Daniel Bard

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheMaskedAvenger. Show TheMaskedAvenger's posts

    Daniel Bard

    Will he be back?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from MustangBri. Show MustangBri's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    That ship has sailed... too bad though, great talent.  Some make it, most don't.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheMaskedAvenger. Show TheMaskedAvenger's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to MustangBri's comment:

    That ship has sailed... too bad though, great talent.  Some make it, most don't.



    Sad part is he had made it

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    Kazmir made it back after two + years of working it out.

    LOVE my  Red Sox, Bs, Cs, Pats and enjoy the ride every year. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard


    Bard wanted to start because he and his agent were greedy and saw potential big dollar signs.

    Instead of telling him to stay put, the Red Sox capitulated and thus began the big 'experiment'.

    Shame on the Red Sox, Bard, and his agent.  They're all responsible for his collapse.

    Believing he'll 'be back' is about as realistic as believing in the tooth fairy.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    He was one of the best set-up men in MLB for a 2 and a half year span.

    He's still young, but I'm not holding my breath.

    Sox4ever

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    He will be non-tendered this off-season...

     

     

    “Listen to the mustn'ts, child. Listen to the don'ts. Listen to the shouldn'ts, the impossibles, the won'ts. Listen to the never haves, then listen close to me. Anything can happen, child. Anything can be.”

    -Shel Silverstein

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard


    Pitching at the major league level is as much mental as it is physical.

    Bard's psychological makeup has been shattered to splinters.  The Sox don't have the time or the patience to wait until he 'heals'...if ever(most likely)  Although we ALL put the human element into the game, at this level, in reality, it is really just a business.

    A prime example is Rick Ankiel,   The kid was great but lost it psychologically.  Remarkably, he came through the meat factory a second time(minor leagues) and came back as a hitter.  His story is really the exception qnd not the rule.

    Even though greed, in my opinion, was the motivating factor for Bard's change from reliever to starter, I still feel bad for him.

    Although the odds are overwhlming,  I wish he can do it.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    He was one of the best set-up men in MLB for a 2 and a half year span.

    He's still young, but I'm not holding my breath.

    Sox4ever



    Agree.  I always liked him but trying to be a starter was a big mistake.  I wish it would happen but I don't see him ever playing for the Red Sox again.  If he could ever be the pitcher that we all remember he could help the current bullpen. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to susan250's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    He was one of the best set-up men in MLB for a 2 and a half year span.

    He's still young, but I'm not holding my breath.

    Sox4ever

     



    Agree.  I always liked him but trying to be a starter was a big mistake.  I wish it would happen but I don't see him ever playing for the Red Sox again.  If he could ever be the pitcher that we all remember he could help the current bullpen. 

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I would agree that in hindsight coverting him back to being a starter was a misstep by the Sox leadership. After he failed to prove he could do it at the minor league level after being drafted. Then having success coming out of the pen. The question that begs to be asked is why the Sox didn't groom him to close with Papelbon heading out of town? The answer is command too many walks during his two seasons as our primary righthanded set up and given his recent slide it might also have been that they didn't trust him to get the final three outs in a big game. 

    In the end it's all on Bard, not the Red Sox. The circumstances of why they gave him a shot at starting were due to his upside potential given his stuff, they also had a need with both Matsusaka and Lackey headed for TJ surgery. Sorry but from where I sit, Bard is the guy that has to own this and if his problems lie between his ears. There's no crying in baseball. We all can spin it and try to make this a management issue. When in fact there are hundreds of pitchers that have tried to make the conversion, fell short and returned to the pen and had success. 

    Perhaps the best thing that can happen for Bard is to be released and let his time with the sox fade to black and begin anew with another organization. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    Not with the Red Sox. They will non-tender him and he will be free to go whereever.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    Sorry but Sox leadership (and Im no fanboy of Ben) didnt ruin Bard...he was a one inning specialist when he was effective...those are a dime a dozen - what the sox tried to do was to take his live arm and convert him to a starter position....given his age and strength, that was a no brainer...im pretty sure when he was drafted the thought wasnt to keep him as a sox player so that he could set up for saves....no one drafts like that....Bard imploded because he lost velocity and lacked mental toughness and that had nothing to do with how the sox used him...that's on him - time to move on

    As always - 100% correct!

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    He torn his abs in April and played throught until May. He is rehabbing right now, which why all those arms in AAA jumped a head of him.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to georom4's comment:

    Sorry but Sox leadership (and Im no fanboy of Ben) didnt ruin Bard...he was a one inning specialist when he was effective...those are a dime a dozen - what the sox tried to do was to take his live arm and convert him to a starter position....given his age and strength, that was a no brainer...im pretty sure when he was drafted the thought wasnt to keep him as a sox player so that he could set up for saves....no one drafts like that....Bard imploded because he lost velocity and lacked mental toughness and that had nothing to do with how the sox used him...that's on him - time to move on

    As always - 100% correct!

     



    I concur. For the Red Sox they have little to lose in allowing him to find himself down in AAA...again. The time to move on comes when he's out of options and the Sox have to put him in the rule 5 draft pool...until then keep giving him the ball and allow him to pitch his way back to the big leagues...

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to BosoxJoe5's comment:

    He torn his abs in April and played throught until May. He is rehabbing right now, which why all those arms in AAA jumped a head of him.



    That certainly explains the why...doesn't change the debate. Hopefully the kid gets back in time to  pitch in a meaniful game before the AAA season is over. It's not out of the question if healthy that he gets called up in Sept when rosters expand? 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    Beantowne and Geo, I agree.  In hindsight, it turned out to be a bad move.  However, IMO, the Sox were correct in their decision to try him as a starter.  He would have been so much more valuable to the team as a starter if he had succeeded.

    I'm not so sure that the "experiment" is what messed Bard up anyway.  There were signs from the end of the previous season that Bard was already having some issues.  Had he stayed in his set up role last year, he might not have been any more successful than he was as a starter.

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    What a tragedy.  I hope he pitches again, even if it's not for us.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    Bard's whole thing was that he could throw 99 mph.  Without that , he is not very good. His control problems may be mental, but the huge drop in velocity is hard to figure. Without that, he can't start , close or set up effectively.

    Stabbed by Foulke.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    Just because Bard might have made more money as a starter, doesn't mean that was the main reason he pushed for the move. At the time, I had wanted him to be our new closer, but nobody knows how that would have worked out. I think every pitcher strives to be more than a middle reliever. If they didn't, at least early in their career, one might wonder why they don't strive to get better.

    His failure as a starter certainly messed something(s) up. It was only 10 starts, but he had also struggled at the end of 2011 as well. Yes, he walked a lot of batters, even as a reliever, but his hits per IP was astoundingly low (7.5 > 5.4 > 5.7 his first 3 seasons). He had been improving on his BB/9 from 4.0 to 3.6 to 3.0 in 2011. His WHIP had improved remarkably as well from 1.277 to 1.004 to .0959.

    His numbers in the minors are frightening. He's walked more batters than IP since 2012. He's only 28, but he shows no signs of turning things back around.

    There's no way anyone can call his early career a fluke. The sample size was too large to deny this kid had serious talent. It's a shame what has happened. After a great 2008 minor league season, a great 16 IP in AAA in 2009, and a decent rookie year in MLB in 2009, here are the numbers of his incredible 12 month run with the Sox starting with the 2009 playoffs:

                IP   H  ER  BB K

    10/9    3.0  0  0   0    4 (Playoffs vs LAA)

    4/10 14.2  8   5   3  18

    5/10 11.1  7   1   6  11

    6/10 13.2  7   3   3  13

    7/10   9.1  4   1   4    9

    8/10 12.1  7   2   6  11

    9/10 13.1 12  4   8  14

    4/11 12.1 11  5   3  12

    5/11 13.1   7  5   4  13

    6/11 13.0   4  0   3  12

    7/11  12.1  7  0   3  12 (25 straight appearances & 26.1 IP w/o an ER allowed)

    8/11  11.0  6  4   2  14

    Total 139.2 70 30 45  143

    ERA: 1.93   WHIP: 0.823

     

    The wheels came off in September 2011. They have never gone back on. They may never go back on.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    Bard's whole thing was that he could throw 99 mph.  Without that , he is not very good. His control problems may be mental, but the huge drop in velocity is hard to figure. Without that, he can't start , close or set up effectively.

    Stabbed by Foulke.



    The drop was expected.

     

    Very few starters can maintain 98mph for 6+ IP.  But more of them than you realize can hit that mark for 1 or 2 innings.  Watch the All Star game and check the gun readings.  You will see 6 or 7 guys in that game any yeat hitting 98 or 99 that you normally see top out at 93 or 94 mph.

    If you expected Bard to throw 98mph for 6 innings, you were being unrealistic...

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to notin's comment:

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Bard's whole thing was that he could throw 99 mph.  Without that , he is not very good. His control problems may be mental, but the huge drop in velocity is hard to figure. Without that, he can't start , close or set up effectively.

    Stabbed by Foulke.

     



    The drop was expected.

     

     

    Very few starters can maintain 98mph for 6+ IP.  But more of them than you realize can hit that mark for 1 or 2 innings.  Watch the All Star game and check the gun readings.  You will see 6 or 7 guys in that game any yeat hitting 98 or 99 that you normally see top out at 93 or 94 mph.

    If you expected Bard to throw 98mph for 6 innings, you were being unrealistic...

    [/QUOTE]

    That is not the point. He is no longer able to throw 98-99 at all. Even for one batter. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    http://www.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/rob-bradford/2013/08/08/daniel-bard-still-banking-helping-these-red-s

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mchampion. Show Mchampion's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    I posted before about the experiment with Bard as a starter.  They tried it in the minors and he failed.  Why would you do it again on the big stage.  This year he is hurt with an ab problem and is just getting healthy.  Hopefully with good health his good fastball will return.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    It can't hurt to keep him around at a low cost and hope for the best.

    Sox4ever

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Daniel Bard

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    It can't hurt to keep him around at a low cost and hope for the best.

    Sox4ever



    Time to move on Moon to other prospects....

     

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