Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Oh my. THANK YOU Ben Cherrington for NOT giving out that contract!

    ALthough, from St Louis persepctive, I can see the intelligence in 2 years of Beltran being more valuable to the club that 1 year of Pujols...that carries another 9 years of commitment. Good for them, and yet, what were they thinking!

    At any rate, those numbers shocked me. I thought MAYBE he'd get around 13 for one year to prove himself, a-la Beltre in 2010, but 2 years at that clip? Wow, I don't agree with that.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxFanInIL. Show SoxFanInIL's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]Oh my. THANK YOU Ben Cherrington for NOT giving out that contract! ALthough, from St Louis persepctive, I can see the intelligence in 2 years of Beltran being more valuable to the club that 1 year of Pujols...that carries another 9 years of commitment. Good for them, and yet, what were they thinking! At any rate, those numbers shocked me. I thought MAYBE he'd get around 13 for one year to prove himself, a-la Beltre in 2010, but 2 years at that clip? Wow, I don't agree with that.
    Posted by ma6dragon9[/QUOTE]

    Didnt he "prove himself" last season?
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Another gross overpay.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jpBsSoxFan. Show jpBsSoxFan's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]Another gross overpay.
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    Agree, way too much for an oftened injured player. I think he could be close to washed up.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Teakus. Show Teakus's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    They're all overpaid. But this is a perfectly reasonable contract, and he'll soothe the pain of losing the greatest hitter of all time to free agency. Now, if you wanna talk about a C-R-A-Z-Y contract....




    In Response to Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]Oh my. THANK YOU Ben Cherrington for NOT giving out that contract! ALthough, from St Louis persepctive, I can see the intelligence in 2 years of Beltran being more valuable to the club that 1 year of Pujols...that carries another 9 years of commitment. Good for them, and yet, what were they thinking! At any rate, those numbers shocked me. I thought MAYBE he'd get around 13 for one year to prove himself, a-la Beltre in 2010, but 2 years at that clip? Wow, I don't agree with that.
    Posted by ma6dragon9[/QUOTE]
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Reasonable for StL maybe, but still a gross overpay.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!! : Didnt he "prove himself" last season?
    Posted by SoxFanInIL[/QUOTE]

    To some, I'm sure he did. He had a very pedestrian first half before really turning it on in the second half and hitting over .370 in 90 plate appearences in September to crawl his way to that magical .300.

    He's 34 right now and 2 of his last 3 seasons saw him on the field less than 51% of the games (exactly 50% on year).

    Yeah, to me, that's not proof enough to shell out 26 million over 2 years. If they get 2 years = 2011, they did just fine. If they get any taste of 09/10, they're going to look TERRIBLE for signing that deal, ESPECIALLY when it's looked upon as placating the fanbase for Pujols.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    (15 wins 2012 season) Wakefield is counting all that cash he is going to sign for his new team....cant wait to see who wants him...lol
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE](15 wins 2012 season) Wakefield is counting all that cash he is going to sign for his new team....cant wait to see who wants him...lol
    Posted by georom4[/QUOTE]

    I will be stunned if Wakes isn't on a MLB roster to start the 2012 season, barring injury.  If the season started today (assuming full health all around) I would want the Sox' top 3 to be Beckett/Lester/Buchholz.  After that, we could kill the bullpen by attempting to make Bard and Aceves starters (maybe one, but not both, imho). After that, I'd reluctantly choose Wakefield to start.  Reluctantly, but today there is nobody else.  I would happily sign him to be our 6/7 starter and release him if he failed.  He did not fail in 2011.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from BizzaroLaw. Show BizzaroLaw's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    .
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    The Cardinals are looking a bit older now. Beltran and Berkman are both closer to 40 than 30. Mat Holiday is a bit like Beckett, he may have a great year and then follow-up with an off year; 2011 was actually a bit off so perhaps he will rebound for 2012.  Furcal is another older veteran. 

    The pitching staff is another story, and is quite young barring Arthur Rhodes.

    Should be interesting on how the team fairs without its living legend.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Mat Holiday is a bit like Beckett, he may have a great year and then follow-up with an off year; 2011 was actually a bit off so perhaps he will rebound for 2012. 

    Matt will turn 32 in January. He is not old. Your buddy softy blasted me for saying we should have signed him when we had the chance. He said he wasn't an "elite hitter". 

    He's the RH'd OF'er we've craved for years. He has a career OPS of .929. He's been at .937 the last 3 years combined. He's not "like Beckett" and shows no signs of being up and down. After his first 2 MLb seasons, his OBP has been between .378 and .409 (very consistent), and his Slg% has been between .515 and .607 (his big year in Colorado). He's had an OPS over .909 for 6 straight years. He's also not as bad a fielder as many think he is.

    I'd much rather have been paying him $16-17M a year from 2010 to 2017, than CC $142M/7.

    Maybe they'll take CC, Youk, & Doubront for Holliday, Lohse, & Rzepczynski.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Mat may not be an elite hitter but he would have made an outstanding addition to the team. I did not mean to imply he was old but I messed up how I wrote the paragraph. Beltran, Furcal, and Berkmen are old. It is a weak division. 

    Much will depend on Wainwright, the WSC hang-over, and how much the team misses Pujols. I think a healthy Beltran makes a significant difference in minimizing Alberts departure.  The team should still be a +.500 team with the Reds perhaps as their biggest competition. Milwaukee will suffer if Braun's suspension stands and with Fielder all but long gone.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    St L will do fine, even as old as they are. And we will also see how much a manager's role is overblown.

    Matt is a fine hitter, and I guess the word "elite" is a bit subjective, but have a look see for yorself...

    2006-2011
    WAR
    1) Pujols
    2) Utley
    3) Holliday
    4) Miggy
    5) ARod
    6) HanRam
    7) Mauer
    8) Wright
    9) Granderson
    10) Beltran
    11) Zimmerman
    12) AGon

    OPS
    1) Pujols  1.037
    2) Miggy     .977
    3) Manny    .962
    4) Votto      .955
    5) Holliday .948
    6) Papi        .944

    Since 2008...
    OPS
    1) Pujols  1.032
    2) Miggy    .974
    3) Manny   .958
    4) Votto     .957
    5) Fielder  .936
    6) Youk     .933
    7) Matt     .923
    8) AGon    .922
    9) Braun   .920
    10) Berk   .917
    11) Baut   .912
    12) Hamil .907
    Then Teix, ARod, Napoli, Tulo, Mauer...

    He may not continue to be "elite" over age 32, but he has been since 2006 and certainly has been close since he signed with StL in Jan '10...

    2010-2011 OPS
    Miggy, Bautista, Votto, Hamilton, Pujols, Konerko, Carlos Gonzo, AGon, Tulo, Braun are the top 10.
    11) Papi     .926
    12) Prince .925
    13) Matt    .918
    14) Beltre .907
    15) Cano   .899
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    I like him. He would not have been the "answer" if Youk was still our line-up centerpiece but Mat would have been the perfect batter to back-up AGon.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    We could have used 2 great RH'd hitters in our line-up surrounded by Papi, VMart ('10) and AGon ('11) and Youk, Pedey & Beltre('10).

    Think Holliday instead of Cameron and CC for 2010, 2011, and beyond. 
    Less money by $37M, and much better production.

    We could sure use the $5M differential right now, couldn't we?
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from rgmfick. Show rgmfick's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Always like Carlos Beltran when he was with the Royals. Injuries got to Carlos when he played hard for the Mets, and I, for one, am glad the Red Sox did not overpay to sign him.  I think the Red Sox are much better off getting 1 more Season from Big Papi as the DH and in 2013, see if DH manned by position players like Youkilis, Gonzalez, Saltalamacchia, Lavarnway, and maybe Shoppach, if signed for that season.  With interleague games increasing, and the limitations of the number of players a team can carry on its bench, I think a different approach to choosing the DH is appropriate.  Also, by 2013, the Red Sox will also have a better longer term idea who the RF is or whether there will be more platooning in the outfield, also the the team may have a better idea whether Ellsbury will be signed or who the new CF is, Kalish, Becket or ?. maybe even the ? whether Carl Crawford may move to RF which could give the Red Sox more opportunity to fill the LF position with a RF Power Hitter, or teach Lavarnway to be a ML Leftfielder. I only see pluses, no real disavantages to getting answers to these questions and building for the future, while remaining competitive, something I am not sure would have been as likely with the signing of someone like Carlos Beltran.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!! : I will be stunned if Wakes isn't on a MLB roster to start the 2012 season, barring injury.  If the season started today (assuming full health all around) I would want the Sox' top 3 to be Beckett/Lester/Buchholz.  After that, we could kill the bullpen by attempting to make Bard and Aceves starters (maybe one, but not both, imho). After that, I'd reluctantly choose Wakefield to start.  Reluctantly, but today there is nobody else.  I would happily sign him to be our 6/7 starter and release him if he failed.  He did not fail in 2011.
    Posted by SonicsMonksLyresVicars[/QUOTE]

    as long as he's on another team, that's fine with me...his quest for fools gold records in august/september really affected us bady...if Francona had any brains and balls he never wouldve trotted him out of there game after game....the fact that he had aceves in the bullpen cleaning up his mess every start is even more maddening...but a 45 yr old junkball pitcher starting for another team??? i doubt it...maybe in the pen as a clean up guy after the starter gives up 10 runs and the batters are tired of swinging hard
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Thread is about Beltran, right?
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    Agree with you that Boston should have signed Matt Holiday. If they did, Theo would not be able to sign Lackey which that could be a good news to the team!!
    But I think that year, Theo stated that the team need pitching badly which that was why he went after Lackey instead.

    Well, Theo messed up his homework, and now he is gone!!

    Hopefully Ben C can do a better homework, and make the team stronger.  I know this year is going to be a hard year for him to make the team stronger due lack of funds!!  But after the 2012 season, Ben C. will have an easier time to make the team stronger for the 2013 season!!
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]Thread is about Beltran, right?
    Posted by UticaClub[/QUOTE]

    Only for the intellectuals.  For the more narrow-minded, they have one or two things on their minds and are unable to deviate.

    IRT Beltran, I thought he made a better than Papi, but I was thinking $20M/2 was about the right price.  I think the DH would better enable him to cover the 20+ games he misses each year.

    But other than that, his injury history, which certainly isn't strong, seems really overrated.  He had one injury that knocked him out at the end of 2009, and delayed the start of the 2010 season.  Outside of that one major injury, he's played at least 140 games every year since 2001.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In response to "Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!": [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!! : Only for the intellectuals.  For the more narrow-minded, they have one or two things on their minds and are unable to deviate. IRT Beltran, I thought he made a better than Papi, but I was thinking $20M/2 was about the right price.  I think the DH would better enable him to cover the 20+ games he misses each year. But other than that, his injury history, which certainly isn't strong, seems really overrated.  He had one injury that knocked him out at the end of 2009, and delayed the start of the 2010 season.  Outside of that one major injury, he's played at least 140 games every year since 2001. Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE] I don't think it was his injury "history" so much. According to reports his knees are pretty bad at this point and I think the Sox had serious concerns about him covering right field. He definitely would have made sense if Ortiz left, but I think he was too much of a risk as an every right fielder.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!! : Only for the intellectuals.  For the more narrow-minded, they have one or two things on their minds and are unable to deviate. IRT Beltran, I thought he made a better than Papi, but I was thinking $20M/2 was about the right price.  I think the DH would better enable him to cover the 20+ games he misses each year. But other than that, his injury history, which certainly isn't strong, seems really overrated.  He had one injury that knocked him out at the end of 2009, and delayed the start of the 2010 season.  Outside of that one major injury, he's played at least 140 games every year since 2001.
    Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE]

    hey joey...did you accept your own challenge? 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!! : hey joey...did you accept your own challenge? 
    Posted by georom4[/QUOTE]

    I offered to take you up on your bet that he'll be traded in the off-season.  If he is on the roster as of 4/1, I win.  If he isn't, you win.  Are we on?
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Beltran signs...for 2 years 26 million!!!!

    i said i am for that...are you for my suggestion as well?
     

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