A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:

     

    Jonny gomes is a career .244 hitter who cannot field very well either. He has some pop in his bat but there is no indication that it is much more than the ability to hit mistake pitches out of the park. Is that our starting Left Fielder? Apparently Farrrell thinks it is.

     



    Gomes is a lefty masher with a career .879 OPS.  That was one of the main reasons he was signed.

     

    Where are you getting that Farrell sees him as an everyday outfielder?  He shared left field with Nava.  He played more left field than planned because Nava had to cover for Victorino in right in a lot of games.

    The Nava/Gomes combo in left worked great this year.

    Just because Gomes played more than his share in the postseason doesn't mean his role will be different next year. 

    [/QUOTE]

         Surprised you didn't take him down on "but there is no indication that it is much more than the ability to hit mistake pitches out of the park".

        Truth be known those are usually the only pitches that clear the outfield fences.

    [/QUOTE]

    Farrell played Gomes at the most important time of the year against 6 or 7 RH pitchers in a row. That makes him the current starter as far as I can see. And the numbers indicate that was a pretty stupid decision.

    But he sure looks good in a combat helmet and has a great PR presence so what the heck...let's play him on our team. Cool

    To me, Gomes should be a RH hitting 5th OF. That's it. No more. Occasional PH duties and start against LH pitching. Which should be 200 AB a year at most. We need someone better as our starter in LF.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to couldnotkeepmyplan's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    soft what do u think about Kuroda?


    I can't speak for softlaw, but I did read his blog and he said to try and find a sucker to take Peavy off the books and to avoid signing any pitching FA for 2014. Go internally from the farm and current contracts. 

    I personally like Kuroda at a cheap single digits one year deal, but I expect he's thinking Dumpster numbers.

    [/QUOTE]

    I thought you were going to say "I can't speak for softlaw, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn last night!". Which is pretty much Softy's whole modus operandi. Baseless mush.

     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    Time for a call to pest control.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    Softy, the king of the full Pinnochio, showing that graphic for someone else. Now THAT is hilarious!

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    Moon, I don't think Ells is coming back but...would you take him if he would accept 90/5? 

    The more I read here the more I 'm worried about losing Naps.  If he doesn't come back we suffer a big power outage.

    I think we are dealing from strength, but these issues are more complex than I thought.  I can't see paying more for another catcher than Softy for the same thing.  I don't have a problem with Ross or someone else catching more games in the WS--you still got to get there.

    Does anyone here know if SF Giants have a power righty bat in AAA?  They are looking for a starter and left fielder.  We've got starters, outfielders in the minors.  I've always liked their 2nd catcher.  What do you guys think about "The Panda?"  He's been told to get in shape again but he hits whether he's in shape or not.  We've got third basemen.  Just tinkering here--it is the off season.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    I wanted to mention Aceves--he became an afterthought this year and it's probably time for him to move on.  Don't know how much he's worth, a throw in on a deal, but as someone who was great in relief, average as a starter, and stop gap as a closer, wouldn't he be desirable to someone?

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to jcri's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I wanted to mention Aceves--he became an afterthought this year and it's probably time for him to move on.  Don't know how much he's worth, a throw in on a deal, but as someone who was great in relief, average as a starter, and stop gap as a closer, wouldn't he be desirable to someone?

    [/QUOTE]

    It appears that Aceves has psychological problems that outweigh his physical abilities.  We learned why the Yankees gave up on him. 

     

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Farrell played Gomes at the most important time of the year against 6 or 7 RH pitchers in a row. That makes him the current starter as far as I can see.

    [/QUOTE]

    Farrell also started Ross at catcher the final 3 games, so you must have him as our #1 catcher for next year.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from emp9. Show emp9's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:

     

    Jonny gomes is a career .244 hitter who cannot field very well either. He has some pop in his bat but there is no indication that it is much more than the ability to hit mistake pitches out of the park. Is that our starting Left Fielder? Apparently Farrrell thinks it is.

     



    Gomes is a lefty masher with a career .879 OPS.  That was one of the main reasons he was signed.

     

    Where are you getting that Farrell sees him as an everyday outfielder?  He shared left field with Nava.  He played more left field than planned because Nava had to cover for Victorino in right in a lot of games.

    The Nava/Gomes combo in left worked great this year.

    Just because Gomes played more than his share in the postseason doesn't mean his role will be different next year. 

    [/QUOTE]

         Surprised you didn't take him down on "but there is no indication that it is much more than the ability to hit mistake pitches out of the park".

        Truth be known those are usually the only pitches that clear the outfield fences.

    [/QUOTE]

    Farrell played Gomes at the most important time of the year against 6 or 7 RH pitchers in a row. That makes him the current starter as far as I can see. And the numbers indicate that was a pretty stupid decision.

    But he sure looks good in a combat helmet and has a great PR presence so what the heck...let's play him on our team. Cool

    To me, Gomes should be a RH hitting 5th OF. That's it. No more. Occasional PH duties and start against LH pitching. Which should be 200 AB a year at most. We need someone better as our starter in LF.

    [/QUOTE]

    I thought the LF Platoon of Nava/Gomes went very well this past year. My only concern going forward with that, is that is does crowd-out JBJr if/when Sox sign another CF. 

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    _

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    Again, if Farrell played Gomes against RH pitching in the playoffs even when Gomes was a career .143 hitter in 50 post season AB or whatever he ended up as, not to mention many years of futility against RH pitching in the regular season, what does that say about Nava who was hitting well over .300 against RH pitching but was benched? Just saying. Nava is a guy I really like and I could document exactly how much I like him with proof if I wanted to so don't think I'm biased against him because I am not, but it appears to me that he might even be traded this winter after what happened in the playoffs last year. It's incomprehensible.

    You guys really have to check out this Tanaka option. The guy seems to be a starting equivalent of Koji. A younger Kuroda. I think we may well put our toe in that water:

    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/masahiro-tanaka-the-markets-best-starter/

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    clown

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    After a fantastic season that no one expected. In a yr everyone thought was working toward a 15 championship team, everything broke our way and the impossible became possible. My thoughts on this off season still the same lets build for that next great RS team as Ben has stated. Problem w/ trying to resign your own FA's coming off a WS victory is your going to have to overpay. My attitude is let them walk if they're not willing to sign a team friendly contract. Lets find out which players are more interested in winning WS's than the almighty dollar. If we lose all 4 so be it. The chances of winning again next yr are so slim anyway, banquet hangover, not enough time to get ready for next yr, etc..

    I would be perfectly fine if our infield was Snyder/Holt 3b [til Cecchini ready maybe in June] Boegarts SS/ Pedey 2B / Middlebrooks 1B. With an OF of Gomes & Nava LF / JBJ CF / Vic RF and if Kalish proves he's healthy, I look to trade Nava + pitcher for a C, or sign a guy like Ruiz to a 2yr deal til one of the young kids is ready. With the nucleus this team has and the young talent in the farm system, I could see RS making a run at playoffs next yr even if we didn't sign any of the FA's we have. The strength of this team is it pitching depth and if Owens / Barnes / Webster all take that next step the pitching is going to be fantastic. Pitching = Winning!!!

    Some may think I'm crazy but I wouldn't go 4yrs w/ any of our own FA's except Ells. Not many teams repeat because either things don't go right 2 yrs in a row or just not hungry for it. If you bring up enough young talent to fill the voids, think you can eliminate the being hungry for it. You know the kids will play hard trying to make a name and establish themselves. Toughest thing is knowing when to cut a cord and not overpay when theres an emotional bond following a season like last yr. Ben is playing w/ house $ after last yr, lets hope he makes the right decisions like last yr.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:

    Again, if Farrell played Gomes against RH pitching in the playoffs even when Gomes was a career .143 hitter in 50 post season AB or whatever he ended up as, not to mention many years of futility against RH pitching in the regular season, what does that say about Nava who was hitting well over .300 against RH pitching but was benched? Just saying. Nava is a guy I really like and I could document exactly how much I like him with proof if I wanted to so don't think I'm biased against him because I am not, but it appears to me that he might even be traded this winter after what happened in the playoffs last year. It's incomprehensible.

    You guys really have to check out this Tanaka option. The guy seems to be a starting equivalent of Koji. A younger Kuroda. I think we may well put our toe in that water:

    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/masahiro-tanaka-the-markets-best-starter/




    By playing Gomes, It says baseball is NOT all about stats. He was replaced and Nava got some time. I think the Sox really like Nava and have no plans on trading him. hes a versitile OF'er who can play either position as well as play 1b if needed. At about 500K and under control for a few more years, hes a huge value.

    Tanaka will probably cost close to 100M just to negotiate with him. Not sure what his salary will be, but it should be pretty sizable. I keep hearing the LAD are the likely landing spot for him. Hes a stud for sure. Hopefully for whoever signs him, the switch to US baseball is fairly smooth. I dont see him having the same success here, but that doesnt mean he wont be successful.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Again, if Farrell played Gomes against RH pitching in the playoffs even when Gomes was a career .143 hitter in 50 post season AB or whatever he ended up as, not to mention many years of futility against RH pitching in the regular season, what does that say about Nava who was hitting well over .300 against RH pitching but was benched? Just saying. Nava is a guy I really like and I could document exactly how much I like him with proof if I wanted to so don't think I'm biased against him because I am not, but it appears to me that he might even be traded this winter after what happened in the playoffs last year. It's incomprehensible.

    You guys really have to check out this Tanaka option. The guy seems to be a starting equivalent of Koji. A younger Kuroda. I think we may well put our toe in that water:

    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/masahiro-tanaka-the-markets-best-starter/

     

    [/QUOTE]


    By playing Gomes, It says baseball is NOT all about stats. He was replaced and Nava got some time. I think the Sox really like Nava and have no plans on trading him. hes a versitile OF'er who can play either position as well as play 1b if needed. At about 500K and under control for a few more years, hes a huge value.

     

    Tanaka will probably cost close to 100M just to negotiate with him. Not sure what his salary will be, but it should be pretty sizable. I keep hearing the LAD are the likely landing spot for him. Hes a stud for sure. Hopefully for whoever signs him, the switch to US baseball is fairly smooth. I dont see him having the same success here, but that doesnt mean he wont be successful.

    [/QUOTE]

    I thought they changed the posting fee process.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    I think a $55 mil bid easily gets us in the top 3. Probably don't even need to go that high.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    As with Kuroda, I'm not saying I expect them to sign either of these guys. I'm just saying I'd make a strong run at both of them. Probably starting with Tanaka. If their bid is selected then go forward with it. If not, make a strong play for Kuroda and trade a starter like Peavy.

    Kuroda is probably a big upgrade over Peavy plus Peavy is probably worth at least a #1 pick with no salary dump. We may even get a pick if Kuroda leaves next year!

    Almost everyone is in disagreement on these options but I absolutely want to win next year and Kuroda was a 3.8 WAR player. That is a lot of value and probably would have more impact next year than most any other player we are considering signing, except Ellsbury of course who still is an underated player IMO. I think Ellsbury will blow right past a $100 mil contract. He has so many things going for him. Plus defense, plus, plus base running, plus hitting, plus positional value, the ability to lead off....etc. He should be a $120 mil player folks. 6-7 years with at least a $120 mil contract IMO. I don't want to go there.

    Choo is going to be close to $100 mil maybe but he's a better value to me. I think he is a better fit in Fenway and probably ages well, particularly if we slot him in LF. Neither probably happens though IMO.

    We probably bring will Napoli back ( as much as I would prefer an upgrade if possible ) and we probably should trade fora better Papi protection bat, for example a slugging RH OF bat. In order to do that we need to have players to trade which are effectively surplus. To me that means maybe upgrading the rotation, which is a priority to me, and trade a Peavy, Dempster or Doubront. The alternative is we will be moving prospects we don't want to part with.

    Nava is expendable if they bring back Napoli and bring in Choo or another big OF bat via a trade. I don't want to trade the guy but if they don't want to play him over Gomes against RH pitching he's gotta go. They basically slapped him in the face during the playoffs.

     
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    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    Moon, I don't think Ells is coming back but...would you take him if he would accept 90/5? 

    I think we can do better with $90M spread over 5 seasons. I am not even sure if I'd go $80M/5, if it meant we took a step back at 2-3 other positions just to possibly stay even in CF, however, the difference between %80M/5 and $90M/5 is not that much, so I do not think I'd complain too loudly if he signed for $90M/5.

    I hope that answers your question.

    I like JBJ a lot, but expect a drop off on offense for a couple years, if he is the main man out there.

    What's the dropm off between Ells and JBJ vs between Napoli and Carp plus between Salty and Lava? (Or, Drew and Middy?)

     

    The more I read here the more I 'm worried about losing Naps.  If he doesn't come back we suffer a big power outage.

    Agreed, and I actually think Napoli could have a better 2014 than he had in 2013.

     

    I think we are dealing from strength, but these issues are more complex than I thought.  I can't see paying more for another catcher than Softy for the same thing.  I don't have a problem with Ross or someone else catching more games in the WS--you still got to get there.

    I think we end up going cheap at catcher for a 1-2 year contract to bridge us to the hot prospects.

     

    Does anyone here know if SF Giants have a power righty bat in AAA?  They are looking for a starter and left fielder.  We've got starters, outfielders in the minors.  I've always liked their 2nd catcher.  What do you guys think about "The Panda?"  He's been told to get in shape again but he hits whether he's in shape or not.  We've got third basemen.  Just tinkering here--it is the off season.

    Baseball America has OF'ers Gary Brown at #5 on the SF top 10 list and Francisco Peguero at #8 and Roger Lieschnick at #9.

    Fastest baserunner & Best Athlete: Gary Brown

     

    SF might lose Vogelsong & Romo.

     

    Are you thinking something like:

    Middlebrooks, Miller, Webster and  for Pablo Sandoval and Hector Sanchez?

     

    Maybe SF will sign Ellsbury, if they can pull off this trade first:

     

    Middlebrooks, Dempster, Nava, Miller, W. Rijo, & Lava

    for

    Sandoval, A Pagan, and Sanchez

     

    (They may insist on Betts)

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: A Realistic View at 2014: Part I

    In response to RedsoxProspects' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    He is an animal. A moose! A rampaging Rhino! I want him on our side!

    I know the whole Kuroda thing is personal for Yankees fans. It's like insulting their mom. I understand it ( again, I'm not talking about Zac who is in a league by himself! ). But even Zac probably wants Kuroda back and why wouldn't he! 

    I think he's even worth a pick. After all, we are draft position #30, and that slot will quickly be replaced when some of these other guys decline.

    The Yanks have been stealing our players since the 1920s. Why don't we take some of theirs back! The last ones I remember were both catchers well past their primes. They took Boggs, Damon...etc. Not to mention Ruth and 1/2 of those great Redsox teams circa 1918.

    You know what they say about paybacks! 

    [/QUOTE]


    We got Mike Torrez and Don Baylor from them.  Isn't that enough?

     

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