Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from charliedarling. Show charliedarling's posts

    Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    If these two guys and the Tampa defense can look like they have this week I have to think that Tampa will be tough to beat in the East and even tougher to beat if they get to the playoffs.

    Both Moore and Price completely shut down the best offense in baseball this week and made it look pretty easy on both nights.  Never really a big Sox threat in either game.

    No walks, a few hits, nothing strung together and another quality starter returning from injury according to Orsillo and Remy.

    And, Tampa's defense looked great as well in taking several hits away from the Sox that many teams (incuding Boston) may not have been able to do.

    I see these guys as very, very dangerous no matter of the outcome of the game  tomorrow.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    Somewhere softy is saying, "The Rays will fade away in the dogdays of summer!"

    Sox4ever

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    With the addition of Myers, they're looking like the A team in the division right now, especially with Buch gone.

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to BurritoT-'s comment:

    If you were Tampa, would you trade one of your very best prospects for a proven rbi man for the stretch? The team needs one more hitter. Each year they refuse to top-off what is already a good team with that one last missing piece.



    I dunno, I think they did what they had to do when they traded for Myers.  They have enough offense with that pitching.

     

     

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to Yaz's comment:

    I agree. I have stated earlier that either [ more so the Rays] the Rays or Orioles will win the AL East and the one who doesn't win will be the Wild Card winner. With Texas or Oakland getting the second wild card. With that said, the Red Sox will miss the post-season again[ but they really were not even supposed to be anyway coming into this year]. It would be wise to follow the path of the Rays and A's in building a roster with less high-salaried players, good coaching, and pitching-defense. As the Red Sox are composed at the moment, they struggle[ as seen in this series] against top-tier pitching.



    All teams struggle against top-tier pitching.  The Rays struggled in Game 2 of this series.

    I agree that the Rays are emerging as probably the team to beat in the entire AL.  But I think the Sox are better than Baltimore and should make the playoffs.

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to BurritoT-'s comment:

    If you were Tampa, would you trade one of your very best prospects for a proven rbi man for the stretch? The team needs one more hitter. Each year they refuse to top-off what is already a good team with that one last missing piece.




    Do they need one more hitter? How do they compare to other teams in the division like the Red Sox? They have Longoria, Myers, Zobrist, Jennings, and on top of those guys, the years Loney, Kelly Johnson and Scott are having.

    I remember Jim from Florida saying Myers is unproven, etc. He's the real deal.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    In response to Yaz's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    I agree. I have stated earlier that either [ more so the Rays] the Rays or Orioles will win the AL East and the one who doesn't win will be the Wild Card winner. With Texas or Oakland getting the second wild card. With that said, the Red Sox will miss the post-season again[ but they really were not even supposed to be anyway coming into this year]. It would be wise to follow the path of the Rays and A's in building a roster with less high-salaried players, good coaching, and pitching-defense. As the Red Sox are composed at the moment, they struggle[ as seen in this series] against top-tier pitching.

     



    All teams struggle against top-tier pitching.  The Rays struggled in Game 2 of this series.

     

    I agree that the Rays are emerging as probably the team to beat in the entire AL.  But I think the Sox are better than Baltimore and should make the playoffs.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    The Red Sox are better than Baltimore now, but the Orioles hitting it top tier with Markakis, Jones, Machado and Davis.

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs


    I really dislike the Rays and can't understand how a team with their low payroll can be so successful almost every year.  How do they always have the best or one of the top pitching staffs in MLB? 

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to susan250's comment:

     


    I really dislike the Rays and can't understand how a team with their low payroll can be so successful almost every year.  How do they always have the best or one of the top pitching staffs in MLB? 

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Iceman4. Show Iceman4's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to susan250's comment:


    I really dislike the Rays and can't understand how a team with their low payroll can be so successful almost every year.  How do they always have the best or one of the top pitching staffs in MLB? 



    years of picking # 1's in the draft

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to Iceman4's comment:

    In response to susan250's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     


    I really dislike the Rays and can't understand how a team with their low payroll can be so successful almost every year.  How do they always have the best or one of the top pitching staffs in MLB? 

     



    years of picking # 1's in the draft

     

    [/QUOTE]

    That's a small part of the team now. Plus, why aren't teams like KC near the top of their division?

    The Rays are where they are by playing the comp pick game masterfully, letting players go at the exact right time, trading players at the exact right time, picking up role players that go on to have career years with them, and having an excellent manager.

    Sure, the first round picks have helped, but to me, it is not even close to the main reason they are where they are right now. Besides, they've been winning for a long time now.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs


    They will regress. If the Sox win today, that will be a major blow to Rays. They can go on a huge run and still not take a series from Boston. 

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to BurritoT-'s comment:

    If you were Tampa, would you trade one of your very best prospects for a proven rbi man for the stretch? The team needs one more hitter. Each year they refuse to top-off what is already a good team with that one last missing piece.



    Tampas farm system isn't as heavy as it's been, at least it's definitely not top heavy.  They don't have that blue chipper who can pretty much be centered around any deal.  They would have to package 3-4 of there top prospects to even open the door for a good bat.  Which would kill there system.  Giving the payroll constraint Tampa has they can't really afford to bankrupt their farm.

    That's the good news....the bad news is there are already a really good team clipping at our heals. 

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazyworldoftroybrown. Show crazyworldoftroybrown's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    Didn't they have like 11 picks in top 60 only a couple of years ago? So those kids probably just getting to Double AA. Moonslav would know more not sure.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to BurritoT-'s comment:

    If you were Tampa, would you trade one of your very best prospects for a proven rbi man for the stretch? The team needs one more hitter. Each year they refuse to top-off what is already a good team with that one last missing piece.




    Id give up some pieces they have on the farm. A team like the Rays who are constricted with a strict budget, have to pick and choose when to "go for it". I think this is the year for them to do just that. they have some very tradable pieces in their system that could net them a legit bat. Problem is, how much $$ and years the player is owed. A guy like Rios might be a nice bat to add to that lineup, but with about 5-6M owed this year and 12.5 in 2014 with a 1M buyout for 2015, It probably wouldnt work.

    Id try to make something work with another bat in that lineup though.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from crazyworldoftroybrown. Show crazyworldoftroybrown's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

     Rays had 10 picks in top 60 in 2011 Draft, dont know if they signed them all.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from dustcover. Show dustcover's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    IMO picking up another bat is not as vital to their lineup as has been earlier mentioned.  With a lineup which includes Longoria, Myers, Zobrist, Joyce, Molina, and Loney, and Madden's approach to the game, the Rays offense is more than adequate to support what I consider the best pitching staff, top to bottom, in the AL. Particularly so in a short series. 

    Add Cobb, who is about to come off the DL, to the rotation of Price, Moore, Hellickson, and Hernandez and you have a staff that will keep the Rays in most games through 6 or 7 innings. And their bullpen can be lights out on most nights.  I foresee the Rays winning a multitude of low scoring games the rest of the way.

    And it would not surprise me one iota if come October, the Rays find themselves in serious contention for a World Series Ring. 

    That being said, I have not lost hope, go SOX. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxDOrtiz. Show RedSoxDOrtiz's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    The Rays are a far better team than us if we do not have our Ace Clay on the mound.... that said, if Lester can keep up the trend he is going towards and get back to his form from early season... it will go a long way.  Lackey is looking like the guy we were hoping to sign finally and is coming up huge. Clay was the best pitcher in the game before he got hurt.  Dempster is a solid bottom of the rotation innings eater.  Felix is surging for his past 8 starts and might have finally figured out how to put it all together.

     

    The Sox have Napoli, Ells and Victorino trending up and Drew is due to heat up as well.  I think what we saw this weekend were the two best teams in baseball facing each other and shows that we can't match their pitching without Clay.  This season hinges on him coming back for the playoffs and for Lester to have a sustained turnaround.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    Yes, the Rays did have 11 top picks in 2011, mostly from losing marginal players to free agency. 10 in the top 60 and 12 in the top 89. They signed all of them. They became the masters at that game. The Hawpe trade was one example similar to our Billy Wagner deal that netted us Ranaudo and Vitek.

    Many feel the Rays only got good because they had so many top draft choices over the years. While they did have a few, it certainly is not the major reason they are so good right now, and besides, many other teams have had more top picks and have not gotten much closer to contending.

    Here's a summary of the Rays draft history:

    2000 Rocco Baldelli (6th)/J Shileds (16th round)

    2001 Brazelton (3rd)

    2002 BJ Upton (2nd)

    2003 Delmon Young (1st: later traded)/ John Jaso (338)

    2004 J Nieman (4th)/Brignac (45)/W Davis (75)/McGee (135)/Son'stine (375)

    2005 Townsend (8)/Hellickson (118)/R Zimmerman (358)

    2006 Longoria (3)/A Cobb (109)/D Jennings (289)

    2007 D Price (1)/M Moore (245)

    2008 Beckham (1)

    2009 L Washington (30- not signed)/Diekroeger (78-not signed)

    2010 J Sale (17)/O'Conner (31)/Vettleson (42)

    2011 T Guerrieri (24 for Crawford)/M Mahtook (31- for R Soriano)/J Hager (32)/B Martin (38- for Sorinao)/T Goeddel (41- for CC)/J Ames (42- for Balfour)/ B Snell (52- for Hawpe)/K Carter (56- for Benoit)/G Garvin (59-for Choate)/J Harris (60- for Qualls)/G Goetzman (75-for Balfour)/L Linsky (89)

    2012 R Shaffer (25)/S Edwards (88)

    2013 N Ciuffo (21)/R Stanek (29-for BJ Upton)/R Unroe (60)

     

    Some major trades that made a big impact.

    7/04 V Zambrano & Fortunato for S Kazmir

    1/06  D Baez & L Carter for Edwin Jackson

    12/06 A Huff for B Zobrist

    11/07 Delmon Young, B Harris, & J Pride for M Garza & J Bartlett

    12/08 E Jackson for Matt Joyce

    8/09 Kazmir for Sean Rodriguez, Matt Sweeney, & Alex Torres

    11/09 Jesse Chavez for R Soriano

    12/10 Bartlett & C Figueroa for B Gomes, C Ramos, & A Russell

    1/11 M. Garza + 2 for C Archer, S Fuld, B Guyer, & Hak-Ju Lee, R Chirinos

    12/12 J Shileds & W Davis for Wil Myers, J Odorizz, P Leonard & M Montgomery

     

     

     

    Sox4ever

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    I'm not convinced about the Rays - they are better offensively with Myers and a healthy Longoria, but they still have plenty of holes.  And their rotation is not as good as it was in previous years - Moore is for real, and Price is great when he's healthy, but he's started to show some wear on his arm this year.  Cobb, Hernandez & Archer aren't all that great, and Hellickson has been hit or miss, and many of the misses have come against AL East opponents - you have to think a change-up artist suffers a bit with familiarity.

    The key is going to be to keep them from winning the division - make them burn one Price or Moore start in the wild card playoff.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Moore, Price and a solid defense could make Tampa a favorite in the East and in the playoffs

    In response to slomag's comment:

    I'm not convinced about the Rays - they are better offensively with Myers and a healthy Longoria, but they still have plenty of holes.  And their rotation is not as good as it was in previous years - Moore is for real, and Price is great when he's healthy, but he's started to show some wear on his arm this year.  Cobb, Hernandez & Archer aren't all that great, and Hellickson has been hit or miss, and many of the misses have come against AL East opponents - you have to think a change-up artist suffers a bit with familiarity.

    The key is going to be to keep them from winning the division - make them burn one Price or Moore start in the wild card playoff.



    All teams have "holes". The question is, do the Rays have more or less "holes" than the Sox and other contending teams, and if they have more, do they make it up in other areas with superb players.

    The Rays are very dependent on health, especially for Longoria and Price, but they have suffered some injuries this year and still hung tough. Luke Scott is back (.835 OPS), Wil Myers is here to stay (.847 OPS). Those are two players the Rays have not had all year. Those two provide a huge boost to what they had in their stead. The Rays now have 6 guys with an OPS over .775:

    .869 Longoria

    .847 Myers

    .835 Scott

    .824 Loney

    .790 K Johnson

    .775 D Jennings

    Then, there is Zobrist (.745) and Joyce (.752) who give some potential for more of a boost over the final 2 months of the season. Their 2 weak offensive positions are SS (Escobar .668) and Catcher (Molina .609/Lobaton .697). They have Ryan Roberts (.688) and Sean Rodriguez (.698) on the bench.

    The pitching staff surely took a big hit when they lost Shields and Davis in the Myers deal, and then they lost Niemann to injury. What's amazing to me, is that despite these losses, Price (5-5  3.75) and Hellickson (9-3 4.62) have not "picked up the slack" at all. The real boost has come from Moore (14-3 3.17), Alex Cobb (6-2 3.01) and Chris Archer (5-3 2.76).

    Team record in starts by...

    16-4  Moore

    9-4   A Cobb

    7-3   C Archer

    Maybe the Moore record is not so surprising, but 16-7 from your 6 and 7th starter combined is stunning. (Assuming Niemann and R Hernandez were the 4 and 5 slots)

    The pen has been in turmoil and changeover for years. Farnsworth was a big factor in their success in recent years, but has only pitched 27 innings this year (5.33 ERA and 1.48 WHIP). The pen has 11 blown saves and a 27% inherited runners scoring percent.

    Rodney has improved, but his 4.40 ERA and 1.42 WHIP is terrible as a closer.

    Jake McGee is at 4.46/1.122 (38 IP)

    C Ramos 4.20/1.352 (41)

    J Wright 2.82/1.105 (44)

    J Peralta 3.07/1.045  (44)

    A Torres 0.30/0.63 (30)

     

     

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