If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    At this juncture of ST, Bard is in doubt (change-up still not showing, control problems), and while Aceves has been great, it seems the club wants him in the pen.

    So, if neither guy gets a rotation spot (I think one still might), who of the cast-offs and enigmas get the 4 and 5 spots (Miller seems to be officially out of the running now with hammy pull):

    Cook?

    Padilla?

    Doubront?

    Cook has been flying under the radar due to late starting point, but is making a strong case.  Doubront has been solid but Bobby has expressed frustration with his lack of an out pitch.  Padilla has been good, but the Crazy still lurks in the consideration.

    For my money, of these three, I like Cook (righty sinkerballer in Fenway?  Yes, everytime) and Doubront (expecting some bumps in the road, but letting him gain experience before Dice returns and then moving him to the pen).

    That being said, especially if Bard returns to the pen, giving them Bard/Melancon/Bailey at the back end, I want Aceves to get the spot.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    Pretty pathetic not to learn from 2011 mistakes. Had Aceves been in the rotation after DiceK and Buck went down, they would have made the playoffs.

    Aceves should be in the rotation, as the Red Sox need good starting pitching innings on a team that is constructed to get ahead early, not get behind early.

    That said, Beckett and Lester and Buch need to earn their contracts. If they do, problem is solved.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from J-BAY. Show J-BAY's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    As reported last night on Boston comcast sports net, if Bard is sent back to the bullpen, Aceves and Doubrant would be the #4 and #5. I'm not convinced Valentine isn't just attemping to motivate Bard to step up. With Aceves' past back issues, not sure he could go the distance as a starter.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]As reported last night on Boston comcast sports net, if Bard is sent back to the bullpen, Aceves and Doubrant would be the #4 and #5. I'm not convinced Valentine isnt just calling for Bard to step up.
    Posted by J-BAY[/QUOTE]

    Yeah, it is certainly in Bobby's repertoire to publicly point to a guy's shortcomings as motivation.  So, Bard is not out of the picture by any means.

    Doubront huh?  What do you think of Cook?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In response to "Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?": [QUOTE]As reported last night on Boston comcast sports net, if Bard is sent back to the bullpen, Aceves and Doubrant would be the #4 and #5. I'm not convinced Valentine isn't just calling for Bard to step up. With Aceves' past back issues, not sure he could go the distance as a starter. Posted by J-BAY[/QUOTE] Exactly, J-Bay...that's clearly Valentine's style so far. "Earn it." He seemed a little frustrated that Bard didn't throw enough change-ups. He settled down and retired 12 of last 14, including last 8, but he needs to prove the change-up can be effective. The Sox clearly want Bard to win the 4 spot and put Aceves in the pen. This will all likely come down to final days...
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    Doubront.

    Aceves does much better in the pen than as a starter.
    Bard is a fantastic set-up man: he belongs in the pen.

    I'd have liked to see us trade for Floyd or Wandy, but I suppose we'll have to choose another guy from the luist of projects. Padilla? Cook? Miller?
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from J-BAY. Show J-BAY's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who? : Yeah, it is certainly in Bobby's repertoire to publicly point to a guy's shortcomings as motivation.  So, Bard is not out of the picture by any means. Doubront huh?  What do you think of Cook?
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]

    Before ST, Valentine said he would give Bard 18-20 innings before deciding if he would be in the rotation. At the time, I didnt think that was anywhere near enough. We're long past that. If Bard wasn't in the mix at this stage of ST, he wouldnt still be out there, IMO. It's a big transition and think he'll at least start the season as a starter. I think doubrant will be the fifth starter. Havent seen enough of Cook, Space. Don''t think he's is in the mix at this point, but that could change tonight.
     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]Doubront. Aceves does much better in the pen than as a starter. Bard is a fantastic set-up man: he belongs in the pen. I'd have liked to see us trade for Floyd or Wandy, but I suppose we'll have to choose another guy from the luist of projects. Padilla? Cook? Miller?
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    thats the question Moon.  Of the 'projects', who?
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]#5 Starter=
    Posted by 2004Idiots[/QUOTE]

    Yeaaahh baby.  He could show Padilla how that eephus is REALLY done.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    There is a reason that these guys were cast-offs, and Ben seems to be finding that out now.
    I'm asking Ben to put a phone call into Wake, and asking him to come bail us out. We could get by with Wake as #4 and a couple of the others to rotate in at #5, at least until Dice-K is healthy enough to go.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]There is a reason that these guys were cast-offs, and Ben seems to be finding that out now. I'm asking Ben to put a phone call into Wake, and asking him to come bail us out. We could get by with Wake as #4 and a couple of the others to rotate in at #5, at least until Dice-K is healthy enough to go.
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]

    Dunno Ike.  Cook might be good to go.  Tonight will be significant.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who? : Dunno Ike.  Cook might be good to go.  Tonight will be significant.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]

    Cook appears to be pitching well, just hope he stays healthy.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who? : Cook appears to be pitching well, just hope he stays healthy.
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]

    The big question.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    Like to see Cook do well (Fenway sinkerballer as noted above) and get in the starting rotation with, later, Dice, and then that's one strong pen.  But Cook needs to start at triple AAA probably and Dice won't be around till late May early June--therefore, both Aceves & Bard should be starters in April, they deserve the chance.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]Doubront. Aceves does much better in the pen than as a starter. Bard is a fantastic set-up man: he belongs in the pen. I'd have liked to see us trade for Floyd or Wandy, but I suppose we'll have to choose another guy from the luist of projects. Padilla? Cook? Miller?
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    thats what we did last yr moon, why do it again?   try both out as starters and if things go badly u still have two great pen arms for most of the season - we need starters, just like last yr....stick with it
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    thats what we did last yr moon, why do it again?   try both out as starters and if things go badly u still have two great pen arms for most of the season - we need starters, just like last yr....stick with it

    You must understand, Moonstump zealously advocated for Wastefield over Aceves, in the 2011 second half rotation. He also zeaslously advocated for a million dollar offer to return Wastefield to the rotation.

    Aceves works quickly and is durable and has good overall stuff. He should stay in the rotation until he performs poorly for months. Wastefield was allowed to perform poorly for years!
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]thats what we did last yr moon, why do it again?   try both out as starters and if things go badly u still have two great pen arms for most of the season - we need starters, just like last yr....stick with it You must understand, Moonstump zealously advocated for Wastefield over Aceves, in the 2011 second half rotation. He also zeaslously advocated for a million dollar offer to return Wastefield to the rotation. Aceves works quickly and is durable and has good overall stuff. He should stay in the rotation until he performs poorly for months. Wastefield was allowed to perform poorly for years!
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr[/QUOTE]

    invective but accurate about wakefield....we simply had to suck it up when he pitched and then watched statistical contortionists tell us what we had seen was, despite all common sense, good pitching. so why the judgement on bard/aceves so soon? people on this board made every excuse to keep them in the bullpen in 2011 when we were falling apart but now show no such patience when they are starting...in spring training no less..
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from beavis. Show beavis's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    Cook would complement this staff the best in terms of what he throws.

    Lester - two seam fastball -southpaw
    Beckett - four and two seam fastball- righty
    Clay- fastball, slider, hard curve- righty
    Bard -fastball, fastball, slider-righty
    Cook- sinker- righty
    Doubront - fastball, screwball, curveball-southpaw



     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from attic-dan. Show attic-dan's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

       The Sox pitching, or lack their of, will be in constant state of flux. FO will keep bringing in SP or relief specialist until somebody steps up. I doubt what goes north to Boston, will be finished product by a longshot.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In response to "Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?": [QUOTE]   The Sox pitching, or lack their of, will be in constant state of flux. FO will keep bringing in SP or relief specialist until somebody steps up. I doubt what goes north to Boston, will be finished product by a longshot. Posted by attic-dan[/QUOTE] No team in baseball ever looks the same throughout the season. Look at the World Champion Cardinals of 2011. They lost their ace, their star had an off year and they went through about 5 closers. I think it was Billy Beane who said, "you spend the first 3rd of the season figuring out what you have, the second 3rd of the season trying to correct your issues and hopefully you end up with the right pieces to finish strong the last 3rd of the season." The Sox, at worst, look like they have more depth than last year, and if not, they have the resources to correct any issues...
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortMeade. Show FortMeade's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    It's down to Aceves, Bard, or Doubront now.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    I saw a post here I can't remember who the author was but it made a awful lot of sense to me.

    Being that the Sox are taking big gamble putting Aceves in the rotation considering his back history.

    Rather then to continue to use him as they have and the Yankees did as a very resourceful pitcher out of the pen. Short relief, multiple innings he can do it.

    Asking him to go 140 inning is pushing the envelope. A bird in the hand is better than two in the bush.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    We don't even need a 5th starter until mid April.  Bard should get the 4th spot, and Aceves can be used as a 5th starter when needed, and a reliever when we have the luxury of skipping a turn in the rotation.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?

    In Response to Re: If not Bard/Aceves, then who?:
    [QUOTE]We don't even need a 5th starter until mid April.  Bard should get the 4th spot, and Aceves can be used as a 5th starter when needed, and a reliever when we have the luxury of skipping a turn in the rotation.
    Posted by slomag[/QUOTE]

    You mean the Bard who you considered better than the Yankee counterpart at the 4th slot (despite expert's assessments that they have the deepest rotation in BB, save possibly TB & PhA), and who is being converted to a starter?
     

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