flexibility is around $23MM in 2012 salaries. Of course, the Red Sox do not calculate payroll in the simplistic way I just did.  Perhaps no team does, but Boston's payroll requires extra maneuvering because of the luxury tax.  Still, the use of AAVs instead of salaries again puts the Sox around $125MM in commitments before arbitration eligibles are accounted for.  I think the Red Sox will have to raise payroll or backload the contract if they are to get involved on, say, C.C. Sabathia .  Perhaps instead of free agency the Red Sox will lean toward trades, where the main expenditure would be prospects rather than money.    
    Posted by mrmojo1120[/QUOTE]

    Prince Fielder to replace Ortiz would be ok
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    Harness, assuming CC is "only overpaid" by "$6-7M/year", that still means he is taking up about $14M for his slot. Even if that $14M each year is "worth it", it still restricts what we can spend elsewhere. It's all relative.

    Add the $6-7M per year to the restrictive nature ofhis deal (and any high priced
    contract), and I have to believe that equates to a very good player for each and every year of the 7 year deal.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: 2012 Red Sox contract issues

    It could equate to a good player, Moon. Or, it could equate to a wasted roster spot. You can say the same thing about extending Josh or signing Lackey. That's the price you pay when dealing with Free Agency.

    The team could have gone a different route instead of signing a one-dimensional juicer to 20 mil a year for 8 years. This can't be measured by prioritizing the dollar. If that becomes the barometer, may as well look to formulating future prognosis and laying future groundwork after the Tampa Rays success.

    It only took them years and years of being cellar dwellers, and they don't keep their players once they hit their prime. How do you think their puny fan base feels about that? Maybe that's why the catch-22 exists there.
     

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