Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

     Line-Up     Notes        
                    
    1.EllsburyLCF7,000,000  includes ARB raise       
    2.PedroiaR2B8,000,000           
    3.Gonzalez, AL1B22,000,000           
    4.YoukR3B (back-up 1B)12,000,000  Youk is the key to the line-up      
    5.OrtizLDH (emergency 1B)12,500,000           
    6.WellsRLF21,000,000  Trade Crawford and 21 million for Vernon Wells    
    7.KalishLRF500,000           
    8.SaltySC900,000           
    9.ScutaroRSS6,000,000           
                    
     RotationBanking on Top 3 to put it together in the same year or that's the end of their playoff hopes       
                    
    1.BeckettR 17,000,000           
    2.LesterL 7,625,000           
    3.BuckR 3,500,000           
    4.John GarlandR 4,000,000 1 year deal as a free agent       
    5.DoubrantL 500,000           
                    
     Scott Kazmir L 4,000,000 Minor League Depth1 year deal as a free agent     
                    
     DL              
     Dice KR 10,000,000           
     LackeyR 16,500,000 This number is less by at least $2 million due to a DL Clause in his contract!  
                    
     PenThey will have to add an arm mid season and have the payroll to pick up nearly any reliever's half-year salary (Trade 2 mid-tier prospects - like Reddick and Bowden)      
                    
    1.BardRCloser3,750,000  includes ARB raise       
    2.MelaconRSet-Up Man500,000           
    3.AlbersRRH Short Man1,000,000           
    4.MoralesLLH Specialist750,000  includes ARB raise       
    5.OPENRRH Specialist1,750,000 Can afford to sign a lower level free agent      
    6.AcevesRLong Man/Spot Starter1,500,000  includes ARB raise       
    7.OPENLLong Man/Spot Starter500,000 Job to be won by a rookie       
                    
     DL              
     JenksRFat Bum6,000,0002 year/12 million          
                    
     Bench              
                    
    1.ShoppachRCatcher1,500,000           
    2.PuntoSSS/2B/3B1,500,000last year          
    3.OPEN?OF/PR1,500,000 Sox can afford to sign a low level back up OF'er - could they get Coco for that price???  
    4.LavarnwayRC/RHPH475,000           
                    
      Jose Iglessias will be on the roster in mid season; Aviles in minors for Depth         
                    
                    
                    
                    
     Crawford  3,500,000for 6 years          
                    
     TOTAL PAYROLL  177,250,000           
                    
                    
        178,000,000 Right at the luxury tax threshold       
                    
        750,000Very Small Surpluss; this to cover a reliever's pro-rated salary (to be acquired mid year)     
        plus the money found from the "Lackey-clause"          
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Sorry, got truncated....Point is the Sox have very little $ to play w/

    They need a 4th starter and starting depth

    John Garland and Scott Kazmir are the 2 guys I would target for 1 year deals.  Garland could be a 200 IP guy w/ Post Season Success and Kazmir is still only in his 20's and is murder on Lefties albeit injury prone

    Let Bard close and leave Aceves in the pen

    Mid Season move will have to focus around a trade for a reliever - a closer of Bard stumbles

    I'd also like to see what it would take to get Coco back as a 4th OFer......

    Trade Crawford and $ for Wells, you get a RH Bat w Pop, better D and a shorter contract-life....we'll just have to live with the huge KO's but it will be for half the time of Crawford......

    Other than that, let the kids  have a chance to round out the roster - it's all we can do - over 50 million in wasted money in 2012 thanks to the Boy Wonder

    This keeps you right at the luxury-tax threshold

    I don't think they will win a title, although they do have a chance.  And if they win, it will be a strong indication that Theo was over-rated (still far better than the Ca$h-man but over-rated none the less).......I mean, Ben winning despite 50 million dollars in wasted money.......
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Why would Coco Crisp sign to be a 4th outfielder when he can get a starting job elsewhere?
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter1. Show parhunter1's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Where did Aviles go?

    Not sure I'd give up on Crawford just yet, but I see your point on this.

    Stay away from Scott Kazmir.  A waste of money.  He is never going to fulfill his potential.

    Do not think you have enough depth at starter or in the pen.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    So andrew,

    First, you actually want to trade for a guy heading out of his prime with one of the worst contracts in baseball (Wells) while giving up a player in his prime years like Crawford? You might think that Crawford's contract is a bad one, but you are too quick to dump him for a slug like Vernon Wells.

    Secondly, Scott Kazmir? You want to sign Scott Kazmir?? This guy began fading the day before he left Tampa and you want to sign him to a $4,000,000 minor league deal?? Say what?

    Third, Mike Aviles does not even make the team? Holy Moly!

    Me thinks you should take these brilliant ideas and propose them to your favorite team in NY. Because if the Sox did any of this junk it would definitely help out the Yankees.


     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    In response to "Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix": [QUOTE]So andrew, First, you actually want to trade for a guy heading out of his prime with one of the worst contracts in baseball (Wells) while giving up a player in his prime years like Crawford? You might think that Crawford's contract is a bad one, but you are too quick to dump him for a slug like Vernon Wells. Secondly, Scott Kazmir? You want to sign Scott Kazmir?? This guy began fading the day before he left Tampa and you want to sign him to a $4,000,000 minor league deal?? Say what? Third, Mike Aviles does not even make the team? Holy Moly! Me thinks you should take these brilliant ideas and propose them to your favorite team in NY. Because if the Sox did any of this junk it would definitely help out the Yankees. Posted by Soxdog67[/QUOTE] Crawford is going to replace Drew as his new binky for the next few years...get used to it
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    I am so sorry for Andrew that Drew has left. Am also sorry for Law that Theo is gone. Sorry for Softlaw that Jake has excelled. Sorry for Bosox1941 that Tito is gone. It is going to be a slow year on the Forum.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    In Response to Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix:
    [QUOTE]I am so sorry for Andrew that Drew has left. Am also sorry for Law that Theo is gone. Sorry for Softlaw that Jake has excelled. Sorry for Bosox1941 that Tito is gone. It is going to be a slow year on the Forum.
    Posted by UticaClub[/QUOTE]

    Speaking of Law...I always thought he was Dan Duquette when he posted here...especially the way he hated Theo (his successor) and licked Manny's jock (his big signing).  The fact that he has disappeared makes me even more convinced now since Danny D has a new gig.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    My post got truncted:  Aviles has a chance to earn a spot on Opening Day but more likely gives you depth in the minors (remember, Punto pretty much has Aviles' role now.  Granted I have 3 catchers b/c I want to use Lavarnway as a RHPH so maybe BV keeps Lavarnway in AAA and keeps Mike A around which I wouldn't agree with but I wouldn't complain about either).

    RE:  Kazmir - we have NO one in the minors ready to step in.  We have a little money.  We need a guy trying to earn his way back for a good price.  If you don't like Kazmir, then who else is out there for this role?  Would you prefer Bad Penny?  Colon?  I chose Kazmir.  RE:  the 4 million.....I was thinking 3 million with a 1 million dollar bonus if he gets called up.  He could reject a minor league assignmentl so you gotta open the wallet up a little.

    If Crawford is in his prime then we are in big trouble.  I'd rather take my chances with Wells who has only 3 years left vs Crawford's 6.  Crawford was a total head-case last year which makes me think you have to cut bait with him.  In addition, there is the issue of where Crawford fits into the batting order.  He would be batting from 6th on down.  I'd rather have Wells bat 6th w/ his pop and if Craw bats in the bottom third, that is really a joke given his salary....

    RE:  Coco.  All I did was ask the question and mention my ideal player for this role.  I'd like to have him as our #4 OF but he should be able to get more $ and be a potential starter elsewhere. 

    RE:  Pitching Depth.  Clearly we are going on the cheap in the pen.  It's easier to plug in rookies in the reliever role and to add a veteran mid season to the pen then to add a starter.  Also, that is why Aceves is in the pen (to add depth).  Therefore, given we only have 3 starters now (2 of which are injury prone) and one unproven rookie (Doubrant), and no one in the minors ready to start we need 2 veterans that will be affordable.  I liked the Garland/Kazmir combo.  Garland can give you innings and has PS success and Kazmir is only 28 and can try and work his way back to the ML's.  Both could be had for an affordable incentive laden deals I believe.

    Is all of this ideal?  No.  Theo didn't leave us w/ much flexibility.  My point is to deal with Crawford, get the best pair of starters you could afford, shuffle around the pen and bench (and allow kids to earn jobs), keep Bard and Aceves in the pen, try and add some depth, and leave yourself flexibility to add a reliever or closer mid season (which again, is far easier than adding a starter).

    Hey, I'd say just go for Gio and take your chances but I don't think we have the talent to deal to Oakland for that.  Again, Theo sk rewed us....

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jgallag1. Show jgallag1's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    I still don't understand why everyone is trying to get rid of CC for a bag of balls. Was he overpayed? Hell yes! But they all are. It doesn't mean you have to crucify the guy for it. CC will go out and produce like he did in Tampa...just like JD went out and got overpayed for doing the same things he had his entire career. As long as CC goes out and plays his type of ball instead of trying to live up to the contract, then he will be the guy he was in Tampa...and I think we should all be very happy with that.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    My money is against him.  Just as it was against Drew.  Drew's contract was proven to be a bad one.  All we can do is see how the CC saga plays out. 

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jgallag1. Show jgallag1's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Drew's contract was bad from the beginning though. There was no reason he should have been payed so much. But other than that he did what he always had...played solid defense...got on base pretty well and sat out entirely too many games due to "injury". If he had been getting paayed what Coco was for instance, I doubt people would have hated him quite so much. I just really hope that's not the road we go down with CC. He's not going to be an Albert Pujols...he's not going to come in as relief and throw a 98mph heater...he's going to be Carl Crawford and will be getting paid too much. I just hope we don't let the contract effect our expectations and base them on his past performance instead.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxmeister. Show soxmeister's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Crawford had a bad year.  But he is a stud, and has the potential to be a star in Boston.   He isn't going anywhere.  He will play better under BobbyV ....
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Drew's gone now....Time to move on.....I wanted to talk about how we could clean up the mess that Theo left behind.  $52.5 million in bogus contracts:

    Lackey @ 16.5
    Dice K @ 10
    Jenks @ 6
    Crawful @ 20

    That's more than the entire payroll for Tampa

    Makes me think (or hope) that Theo was actually fired
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Crawford had a bad year, and holds one of the richest contracts in sports history; yet he refuses to communicate directly with our new manager.

    I don't like Carl already.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Crawford to the Angels and 21 million for Vernon Wells

    Pay the 21 million over the life of the Crawford Contract or 3.5 million per year

    We get Wells essentially for 3 years @ $73.5 million and then 3 more years @ 3.5 million

    Angels get Crawford for 6 years/99 million

    Wells is a better fit for the Sox and Crawford is a better fit for the Angels

    Sox over-pay big time for Welsl but in the long-run save $38 Million and roll the dice with a guy who can't be any worse than what Crawford was last year

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    In Response to Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix:
    [QUOTE]My money is against him.  Just as it was against Drew.  Drew's contract was proven to be a bad one.  All we can do is see how the CC saga plays out. 
    Posted by andrewmitch[/QUOTE]

    Point is andrew....we're not playing with YOUR money here.

    Trading for 33 year old Vernon Wells is a bad, bad idea..PERIOD! Aren't we trying to make this team younger, not older.

    If Kazmir is willing to sign a minor league deal with a two way contract I'm ok with that...but no way the team will absorb 3-4 million more on the major league payroll for a guy whose career has been flickering....I don't know the reasons for this but he is not the same dominate pitcher he showed with the Rays a couple of years ago.

    I highly doubt Coco Crisp would settle for a 4th OF position..plus the Sox need a player in RF that has some pop...the OF is full of Coco Crisp types now.  My guess is that a Andruw Jones, Ryan Ludwick, Cody Ross or less likely Yoenis Cespedes will be a piece of the OF puzzle in 2012.

    Drew was never worth his contract, and it is likely that Crawford will never meet the expectation of most fans to match the size of his contract...but I say the Sox FO made the decision...which our new GM advocated for, and we just let the guy go play and forget the contract!

    I can't believe a player would lose his ability to play just because he signed for a big payday, unless he has decided to relax and milk it like Clemens with his last Sox contract.



     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    If the money doesn't come from the fans then I am really at a loss here?  Is this just a hobby for Mr Henry?  I didn't realize he was dipping into his own pockets to run the team.  Good for him if he is.

    RE:  Coco - I already agreed.  Like I said, that would be ideal but he's gonna have a better offer somewhere's else.  If Theo didn't blow the Jenks deal, we could have had Coco for the same 2 years/12 million as a platoon-type player who would see plenty of action.

    RE:  Kazmir.  OK.  Like I said, we need a starter.  If you don't like this idea then what DO you like?

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    gotta say Vernon Wells is not an option...
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    You could be right but what's the rationale for it not being an option?

    Angels woudn't never go for it?  You think Wells is worse?  Why not?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from jgallag1. Show jgallag1's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    In Response to Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix:
    [QUOTE] Drew was never worth his contract, and it is likely that Crawford will never meet the expectation of most fans to match the size of his contract...but I say the Sox FO made the decision...which our new GM advocated for, and we just let the guy go play and forget the contract! I can't believe a player would lose his ability to play just because he signed for a big payday, unless he has decided to relax and milk it like Clemens with his last Sox contract.
    Posted by Soxdog67[/QUOTE]

    Exactly...but a player could be a detriment to his own game if he tries to be more than he is in an attempt to live up to that contract. I'd be willing to bet it's more of that than a Clemens situation
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Crawford was overrated even whilst in Tampa.

    What was his career OBP and his career high?  Both not impressive.

    Why was Madden dropping him to like 8th vs Lefties?

    How many times did baserunners fear running on Carl's arm?

    How many times did Crawford belt more than even 18 HR's?

    And all this for a guy who's game is his legs and will never see another 75 SB season again.....

    Don't get me wrong, he was a good ball player but not 142 million good.  How many 142 million dollar guys have trouble finding a home in a line up?

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Andrew

    I'm not down with your moves for a variety of reasons.

    1. Starting Pitching.  Much more expensive then bullpen arms.  Why not let Bard and Aceves battle our for the 4th-5th spots with a guy like Saunders.
    2. Bullpen is much easier to fill the gaps and is far less expensive. We could add three guys for 4 million to the bullpen.  BP is a complete roll of the dice.
    3. Crawford had one sub-par year in a pressure packed city.  Granderson also did this and is my best comparison.  CC will rebound nicely if used properly in the order.  I still say let him bat 2nd and have Pedey bat 3rd. 
    Jacoby/CC/Pedroia/AGon/Youk/Papi/Salty/Scutaro/RF

    I would do the following.
    1. Madsen 3 yrs 30 million take it or leave it offer. 4th year option.  All of a sudden our BP goes from major concern to pretty darn solid when either Bard or Aceves enters the mix(likely Aceves).
    2. Cody Ross 2 yrs 15 million.  
    3. Joe Saunders 2 yrs 10 million.

    Thats about 22 million give or take.   What more does the front office have to do at that point.  I think Aviles has some trade value.  Punto was brought in for a reason.   Unless they have Punto/Aviles/Shop/Reddick(Or Kalish on the bench).

    I would feel more than comfortable with:

    SP
    Lester/Beckett/Clay/Saunders/Bard with Doubrount/Miller as potential fill ins.  I also know Dice K coming back doesnt warm anyones heart.  But it sure is like adding a 5th starter down the stretch for me.  I think he will perform b/c he wants $$$$.  Perfect time of the year as well.  
    BP
    Madsen/Melacon/Aceves/Jenks/Morales/Albers/Open

    SL
    read above

    Bench
    Punto/Ross/Shop/Aviles

    Its not perfect but it has potential. 

     
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Shupe - you made some great points but the issue is $$$$$$.  Did you add-up the $ you are spending?  Under your plan Sox go over 178, the luxury tax threshold.  My plan kept them right at 178 million.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mt200. Show Mt200's posts

    Re: Theo left us w/ a mess but here's a potential fix

    Wells is awful, worser than Crawford. Crawford only has one bad year. Wells is done. The money both are getting are about twice their value.

    What about Werth for Crawford? I want no part of Wells.
     

Share