Re: JBJ described as a defensive upgrade over Jacoby
posted at 1/23/2014 10:38 PM EST
In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:
In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
I actually think JBJ will be a polarizing figure here in Boston. First of all, there will always be a certain percentage of the fan base who expects the team to have an above average player at every position, and will compare JBJ to Ellsbury's production. Ellsbury was one of the better hitters in the league let alone CFer's.
JBJ is also going to be the kind of player that does all the little things that don't show up on the stat-sheet. He's the guy who sees the outfielder mis play a ball so he stretches a single into a double, the guy who works 12-13 pitch at bats etc etc. He won't excel anywhere but he will do everything decently and his defense will be his true plus plus tool.
To me...that is a very good player who can start on a first division team. But there will be those who expect so much more out of him and never appreciate those things. Oh well.....*I'm already a JBJ fan and I think he is going to be a great player.
Really? We sure didn't see too many 12 - 13 pitch at bats last year, & we won't see many for quite some time if he can't learn to pick up the breaking ball cutting inside & low from a major league pitcher.
Seriously.... Some of you are reaching way too far. I love the kid, but we better plan on being VERY PATIENT. Could he come out hitting, with great plate discipline right from the get go? Sure. Is it likely. No! Will he likely struggle........ for god knows how long? Probably.
Will he likely be a good mlb hitter? I think so, but right now the mlb dust bins are littered with guys who were excellent hitters in the minors, but never could make the leap. Do I think this happens with JBJ? NO! I think he'll do just fine, but it will VERY LIKELY take several years of rocky roads.
As for the rediculous OP asserting that JBJ "is a defensive upgrade." Ignorant! Rediculous! Reaching! Hope against hope! The kid has not proven a single thing yet, & looked out of place last year when called up in CF. Ells, ASIDE FROM BEING ARMED WITH MY AUNTS ARM, is one of the best in the business!!!! PERIOD! His speed & field knowledge make up for a world of faults. As far as him costing us extra bases??? Please! It simply never happened. Were there the rare occasions where a guy was able to go from 1st to third because of his WEAK SISTER arm? Yep! Sorry, it was negligible at best. The rest of his defensive game was top of the league.
To even think about putting a completely unproven kid, who would be absolutely wet behind the ears if he had ever even seen the water, above Ells, is beyond absurd. WAY Beyond absurd!
Yes guys. We're all going to miss Ells........ but, that's simply not a good enough reason to REACH & start the campaign to induct JBJ into the coming mlb Hall of Fame.
Let's hope the folks pushing for the premature HOF vote have patience when things get rocky. I'm good with the kid knowing that it may not be pretty til year 2 or 3.
I never said we wouldn't miss Ellsbury. He will be more than greatly missed.
Nobody is inducting JBJ in the HOF. The kid is an excellent fielder. That's something that can be determined on the farm.
I know many of you do not want believe that Ellsbury broke late on several balls hit in his direction and took bad route to balls. Yes, all fielders do from time to time, but some of us have the opinion that Jacoby did it more often than the norm and his speed made up for some of it, but not all. This in no way is a claim that Ellsbury's defense was substandard. In my opinion, he has been top 5-6 for the last couple years.
I'm not slighting Ellsbury by thinking JBJ can be top 4-6 on defense this year. My guess is JBj will never come close to the offenisve value of Ellsbury when he was healthy and playing, but if he can quickly get his OBP above Jacoby's and play 150+ games every year, his defense can make the loss of Jacoby a little less painful.
There's also a significant chance JBj never comes close to making up for the huge loss of Ellsbury. I get that. I bet most here do.
One could look at it this way: here is what Jacoby has done for us the last 4 years:
384 games (1775 PAs) .297/.351/.438/.789 (112 2B+3B, 45 HRs & 112 SBs)
What if JBj could give us this over the next 4 years?
600 games (2400 PAs) .280/.360/.430/.790 (140 2b+3B, 50 Hrs & 40 sBs) plus slightly better fielding.
I realize the loss of base speed and intimidation is significant, but when you factor in the contract cost comparative, and what we could do for with the differential to upgrade other positions, I think we can view the loss of Ellsbury and the cost it would have taken to keep him here as not as bad as it appears.