Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

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    Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    The Dodgers have 4 shortstops on their 40 man roster.  All four are the sons of former major leaguers.   Jerry Hairston Jr. (son of Jerry Sr.), Ivan DeJesus Jr. (son of Ivan Sr.), Dee Gordon (son of Tom) and Justin Sellers (son of Jeff).

    Not important, but certainly amusing to me...
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    Baseball seems to have far more sons of players in the pros than basketball or football.  Is that due to the size requirement in the other two i.e. lots of talent is washed out because they didn't reach daddy's size or is there more to it?  Or is my observation not backed by fact?
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    Great dig.  The Sellers name caught my eye.

    Jeff Sellers
    Boston Red Sox starting pitcher
    1985-1988
    Career numbers
    13-22
    ERA 4.97
    WHIP 1.60
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]Baseball seems to have far more sons of players in the pros than basketball or football.  Is that due to the size requirement in the other two i.e. lots of talent is washed out because they didn't reach daddy's size or is there more to it?  Or is my observation not backed by fact?
    Posted by SonicsMonksLyresVicars[/QUOTE]

    Possible.  Another possible theory is that baseball players seem to bring their kids to the ballpark alot, as the games are during the summer when they are out of school.  They get to live baseball more than sons of the other sports get to live their sport.  Again, just a thought.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    ...and, maybe the sons get a longer look by the scouts thereby increasing their chances for an opportunity to prove themselves. 
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact


     
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    Jeff Sellers claim to fame was outdueling Dave Stewart in Oakland in a shutout.

     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]...and, maybe the sons get a longer look by the scouts thereby increasing their chances for an opportunity to prove themselves. 
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    Baseball is the only major sport that I believe who you know has a much as a person making it as how much talent a person has. Many players do get longer looks because of lineage and being relatives of former MLB players. And while many are chips off the old block, there are that many others who just sucked. The bonus baby treatment separates them from all the others. In the NFL, for instance, there are actually a lot of free agent, even non-drafted players who can catch on and even become great players. The NHL also seems to be a sport where sons/relatives also get preferential treatment.

    Again, not denying that you do have some very nice repeats in the kids of major professional players--Prince Fielder certainly is better than his father for example. But because there are so many minor league teams, so many franchises, so many players drafted each year, the entire lot of players to pick from is almost too many. So you have a lot of the kids of MLB players reeping the benefits of their situation. Joe Johnson might be a .450 hitter in high school, but if his teammate is Bret Saberhagen's kid who hits .400, you can bet that Saberhagen's kid gets the nod in a who might get drafted. Guys get cultivated, and obviously the longer you get to play organized baseball from age 20-30, the better chance you are going to get a shot at the big leagues if you perform/improve/mature.

    It's an interesting factoid, but in some respects, it's a sure sign that big league talent has a way of repeating themselves from generation to generation. Pete Rose's kid was not very good, but he got his shot nevertheless..and why not...if he had the hits in his genes, maybe it might have translated to Rose Part 2. Bonds and Griffey are great examples of guys who took their games beyond the father's and then some. They were cultivated, they did grow up in big league lockerrooms and sure got to know about how the system is. It's certainly doesn't hurt to be a son of a MLB player.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact : Baseball is the only major sport that I believe who you know has a much as a person making it as how much talent a person has. Many players do get longer looks because of lineage and being relatives of former MLB players. And while many are chips off the old block, there are that many others who just sucked. The bonus baby treatment separates them from all the others. In the NFL, for instance, there are actually a lot of free agent, even non-drafted players who can catch on and even become great players. The NHL also seems to be a sport where sons/relatives also get preferential treatment. Again, not denying that you do have some very nice repeats in the kids of major professional players--Prince Fielder certainly is better than his father for example. But because there are so many minor league teams, so many franchises, so many players drafted each year, the entire lot of players to pick from is almost too many. So you have a lot of the kids of MLB players reeping the benefits of their situation. Joe Johnson might be a .450 hitter in high school, but if his teammate is Bret Saberhagen's kid who hits .400, you can bet that Saberhagen's kid gets the nod in a who might get drafted. Guys get cultivated, and obviously the longer you get to play organized baseball from age 20-30, the better chance you are going to get a shot at the big leagues if you perform/improve/mature. It's an interesting factoid, but in some respects, it's a sure sign that big league talent has a way of repeating themselves from generation to generation. Pete Rose's kid was not very good, but he got his shot nevertheless..and why not...if he had the hits in his genes, maybe it might have translated to Rose Part 2. Bonds and Griffey are great examples of guys who took their games beyond the father's and then some. They were cultivated, they did grow up in big league lockerrooms and sure got to know about how the system is. It's certainly doesn't hurt to be a son of a MLB player.
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]

    Actually, basketball appears to have a much, much deeper political network.  It's not as familial as you suggest MLB is, but rather tied to the sneaker companies and the various prep and summer leagues, such as ABC or Grassroots.

    It is statitistically true that being the son of a player is the best way to make the majors, but that is more of a math parlor trick than anything else.

    I don't think Pete Rose Jr. is the best example of nepotism.  Jr. Rose had a 20 year long professional baseball career, all but 2 weeks of which was spent in the minors.  And since he did have a good year about 8 years into his career, he got a very brief call up.   I don't see how you could say that move was based on who his dad was, and I don't consider getting 14 ABs in September expansion nearly 9 years after being drafted to be "getting a shot."
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact : Possible.  Another possible theory is that baseball players seem to bring their kids to the ballpark alot, as the games are during the summer when they are out of school.  They get to live baseball more than sons of the other sports get to live their sport.  Again, just a thought.
    Posted by fizsh[/QUOTE]

    Wasn't that basically how Terry Francona described his childhood?
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact : Actually, basketball appears to have a much, much deeper political network.  It's not as familial as you suggest MLB is, but rather tied to the sneaker companies and the various prep and summer leagues, such as ABC or Grassroots. It is statitistically true that being the son of a player is the best way to make the majors, but that is more of a math parlor trick than anything else. I don't think Pete Rose Jr. is the best example of nepotism.  Jr. Rose had a 20 year long professional baseball career, all but 2 weeks of which was spent in the minors.  And since he did have a good year about 8 years into his career, he got a very brief call up.   I don't see how you could say that move was based on who his dad was, and I don't consider getting 14 ABs in September expansion nearly 9 years after being drafted to be "getting a shot."
    Posted by notin[/QUOTE]

    you're missing the point. Rose isn't going to get his shot to be anything, a minor leaguer, or even being drafted had it not been for his Dad. What you do after you are drafted, signed, etc is up to the player at that point. Everything I was talking about had to do with why MLB sons get preferential attention/treatment. Without being sons of MLB, they are just another player in many instances. Instead, they get that look from a scout and get the nod on even a bonus baby contract due to the lineage.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact : you're missing the point. Rose isn't going to get his shot to be anything, a minor leaguer, or even being drafted had it not been for his Dad. What you do after you are drafted, signed, etc is up to the player at that point. Everything I was talking about had to do with why MLB sons get preferential attention/treatment. Without being sons of MLB, they are just another player in many instances. Instead, they get that look from a scout and get the nod on even a bonus baby contract due to the lineage.
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]

    You are making a point based on pure conjecture than Pete Rose Jr. was drafted by the Orioles (re: not Reds) based on lineage and not baseball ability.   This is not backed up byu his lack of success.  It's not like he was a first round draft pick; more like 8th or 9th. 

    In fact the career of Pete Rose Jr, along with may other MLB sons, did follow the course of being "just another player."  The number of middle round draft picks who spent minimal MLB time and then drifetd off into obscurity is very, very large and accounts for a larger chunk of all MLB veterans than most people realize...
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]The Dodgers have 4 shortstops on their 40 man roster.  All four are the sons of former major leaguers.   Jerry Hairston Jr. (son of Jerry Sr.), Ivan DeJesus Jr. (son of Ivan Sr.), Dee Gordon (son of Tom) and Justin Sellers (son of Jeff). Not important, but certainly amusing to me...
    Posted by notin[/QUOTE]

      My favorite all-time stat is that Aaron, and McCovey tied for the league lead in '63 with 44 homers. The number that both players wore was also 44.
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact :   My favorite all-time stat is that Aaron, and McCovey tied for the league lead in '63 with 44 homers. The number that both players wore was also 44.
    Posted by attic-dan[/QUOTE]

    I'm partial to the '72 Wilbur Wood starting 49 games and pitching 376.2 innings...with an ERA+ of 126 and a WHIP of 1.059....throwing the knuckleball! 

    His splits are even crazier....25 starts on 2 days rest, and 22 on 3 days rest....and his stats were the same or better with the shorter rest.  Astonishing.
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    The best father son moment ever in MLB was the Griffeys hitting back to back HR in 1990. That is unbelievable.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    This is a cool page on father-son combos.  There are over 100 of them that have played MLB.

     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]This is a cool page on father-son combos.  There are over 100 of them that have played MLB. http://www.baseball-almanac.com/family/fam2.shtml
    Posted by snakeoil123[/QUOTE]

    Hi Snake.  I was going to respond that 100 seemed low, but checked the site and that's only A-L.  There are a few multi-generational combos too...the Bells are one...
     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact : Hi Snake.  I was going to respond that 100 seemed low, but checked the site and that's only A-L.  There are a few multi-generational combos too...the Bells are one...
    Posted by Chilliwings[/QUOTE]


    I judt read somewhere else there were over 200.  So you are right.  Although that link does have an M-Z link.  You just have to dig for it.  Ha.

     
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    Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact

    In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Odd Non-Sox Baseball Fact : Hi Snake.  I was going to respond that 100 seemed low, but checked the site and that's only A-L.  There are a few multi-generational combos too...the Bells are one...
    Posted by Chilliwings[/QUOTE]

    5 Three generation familis.  Bells - Gus, Buddy, Dave and Mike.  Boones - RAy, Bob, Bret and Aaron. The aforementioned Hairstons - Sam, Jerry Sr., Jerry Jr and Scott. Colemans - Joe, Joe and Casey.  And the Werths/Schofields with Ducky (grandafather), Dick (uncle), Dennis Werth (stepdad) and Jayson Werth (grandson, nephew and stepson).
     

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