Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from FrGL27Rings.. Show FrGL27Rings.'s posts

    Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    There is criticism of Francona by some members of this board. Who would you like to replace him with or are you satisfied that he is the right leader for this team?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    I think Francona the best fit for the club and how they like things run as an organization. There seems to be a mutual respect with him and the players.

    I have asked those who bash him consistantly to name someone that they would honestly trust and that would fit this organization and have recieved not one serious answer to date.

    Im all for taking someone seriously IF they have a legit name and a good arguement for their choice. i mean, thats what this forum should be about.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from promise4you. Show promise4you's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    In Response to Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?:
    [QUOTE]There is criticism of Francona by some members of this board. Who would you like to replace him with or are you satisfied that he is the right leader for this team?
    Posted by FrGL27Rings.[/QUOTE]

    Earl Weaver, unfortunately I dont believe he is available, biggest captian hook that ever lived!
     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    'Coma it is!

    I like him a lot as a manager...he has taken a highly paid team of veteran stars and in almost every single category, has had them collectiveily underachieve so much that we are a running joke in MLB.  We should keep him forever and make George W Bush our president for life too.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from drpjn. Show drpjn's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?


    ONLY Francona.  Get a life.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from summerof67. Show summerof67's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    Tito and only Tito.  He "gets it."

    Barring him, maybe Joe Torre.  But I don't see any of the good ones - Gardenhire, Sciosca - lasting very long in Boston.

    Just my $.02.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    No one can toss a wad of gum like Francona.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from playball01. Show playball01's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    In Response to Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?:
    [QUOTE]There is criticism of Francona by some members of this board. Who would you like to replace him with or are you satisfied that he is the right leader for this team?
    Posted by FrGL27Rings.[/QUOTE]

    I think that any time a ballclub is deficient in various categories, resulting in sloppy play and losses that the manager needs to be questioned or criticized but with that being said I don't see a viable replacement for Francona.

    Francona has surely made in-game play calling blunders but don't most MLB managers throughout a 162 game season? The problem is that these players are not playing as a cohesive unit and are finding too many ways to lose ball games.

    Although some fault can be laid at the feet of the managerial staff the question becomes .... "HOW MUCH OF THE BLAME" and when does the manager start to hold players accountable, regardless of salary or past performances, and relegate the slumping player to the bench in light of a lesser player with a winning attitude?

    If a fire is going to be lit under this team then it needs to start with a spark and thus far, there is no spark plug that has presented itself.
     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from law2009a. Show law2009a's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    m
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from REDSOX-11. Show REDSOX-11's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    That would be a vast improvement over what is there now, but that is a different subject.

    He won 2 WS and will take him 85 more years to win another, so I guess you are correct keep him he's the best.


    In Response to Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?:
    [QUOTE]'Coma it is! I like him a lot as a manager...he has taken a highly paid team of veteran stars and in almost every single category, has had them collectiveily underachieve so much that we are a running joke in MLB.  We should keep him forever and make George W Bush our president for life too.
    Posted by georom4[/QUOTE]
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from william93063. Show william93063's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    If Tito suddenly left for some unforeseen reason(not going to happen) Joe Madden would be a great second choice but he is going to stay in Tampa for the foreseeable future, and Tito has a contract through 2014!
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from M1A2. Show M1A2's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    Encinitas, glad you asked.

    The only sensible answer is Francona.  If you fire him, you are telling the pitchers--2 or 3 starters and most of the bullpen--who are stinking things up it's not their fault.  Ditto the hitters.  Today against a lefty--lefties have been murder against the Sox this season--Francona is cramming righties into the lineup.  So he had three guys (CC, Salty, and Cameron) hitting under the mendoza line and a fourth, Scutaro, hitting .222.  His #2 and #4 hitters, Pedey and Youk, are well below par.  Pedroia's in a slump and Youk these days likes to strike out with guys on third and one or no outs.  That leaves three hitters in today's lineup, and two of them are lefties, Ellsbury and Gonzalez. 

    It gets worse.  Today Ellsbury led off the game with a double, stole third, and almost didn't score.  He only made it home because Pedey, the blind squirrel, found a nut by getting walked, goodness knows why.  Otherwise, Youk would have been the third out (another K), and Lowrie would not have come to bat with Ellsbury on 3B. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from REDSOX-11. Show REDSOX-11's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    TALK ABOUT WORST SIGNING EVER?

    In Response to Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?:
    [QUOTE]If Tito suddenly left for some unforeseen reason(not going to happen) Joe Madden would be a great second choice but he is going to stay in Tampa for the foreseeable future, and Tito has a contract through 2014!
    Posted by william93063[/QUOTE]
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    You know you're going out of your way to find things to fill your complaining quota for the day when you type a sentence like "Today Ellsbury led off the game with a double, stole third, and almost didn't score"!
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from M1A2. Show M1A2's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    Actually, I thought the Ellsbury thing was the perfect example of what is wrong with the Sox right now--Youk and Pedroia are not contributing to the offense, and they occupy the #2 and #4 slots in the lineup.  And here's the worst part, with the possible exception of Lowrie, they are still the best available for those slots. 

    Ellsbury is on a 16 game hitting streak, but that makes no difference if the guys behind him aren't hitting or, in Pedroia's case, bunting (he tries, but misses or bunts foul). 
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    In Response to Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?:
    [QUOTE]The question supposes Francona critics (of which I am one) know the contractual status of other MLB managers, and who the managerial talent is at the AAA level.  If I had to name a manager that gets more out of less, Joe Maddon certainly comes to mind.  The notion that Francona is untouchable is hard to fathom.  Yes he presided over our two titles, but c'mon, he has been give a wealth of talent to work with. Pedro, Schilling, Lowe, Papelbon, Lester - he had some of the best pitchers in Sox history.  Same thing with the offense - consistently loaded with talent other managers would give their left nut for. He is not without positive attributes.  Loyalty, patience and ego management have their place, but this team has gone from 2007 WS champ, to 2008 ALCS loser, to 2009 first round exit, to 2010 no playoffs, to 2011 losing record.  So I turn the question around for Francona supporters. At what point should the manager be held accountable for his team's continual decline in performance?
    Posted by Encinitas[/QUOTE]

    What you casually give no credit to is the fact that the Sox made the playoffs in 2008 and 2009. What -- they "declined" because they didn't win the W.S every year. Are you serioius.

    In 2008, they did take it to the game 7 despite injuries to several key players. Remember, they were w/o their starting 3B and their start DH, SS and C were all playing hurt yet it still was a game 7.

    It's hard enough to win when you're healthy let alone beat up like they were. In 2009, they simply were outplayed. What -- a manager is supposed to be fired every time another team plays better? Was it Francona's fault that Papelbon blew Game 3? He's the closer. He didn't do his job. Simple as that.

    And last year is why Francona's critics have absolutely no credibility when they said the Sox still should have been in the playoffs depsite all the injuries. Really? Losing All-Stars at three postions plus 2/3 of the starting OF means nothing.

    How many of you were calling for Francona to be fired after 2006 when the Sox were hit by all the injuries. What happened? They won in 2007. You're going to blame him for 2006 but not give him credit for 2007. Pretty patheic if you ask me.

    OK, we'll let the critics pick the manager of their choice adn field a team of minimum-wage rookies. Why does the team need All-Stars. According to the critics, losing All-Stars doesn't matter if you have the right manager.

    And you yourself say the Sox had a great lineup so they should win. OK fine, but the fact is, in the second half of the season, they didn't have that great lineup so your argument doesn't hold up.

    The fact is, last year the Sox got off to a slow start but were a half-game out at the mid-season point when they were relatively healthy (the loss of Ellsbury, Cameron adn Hermida when he was productive notwithstanding). When injuries to All-Stars like Pedoria (three months), Youk (two months) and Martinez (one month) started to pile up, they fell off the pace. You don't think that they might have made a difference in one win per month each. That's six more wins and 95 wins instead of 89.

    And before the injuries during the early slow start, Francona was patient, tweaked the lineup to account for slumps and what happened? They became the hottest team in baseball to move to a half game out. No credit for that?

    Critics/bashers also have no credibility because they blame every loss on Francona. Even a 100-win team is going to lose 62 games, but if you read their posts after every loss, Francona should be fired for not going 162-0.

    Managers aren't going to make the right decisions all the time and the in-game stuff is tremendously overrated. This baseball, not football or basketball where a coach can call plays on every offensive or defensive play. Baseball managers don't have that kind of in-game control. They don't have a video-game controller where they can affect every play, yet the bashers refuse to acknowlege that. Stats show that 'small ball' is a low-percentage way to manage and they refuse to acknowledge that. All managers use pitch counts (even the Rangers); all managers will try to get five innings out of the starter even if that means  that the starter gives up six or seven runs; they refuse to acknowledge that. They make it sound as if Francona is out on an island.

    A common criticism is that Francona coddles his player, but if you listen to the players themselves, they'll tell you that he gets on their case. He does it behind closed doors, not in public. Is that coddling. If you mess up at work, does your boss rip you a new one in the middle of the office in front of everyone or does he/she talk to you behind closed doors.

    I asked a question on other threads that blamed Francona's handling of spring training as the reason why the Sox got off to a slow start. What did he do different this year compared to other years when they got off to solid starts? After having success at the beginning of the year in other seasons, did Francona all of a sudden change what they do? I asked that question a couple of times. The answer -- crickets.

    How about holding the players accountable? Gee, that's a novel concept -- having someone take responsible for their own actions. 

    Francona isn't above criticism. No one is. But there is a difference between constructive criticism and mindless bashing. You hold up Maddon as a great manager. Really? I live about 45 minutes or so from Tampa. You should hear the fans rip him. You people would be on him like vultures in less than a year.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Stengel. Show Stengel's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    Francona seems to have you posters here divided. He needs to go just based on that.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    In Response to Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?:
    [QUOTE]Francona seems to have you posters here divided. He needs to go just based on that.
    Posted by Stengel[/QUOTE]

    This is an even more bizarre statement. Are you really suggesting that baseball teams make decision on the manager based on the opinions of the fans?

    For get about hiring a Bill James for the front office to analyze stats. I guess every team needs to hire someone from Gallup to poll the fans on what they should do.
     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from law2009a. Show law2009a's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    m
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from eggplants. Show eggplants's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

                               The fact of the matter is that this is an ownership decision.If they're OK with the way the club is going they'll stay with "T". If they feel change is needed they'll move on that. Who's available? Demarlo Hale, Ken Macha, Bobby Valentine, some others I'm sure. The first two are familiar to RS ownership. Bobby Valentine would represent a noticeable departure from "T". This guy is all about preparation. This would be posted in the locker room. The 5P's: PROPER PREPARATION PREVENTS  POOR PERFORMANCE. He lives it on a daily basis. Have we come to this yet? 
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from zack5042. Show zack5042's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    In Response to Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?:
    [QUOTE]Certainly players should be held accountable, but you can not fire the whole team.  A manager's job is to put his team in the best position to win by having his team well prepared, holding his players accountable, and by making sound game time decisions.  This team makes fundamental Little League mistakes (e.g. Varitek failing to tag the runner earlier this year, Cameron getting thrown out at third in the 8th against the Angels, Cameron lazily going to ball vs Angels allowing the runner to stretch a routine single into a double, countless guys taking call third strikes with runners on third,  and so on).  Cameron is back in the line up today, apparently unaccountable for his poor play, decision making and effort. Pitching and bullpen management is highly questionable.  Why was Papelbon brought into a blow out on Tuesday (he had just pitched Sun)?  It left him availble for only one inning in the extra inning game.  That led to using Dice K in relief, then Wake as a starter.  Francona's poor decision making hurt his team. I can give dozens of examples and Francona defenders will make their excuses.  The team results have declined for 4 straight years depsite significant investment in payroll.  So again Francona supporters, what exactly does it take for him to be replaced? 
    Posted by Encinitas[/QUOTE]
    You say that francona supporters make their excuses. Do we make our excuses or do you fail to acknowledge the fact that the manager doesn't control all aspects of the game. There is multiple coaches on a team. So pitchers do bad and you blame tito instead of the pitching coach and other stuff. Don't blame francona because Variteks mind was out of the game. He is the best catcher in baseball (Defensive wise) and everybody knows that. V-tek doesnt realize that the play was a tag what do you want francona to do stop time and tell him he has to tag the runner? Cameron is a veteran and known for his defense do you expect him to do those things? Hey also guess what did you know that Tito can't control whether or not the batter decides to swing? Whats he going to tell him you need to swing when you have 2 strike and get the player out of his comfort zone and have him striking out on pitches way out of the zone. I don't think so. So what i've been hearing here is that you guys want to fire tito and hire a manager already on a team? That doesnt always work Maddon isn't going to leave the rays same with other managers. Yes we have declined for four straight year but guess what so has many other teams. You can't win the world series then win it the next year then win it the next year then win it the next year do you know how hard that is to do? Be happy you have a team that makes the playoffs almost every year. Be happy you have a team that keeps it exciting in the end. I know living in florida in 2008 watching them face the rays the games were pretty exhilerating coming back down 7 runs in the 7th inning. I thought for sure we were going to win it. But we didnt the good news is we played until the end. Same with the team we had last year we stayed in the race until the last week. Despite the injuries. Despite the downward spiral of papelbon. Despite the failure of some of our best bullpen pitchers. You guys talked about the relief pitching last year but what you don't realize is those guys were good for us until last year. Relief pitching is the weirdest thing you can go from the best pitcher to the worst pitcher in a month. Wheeler has been pretty good through out his career same with Jenks. Jenks had one bad season last year so people wrote him off and we took a chance with him. they haven't worked out so far. People are saying we didn't make our bullpen any better during the offseason. Guess what we signed 3 or 4 relief pitchers. Did you want Theo spending 12 million a year on a relief pitcher for 3 years when that never tends to work out? Learn a little about baseball before you criticise because it just makes you look dumb. 
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronho. Show ronho's posts

    Re: Who would be the best manager to lead this present 2011 edition of the Boston Red Sox?

    Is Dick Williams still alive???
     

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