Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    YES!!!! I wanted this guy signed to back salty up...Looks like Lav will either start the year in AAA or 1 of Lav/Salty will soon be part of a trade.

    Since Ross is a RHH catcher, I think Salty will be here in 2013.

    [/QUOTE]

    You called it!

    Although he has a .238 career BA (.324 OBP), he has been over .255 the last 3 years in a row. Surprisingly, his career OPS vs LHPs (.764) is actually slightly lower than vs RHPs (.771). The differential is much more extreme the last 2 years:

    2012, it was over a hundred points higher vs RHPs (.818) than LHPs (.712).

    2011, it was over two hundred pts higher vs RHPs (.833) than LHPs (.613).

    It almosts looks like he matches up better with Lava than Salty, and so the two year deal gives Ben flexibiltiy no matter which way he goes: Salty extension or Lava in 2014.

    His sample sizes are too small vs AL East teams to even mention.

    I'm happy with this idea, though $6M seems high..

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
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    In response to SindarinEribor's comment:
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    In response to craze4sox's comment:
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    In response to SindarinEribor's comment:
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    In response to craze4sox's comment:
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    In response to rightymclefty's comment:
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    Nice backup catcher.

    This brings more questions than it answers.

    Are they looking to trade Lavarnway or Salty?

    Funny Laroache and Ross were guys we once had and let go.

    [/QUOTE]

     

    This is a perfect example of repeating past mistakes.  We kept guys like Tek and Wake much too long just to replace them with equal or less talented players.  We trade Rizzo because of AGon, then trade Adrian away and are now left with the possibility of Laroache again.

    Makes little sense!

     

    [/QUOTE]It was necessary to trade AGon in order to get rid of the Crawford and Beckett contracts. It was necessary to trade Rizzo to get AGon. It is much easier to see things if you remove your hindsight glasses..

    [/QUOTE]
     

    It was only necessary because we made the wrong choices in the first place.  Hindsight is a tough thing to call.  Theo rode a great team, our solid farm, Manny and two or three good moves before his lack of good judgement became obvious to everyone.

     

    What does this mean "Hindsight is a tough thing to call?"

    Hindsight is child's play since anyone can do it and be 100% correct all of the time.

    Extending Beckett and signing Crawford at the time were good moves. Who knew that Beckett would lose his velocity and control. Who knew that CC would become injury prone? Beckett and Crawford might do well next year and then will you play the hindsight card once again?

     


     

     

     

     

     

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    I dont and didnt agree with these moves at the time. I wanted to wait til after the season to resign JB if we were going to and CC was just a bad deal from the start like Lackey was. Gonzo was a good move at the time, but not those other 3.

    [/QUOTE]

    I didn't feel we should sign Beckett, Jenks, Lackey or Crawford to long term deals.  AGon was a nice addition that was only as good as Theo's next move, which was usually bad.  In this case it cost us our best 1B prospect "in Rizzo" and overall player in AGon just to clean up The mess.

    Ben has a weak team, very little major league ready talent but clean payroll so lets see what he does from here.  Dumping 250mil was a great joint effort considering the hole Theo had us in.



     

     

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

     ...Signing Crawford at the time were good moves. ... Who knew that CC would become injury prone? ... Crawford might do well next year and then will you play the hindsight card once again?

    Signing the glorifed platoon player to $20M+ for 7 years was never even close to a good deal.

    For me, it is not "second guessing", since I said it day one. Even if CC played to his career norms for 5 years, he was never worth $20M. He had a sub .700 OPS vs LHPs before signing here.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    The last 4 years CERA's in Atlanta....

     

    McCann--3.57

    Ross--3.32

    Right handed pull hitter with power as well.

    Good sign. Reverse split opens up the door to still sign Napoli, trade Salty, and keep Lavarnway in AAA one more year atleast. Then you get a lefty 1B to platoon with Napoli. And good insurance in AAA. That would be the perfect scenerio to me. At least we now have a catcher that can defend to compare with whoever else catches.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    The last 4 years CERA's in Atlanta....

     

    McCann--3.57

    Ross--3.32

     

    Encouraging, but CERA should be used pitcher by pitcher not as an aggregate total.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

     

    Encouraging, but CERA should be used pitcher by pitcher not as an aggregate total.

    [/QUOTE]


     

    Great. Could you find that information for us then?

     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from donrd4. Show donrd4's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to redsoxfan28's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/

    [/QUOTE]


    Who the H   ell is Davids Ross?

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

     ...Signing Crawford at the time were good moves. ... Who knew that CC would become injury prone? ... Crawford might do well next year and then will you play the hindsight card once again?

    Signing the glorifed platoon player to $20M+ for 7 years was never even close to a good deal.

    For me, it is not "second guessing", since I said it day one. Even if CC played to his career norms for 5 years, he was never worth $20M. He had a sub .700 OPS vs LHPs before signing here.

    [/QUOTE]


    OK perhaps what you say is correct but was he worth $15 mil. per year?

     

    Not in my opinion. I wouldn't have paid him $12M x 7 to platoon for us.

     

    My comment was also addressed to the majority of forum posters who bailed out on Crawford after the fact via using hindsight.

     

    True.

    Doesn't hindsight ever annoy you?

     

    Yes.

     

    Several posters here use hindsight on a daily basis, are they so stupid that they don't know what hindsight is or are they just good at bugging everyone? You can ignore them, humor them, or believe them. Take your pick.

    I never go to teh game threads, because the hindsight drivel is constant and just plain wrong most of the time.

    CC was not a fit for us in so many ways. A few of us said it at the time. Many said he was overpaid, but loved the signing. Now, hardly anyone admits they were for the signing at the time.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    Sorry but I believe the trade was a bad one. If it was to rid them of Josh then letting both CC and Agon go was bad. If it was to rid them of both Josh and CC's contract I still believe it to be bad.

    Letting Agon go blows a major hole in the line up with no FAor minor leaguer to fill the void. The move to fill it is to make a trade and lose a decent 1 or 2 kids.

    I also believe despite the bad yr CC had and the injuries he will be what he was once again.  He showed in the short time he played he could still hit even with a bad arm. The RS also have no LF and getting a good one is going to cost them.

    As for Josh we all know he liked  Farrell and pitched damn good when Farrell was PC.

    I know we hd no idea that Farrell would return. However now that he is here I'd like for Mr. Peabody to get in the time machine and go back and cancel that deal. I actual thought they should have never made it created too many holes that only trades can fill with equal outputs.

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from seabeachfred. Show seabeachfred's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
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    In response to Soxdog67's comment:
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    In response to southpaw777's comment:
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    It makes more sense that a move with Lavarnway would be happening IMO. Either AAA, 1b, or even a trade. With Ross hitting RH it only makes sense to keep Salty around.

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't disagree with you at all southpaw, I also believe that signing Ross spells the end to Lavarnway's chances of making the Sox in 2013...whether he gets moved in a trade is still to be determined...

    ...but should we possibly be reading between the lines here?? One of their first moves is to bring in a catcher, which possibly means that the initial trade discussions with another team includes the SOx sending a catcher as part of the deal.

    On the other hand, maybe the Sox FO is not as high on their backup catcher as certain individuals on this forum.

    [/QUOTE]


    They are very thin at 1b, maybe a conversion to 1b for Lav is possible as well. he could really concentrate on his hitting at 1b more than he could behind the plate.

    Ive stated before that I believe the lack of production on offense from most catchers is a direct result of concentrating mostly on defense and all the other work that goes into playing the position.

    Either way, I think those questions will be asked and we should know the answers soon.

    [/QUOTE]


    I think it would be very dangerous to trade Lavarnway unless we could get something solid for him.  Some are writing him off because of his less than stellar hitting when he was brought up this past season, but keep in mind he was told and coached to work on his defense first and foremost and his hitting suffered.  Hee has shown good power in the minors and also keep in mind that on this same board late in 2006 we were talking the same crap about Dustin Pedroia.  I would not be anxious to send Ryan away.  As for the signing of Ross, to me this is the wrong Ross that we signed.

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    Ross is a good signing.  It is interesting though, it does appear that the Red Sox do not think Salty and Lava are going to be enough next year.  That surprises me, that is one of the few positions that I felt did not need a real upgrade.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mchampion. Show Mchampion's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Ross is a good signing.  It is interesting though, it does appear that the Red Sox do not think Salty and Lava are going to be enough next year.  That surprises me, that is one of the few positions that I felt did not need a real upgrade.

    [/QUOTE]

    Neither one can throw a runner out to save their lives.  There is a guy I saw in Portland early in the year.  I think his name was Butler.  He threw out both would be base stealers the day I was there. This guy has a better arm than both Lav and Salty right now, I just don't know if he can hit.  He was promoted to pawtucket late in the year but I don't know how he did there. That is how bad those two are defensively.  That is why we have to sign Ross.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Ross is a good signing.  It is interesting though, it does appear that the Red Sox do not think Salty and Lava are going to be enough next year.  That surprises me, that is one of the few positions that I felt did not need a real upgrade.

    [/QUOTE]


    well with the string of bad luck and poor health we've had recently i guess you can never be too safe. This way we will have lava in case one of them goes down. Or maybe a GM was asking for lava/salty in a deal so we signed him to open that door up?

     
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  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to JimfromFlorida's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Sorry but I believe the trade was a bad one. If it was to rid them of Josh then letting both CC and Agon go was bad. If it was to rid them of both Josh and CC's contract I still believe it to be bad.

    Letting Agon go blows a major hole in the line up with no FAor minor leaguer to fill the void. The move to fill it is to make a trade and lose a decent 1 or 2 kids.

    I also believe despite the bad yr CC had and the injuries he will be what he was once again.  He showed in the short time he played he could still hit even with a bad arm. The RS also have no LF and getting a good one is going to cost them.

    As for Josh we all know he liked  Farrell and pitched damn good when Farrell was PC.

    I know we hd no idea that Farrell would return. However now that he is here I'd like for Mr. Peabody to get in the time machine and go back and cancel that deal. I actual thought they should have never made it created too many holes that only trades can fill with equal outputs.

    [/QUOTE]

    I like the fact we are slowly losing/dumping a lot of bad signings Theo made but still have work to do.  I'm also happy we retained one of the only good FA moves Theo ever made in David.  Moving one of the last "Salty" would be another good move in my opinion.  Salty is a great guy and team player but does very little to help an already struggling offense if you look at our entire picture. 

    We need to get back to our WC days of having an overall team OBP of around 365/370 with solid pitching.  These are the Yankee and Red Sox teams that have been most successful and what normally dictates a well rounded team.

     

     

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    YES!!!! I wanted this guy signed to back salty up...Looks like Lav will either start the year in AAA or 1 of Lav/Salty will soon be part of a trade.

    Since Ross is a RHH catcher, I think Salty will be here in 2013.

    [/QUOTE]

    You called it!

    Although he has a .238 career BA (.324 OBP), he has been over .255 the last 3 years in a row. Surprisingly, his career OPS vs LHPs (.764) is actually slightly lower than vs RHPs (.771). The differential is much more extreme the last 2 years:

    2012, it was over a hundred points higher vs RHPs (.818) than LHPs (.712).

    2011, it was over two hundred pts higher vs RHPs (.833) than LHPs (.613).

    It almosts looks like he matches up better with Lava than Salty, and so the two year deal gives Ben flexibiltiy no matter which way he goes: Salty extension or Lava in 2014.

    His sample sizes are too small vs AL East teams to even mention.

    I'm happy with this idea, though $6M seems high..

    [/QUOTE]


    I was surprised to see Ross hits RHP slightly better than LHP. I think knowing that, Salty could be the odd man out and we will soon hear his name involved in a trade.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to SindarinEribor's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     ...Signing Crawford at the time were good moves. ... Who knew that CC would become injury prone? ... Crawford might do well next year and then will you play the hindsight card once again?

    Signing the glorifed platoon player to $20M+ for 7 years was never even close to a good deal.

    For me, it is not "second guessing", since I said it day one. Even if CC played to his career norms for 5 years, he was never worth $20M. He had a sub .700 OPS vs LHPs before signing here.

    [/QUOTE]


    OK perhaps what you say is correct but was he worth $15 mil. per year? My comment was also addressed to the majority of forum posters who bailed out on Crawford after the fact via using hindsight. Doesn't hindsight ever annoy you? Several posters here use hindsight on a daily basis, are they so stupid that they don't know what hindsight is or are they just good at bugging everyone? You can ignore them, humor them, or believe them. Take your pick.

    [/QUOTE]


    Its usually pretty obvious to identify the ones that are just bashing someone for no reason or just trying to get under peoples skin.

    Either way, it doesnt bother me, but depending on the day I might have a little fun with it or just ignore it.

    If they get personal and disrespectful, then I will always ignore ...

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to seabeachfred's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Soxdog67's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to southpaw777's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    It makes more sense that a move with Lavarnway would be happening IMO. Either AAA, 1b, or even a trade. With Ross hitting RH it only makes sense to keep Salty around.

    [/QUOTE]

    I don't disagree with you at all southpaw, I also believe that signing Ross spells the end to Lavarnway's chances of making the Sox in 2013...whether he gets moved in a trade is still to be determined...

    ...but should we possibly be reading between the lines here?? One of their first moves is to bring in a catcher, which possibly means that the initial trade discussions with another team includes the SOx sending a catcher as part of the deal.

    On the other hand, maybe the Sox FO is not as high on their backup catcher as certain individuals on this forum.

    [/QUOTE]


    They are very thin at 1b, maybe a conversion to 1b for Lav is possible as well. he could really concentrate on his hitting at 1b more than he could behind the plate.

    Ive stated before that I believe the lack of production on offense from most catchers is a direct result of concentrating mostly on defense and all the other work that goes into playing the position.

    Either way, I think those questions will be asked and we should know the answers soon.

    [/QUOTE]


    I think it would be very dangerous to trade Lavarnway unless we could get something solid for him.  Some are writing him off because of his less than stellar hitting when he was brought up this past season, but keep in mind he was told and coached to work on his defense first and foremost and his hitting suffered.  Hee has shown good power in the minors and also keep in mind that on this same board late in 2006 we were talking the same crap about Dustin Pedroia.  I would not be anxious to send Ryan away.  As for the signing of Ross, to me this is the wrong Ross that we signed.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Actually, I think Salty is the odd man out.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    Without a doubt, paying 6M for an old backup catcher is as incompetent as the national electorate.

    Yeah, they should have listened to you last winter and spent more on Rmaon "the statue" Hernandez.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to TrotterNixon's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Without a doubt, paying 6M for an old backup catcher is as incompetent as the national electorate. This guy is like buying a new Chevy Lumina, it's not worth half it's value the minute the contract is signed.

    Pitiful, Cherry. Salty is nothing but a bad backup catcher with a windmill swing and the agility of a bulldog. The notion that having a lefty and righty catcher means anything is absurd. Unless a team carries three players who can catch at least marginally, it means next to nothing. Catching is primarily about run prevention, and that's not CERA, that's keeping runners hesitating, being agile with excpetional eye-hand coordination.

    The proper move was to target VMart or Napoli for acquistion, with VMart being a gifted contract hitter and Napoli still being young enough to carry good trade value. Lavarnway and Salty would then have value added game management value added while all would have solid trade value to provide necessary roster flexibility and fluidity at a position that is very much unstable.

    The Red Sox will have to pay nearly 100% of Ross' contract or cough up a half decent prospect to get rid of Ross in the trade market. Now that it's done, may as well just start this old man and hope his defensive skills last more than about half a season of games started.

    [/QUOTE]


    If you knew anything about this guy you would realize how dumb your rant really is...try and do some research first before you just start spouting off because a guy is 35...

     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Red Sox sign David Ross to two year deal

    In response to TrotterNixon's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    If you knew anything about "this guy" would realize how incompetent you and the Red Sox GM is. This old man had better start and Salty and his arbitration better net more than dumpster trash.

    Yeah, they should have listened to you last winter and spent more on Rmaon "the statue" Hernandez.

    Last winter, try again, stooge. In 2010 and 2011, when you wanted millions spent on washed up Varitek, Hernandez would have been the solid platoon catcher I said he would be.

    Yeas, they should have listened to you last winter and spent two milliong on Tim "beer gut" Wastefield.

    [/QUOTE]


    So what specifics do you know about Ross besides his age and your personal opinions?

    Go ahead and go look it up...

     

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