BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN. Show COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN's posts

    BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    once you keep BC away from theo, he is a pretty good negotiator. Dodgers will be improved but at an extraordinarily high price. if they get one or 2 key injuries, they are done. its great or bust with them going forward. we cleaned up their farm system, paid ONLY $10-12M in cash in TOTAL (far less than we ate for rentaria), give them damaged goods in beckett and cc and by the way.. of all the places GONZO has batted... DODGER stadium is where he has his WORSE batting and power averages. this was a classic case of ask for the moon and maybe you will get stars. ok, you want gonzo, y not with beckett.. ok,, y not with crawford.. oh you're really desperate, y not the punto out back and on yep.. we arent kicking in any real cash as theo was prone to do in these kinds of deals. now that we agree on these perimeters.. before i get you from over the barrel with your pants down to your ankles, we need to go over what we want back. i'm ben cherington and wont be doing any more YOUK type deals. so to make it clear to the entire league there is a new sheriff in town, before i'm done with your azzz, i want a guy in loney who was considered untouchable just 2 years ago and is under 30 in the last year of his deal, as well as 4 of your top major league ready prospects, while giving you absolutely nothing back to replenish your already-depleted stock. here is a summary of the young guys:

    1. jerry sands: the guy has real raw power, something lacking in the sox farm system. as of now, he has the most power we have. thanks dodgers! Sands, 24, is hitting .244/.325/.376/.701 in 70 big league games over the last two years. He was hitting .303/.380/.531/.911 with 24 homers in the hitter-friendly Triple-A Pacific Coast League this year. there's a lot of upside here and lots to work with and he plays multiple positions very well.

    2. ivan DeJesus has hit .231/.282/.277/.559 in 40 big league games over the last two years. Baseball America describes him as a potential second baseman who can also play third and short with a line drive swing and good on-base skills. The 2005 second-rounder is a career .297/.369/.389/.758 hitter in the minors. he suffered a broken leg which has hurt his mobility a bit but could still recover what he lost with another year to train. at worse, he is nick punto, not bad for a utility pinch guy. BETTER than lillibridge who we got for youker.

    3. Rubby De La Rosa is only 23 but has had recent health issues but possesses considerable upside. In 13 games (10 starts) last year, he was 4-5 with a 3.71 ERA, 8.9 strikeouts and 4.6 walks per nine innings. He’s a 6'1 right-hander with a big arm, having been clocked at over 100 mph in the past. He is coming back off of Tommy John surgery.

    4. ALLEN WEBSTER is the prize. he's ranked the No. 95 prospect in the game by Baseball America entering this year, is 6-8 with a 3.55 ERA, 8.7 strikeouts and 4.2 walks per nine with Double-A Chattanooga. he's been compared to kevin brown at his peak and when he's on is unhittable. he's viewed as a top of a rotation prospect. Baseball America said that he compared in some respects to Derek Lowe while offering the following scouting report:

    “Webster shows plus pitches across the board when he has everything working. He has an easy delivery and 90-95 mph fastball that peaks at 97 mph with plenty of sink, helping him generate grounders all day long. He throws both a slider and curveball that are plus pitches at times, though at others he gets caught between the two. He has some trouble staying on top of his curve but it shows sharp three-quarters bite when it’s on. Webster’s changeup could be his best pitch, featuring sink and fade at 79-83 mph, though some scouts think he tips it off by slowing his arm speed.”

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jpBsSoxFan. Show jpBsSoxFan's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    Are you for real or just delusional ? The Sox got 5 unproven no names in this trade. How can that be robbery on Ben's part ? The only robbery is of the fans who will see a doormat team for years to come.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from digger0862. Show digger0862's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]Are you for real or just delusional ? The Sox got 5 unproven no names in this trade. How can that be robbery on Ben's part ? The only robbery is of the fans who will see a doormat team for years to come.
    Posted by jpBsSoxFan[/QUOTE]
    The Sox were a doormat team before the trade.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]Are you for real or just delusional ? The Sox got 5 unproven no names in this trade. How can that be robbery on Ben's part ? The only robbery is of the fans who will see a doormat team for years to come.
    Posted by jpBsSoxFan[/QUOTE]
    How did all those "unproven no names" the Rangers got for Mark Texeira work out? 
    How did those two "unproven no names" the Sox got for Heathcliff Slocumb work out?  How did those "unproven no names" the Indians got for Bartolo Colon work out?  Are you really this ignorant?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]Are you for real or just delusional ? The Sox got 5 unproven no names in this trade. How can that be robbery on Ben's part ? The only robbery is of the fans who will see a doormat team for years to come.
    Posted by jpBsSoxFan[/QUOTE]Your the one that is delusional.......  This was a great trade for the Red Sox .....   Have you been out of T-BALL long ????   Addition by a whole lot of subtraction !!!!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    The Red Sox were fortunate to get anything back from the Dodgers in light of the Dodgers taking on almost all of the onerous contracts of Adrian Gonzalez, Carl Crawford and Josh Beckett.

    However, don't kid yourself that Allen Webster, Rubby de la Rosa, Jerry Sands and Ivan DeJesus are elite prospects (or former prospects in the cases of de la Rosa and Sands).

    What are the chances that the combined six-year WAR* of those four players will exceed 10.0? What are the chances that Webster or de la Rosa posts a single-season WAR of at least the 1.8 Josh Beckett has posted in his disasterous 2012 season?

    From a financial standpoint, the Red Sox made a great trade. Nevertheless, Sox fans should temper their expectations of the acquired players.

    * Wins Above Replacement
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from wmo1679. Show wmo1679's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    Cherington did what needed to be done and only sent 12 mil back LA's way. Oh yeah the sox tow got of their best pitching prospects. This team was going nowhere as constructed.
     
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    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]The Red Sox were fortunate to get anything back from the Dodgers in light of the Dodgers taking on almost all of the onerous contracts of Adrian Gonzalez, Carl Crawford and Josh Beckett. However, don't kid yourself that Allen Webster, Rubby de la Rosa, Jerry Sands and Ivan DeJesus are elite prospects (or former prospects in the cases of de la Rosa and Sands). What are the chances that the combined six-year WAR* of those four players will exceed 10.0? What are the chances that Webster or de la Rosa posts a single-season WAR of at least the 1.8 Josh Beckett has posted in his disasterous 2012 season? From a financial standpoint, the Red Sox made a great trade. Nevertheless, Sox fans should temper their expectations of the acquired players. * Wins Above Replacement
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    De La Rosa is a "former" prospect. The kid is 23.  He's already in the mid to high 90's again soon after TJ surgery. Are you saying he's no longer a prospect because he didn't make some prospect list? Webster has been compared to Kevin Brown and also has terrific stuff. I'm not saying either will make it, but just because they didn't make some prospect list that is basically a crap shoot, it doesn't mean they won't.   
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Leftfielder61. Show Leftfielder61's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In my opinion the RedSox got huge salary relief which we can use to get some quality and we got 5 lottery tickets from the Dodgers. If one even of those 5 payoff its a bonus!
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got? : De La Rosa is a "former" prospect. The kid is 23.  He's already in the mid to high 90's again soon after TJ surgery. Are you saying he's no longer a prospect because he didn't make some prospect list? Webster has been compared to Kevin Brown and also has terrific stuff. I'm not saying either will make it, but just because they didn't make some prospect list that is basically a crap shoot, it doesn't mean they won't.   
    Posted by jasko2248[/QUOTE]
    The widely accepted definition of "prospect" is a pitcher who has not exceeded 50 innings pitched at the MLB level (or a position player who has not exceeded 130 at-bats at the MLB level).

    Rubby de la Rosa has pitched 61.1 innings at the MLB level.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from tom-uk. Show tom-uk's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    However, don't kid yourself that Allen Webster, Rubby de la Rosa, Jerry Sands and Ivan DeJesus are elite prospects (or former prospects in the cases of de la Rosa and Sands). What are the chances that the combined six-year WAR* of those four players will exceed 10.0? What are the chances that Webster or de la Rosa posts a single-season WAR of at least the 1.8 Josh Beckett has posted in his disasterous 2012 season? From a financial standpoint, the Red Sox made a great trade. Nevertheless, Sox fans should temper their expectations of the acquired players. * Wins Above Replacement
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    Here we go again.  

    Keith Law has Webster as a better prospect than Barnes.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got? : The widely accepted definition of "prospect" is a pitcher who has not exceeded 50 innings pitched at the MLB level (or a position player who has not exceeded 130 at-bats at the MLB level). Rubby de la Rosa has pitched 61.1 innings at the MLB level.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    Okay, he's now a "former" prospect.  Let's call him a young kid with a live arm that has the potential to be a very good Major League pitcher.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got? : The widely accepted definition of "prospect" is a pitcher who has not exceeded 50 innings pitched at the MLB level (or a position player who has not exceeded 130 at-bats at the MLB level). Rubby de la Rosa has pitched 61.1 innings at the MLB level.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]
    He was a Dela Rosa was a prospect who is coming off TJ, if he is healthy he will be a dymanic arm for the Sox.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]However, don't kid yourself that Allen Webster , Rubby de la Rosa, Jerry Sands and Ivan DeJesus are elite prospects (or former prospects in the cases of de la Rosa and Sands). What are the chances that the combined six-year WAR* of those four players will exceed 10.0? What are the chances that Webster or de la Rosa posts a single-season WAR of at least the 1.8 Josh Beckett has posted in his disasterous 2012 season? From a financial standpoint, the Red Sox made a great trade. Nevertheless, Sox fans should temper their expectations of the acquired players. * Wins Above Replacement Posted by hill55[/QUOTE] Here we go again.   Keith Law has Webster as a better prospect than Barnes. http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/red-sox/post/_/id/22224/soxprospects-loney-webster-de-la-rosa-et-al
    Posted by tom-uk[/QUOTE]
    While that's one respected opinion, here are other rankings:

    http://www.baseballamerica.com/blog/prospects/2012/07/midseason-top-50-prospects-list-2/

    http://www.minorleagueball.com/2012/7/2/3130761/top-120-prospect-list-for-2012-midseason-revision-update

    http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/prospects/watch/y2012/

    The latter ranks Allen Webster ahead of Matt Barnes.

    As I wrote in my earlier post, the Red Sox were fortunate to get any players in addition to the salary relief. Any return works to the Red Sox benefit.
     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN. Show COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    i can easily see all of FIVE of these players on the roster to start next season! that's called a nice trade. webster perhaps may shine in spring training and be sent to pawtucket before being called up later in the season. or he may so good that he forces our hand.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from smkelly. Show smkelly's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got? : How did all those "unproven no names" the Rangers got for Mark Texeira work out?  How did those two "unproven no names" the Sox got for Heathcliff Slocumb work out?  How did those "unproven no names" the Indians got for Bartolo Colon work out?  Are you really this ignorant?
    Posted by jasko2248[/QUOTE]

    considering the 2 no names for Slocumb were Derek Lowe and Jason Varitek, I'd say it worked out pretty damned well, don't you?

    The Rangers got staff ace Matt Harrison, former closer Neftali Feliz, starting SS Elvis Andrus, and our catcher Salty in the Tex deal.. I'd say they did well.

    The Indians got Cliff Lee, Brandon Phillips, and Grady Sizemore- all major leaguers- for Colon- will Sizemore's injuried have plagued him, there's no doubting what Cliff Lee has done, and Phillips is an all-star in Cinci.

    while prospects don't always pan out, the 3 cases you chose show how they CAN and DO pan out in many cases.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got? : considering the 2 no names for Slocumb were Derek Lowe and Jason Varitek, I'd say it worked out pretty damned well, don't you? The Rangers got staff ace Matt Harrison, former closer Neftali Feliz, starting SS Elvis Andrus, and our catcher Salty in the Tex deal.. I'd say they did well. The Indians got Cliff Lee, Brandon Phillips, and Grady Sizemore- all major leaguers- for Colon- will Sizemore's injuried have plagued him, there's no doubting what Cliff Lee has done, and Phillips is an all-star in Cinci. while prospects don't always pan out, the 3 cases you chose show how they CAN and DO pan out in many cases.
    Posted by smkelly[/QUOTE]
    It's telling that in 2012 you went back to 1997, 2002 and 2007 to find trades in which the prospects panned out.
     
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    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]Are you for real or just delusional ? The Sox got 5 unproven no names in this trade. How can that be robbery on Ben's part ? The only robbery is of the fans who will see a doormat team for years to come.
    Posted by jpBsSoxFan[/QUOTE]

    You are simply stupid. Ironically, the masses were praying that BC could dump CC and Josh for nearly a year now. AND, AGON just isn't the impact type player any of us had hoped he would be. Nice player, YES, but he has ZERO charisma and nearly no leadership qualities. Him being the Hook in this deal is EXACTLY what WE needed to use because ultimately, he is a dissappointment too! Of course, only those who understand what was really wrong with this team before the trade will aggree. They lacked real discipline and have too few leaders. Pedey is just not imposing enough to do it alone! The only delusional person on this blog is you. Now then, SHUT UP!

     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]i can easily see all of FIVE of these players on the roster to start next season! that's called a nice trade. webster perhaps may shine in spring training and be sent to pawtucket before being called up later in the season. or he may so good that he forces our hand.
    Posted by COMMUNIST-CONTRARIAN[/QUOTE]

    If we see all five of these guys on the roster to start next season it will mean that the FO sold the Sox and own an AA franchise.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hetchinspete. Show Hetchinspete's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]Are you for real or just delusional ? The Sox got 5 unproven no names in this trade. How can that be robbery on Ben's part ? The only robbery is of the fans who will see a doormat team for years to come.
    Posted by jpBsSoxFan[/QUOTE]

    JP, 

    The subject line is definitely an over statement but the author is not delusional, just being overly hopefull. But you're guilty of being overly negative in the opposite direction. The RS still retain a core of fine players to build around but the Red Sox will need to find a way to rebuild the pitching staff, figure out what's going on with Lester, find a way to sign Ellsbury, etc. The future may not be as bright as you like but it is also not all that bleak. They may struggle for a few years but with some of the youngsters on the way, a few proper free agent signings, etc this club can contend for the American League East again. 

    Hetch  
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got? : considering the 2 no names for Slocumb were Derek Lowe and Jason Varitek, I'd say it worked out pretty damned well, don't you? The Rangers got staff ace Matt Harrison, former closer Neftali Feliz, starting SS Elvis Andrus, and our catcher Salty in the Tex deal.. I'd say they did well. The Indians got Cliff Lee, Brandon Phillips, and Grady Sizemore- all major leaguers- for Colon- will Sizemore's injuried have plagued him, there's no doubting what Cliff Lee has done, and Phillips is an all-star in Cinci. while prospects don't always pan out, the 3 cases you chose show how they CAN and DO pan out in many cases.
    Posted by smkelly[/QUOTE]

    Ummmm...you DO understand that the reason I chose those 3 deals was because I WAS trying to make the point that those prospects DID work out, right? Am I missing something?
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?

    ok let me get this straight, in order for this trade to be a good one for some, Ben was supposed to have traded his bad contracts worth 270 million AND received All Star players and blue chip prospects as well...

    yea ok...whatever
     
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    Re: BREAKING NEWS: FBI looking for Cherington for a TOTAL steal of a trade, have you reviewed what we got?


    Forgive me if I am appear to be simple here, but, as I understand things... the Red Sox paid the Dodgers 12 million dollars to take roughly 250 million dollars in payroll off their hands. That deal alone is phenomenal. Also the Red Sox received in return 5 players, two of who could arguably become, at least serviceable major league pitchers. Icing on the cake.
    I'd have to say... Good Deal!!!
     

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