Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement

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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    Nice Story but, What happens to Youk ?? Looks like DH'ing part time 3rd and 1st can't be to far away for him ??
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]Nice Story but, What happens to Youk ?? Looks like DH'ing part time 3rd and 1st can't be to far away for him ??
    Posted by ALaGatorAL[/QUOTE]

    Even on an aggressive timeline, Middlebrooks spends 3/4 of the 2012 season in AAA.  No decision needs to be made surrounding Youk at this time.  For the 2013 season, Youk will be 34.  Nothing wrong with paying a DH a net salary of $12M by picking up an option (see Papi).  The only question is if there will be a DH opening, or if Lavarnway will need to move there, or if Papi is re-signed to a multi-year deal.

    The ideal solution would be to keep Youk for 2013, start him off at 3B for the first month or 2.  Then call up Middlebrooks and slide Youk to DH for the remainder of the 2013 season.  Hopefully Lavarnway sticks at catcher.  This way you keep Middlebrooks under team control for an extra year and gain leverage for any potential extension.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    Will Middlebrooks' .315/.359/.498/.857 line at Double A this year should help the thirdbaseman improve on his C+ grade from prospect analyst John Sickels in December and find a spot on the Baseball America'Red Sox organizational list that omitted Middlebrooks in November:

    http://www.minorleagueball.com/2010/12/27/1898326/boston-red-sox-top-20-prospects-for-2011

    http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/organization-top-10-prospects/2011/2610882.html

    Regardless, Middlebrooks has taken a step in the right direction this year.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]Lowrie and Middlebrooks should be part of trade bait for Kemp.
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    Middlebrooks should be kept around and not traded.  Youk won't be playing 3B for long the way he gets beat up.  If Youk continues to produce he could eventually move to DH, or be part of a trade if Lavarnway ends up at DH.

    I do agree kids like Middlebrooks and Lavarnway could tempt the Dodgers into a trade for Kemp, especially if either Kalish or Reddick along with Lowrie were included but our farm would be far from well stocked after such a trade.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]I didn't say Lowrie and Middlebrooks as trade. I said as trade bait. One would go, preferrabley Lowrie, and the other wood stay. Both are not needed. Ellsbury should be the 2.5 years of Dodger affordable lead trade bait. Ellsbury and Lowrie or Middlebrooks and Hassan or Brentz and Doubrant or Weiland
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    The Sox have tried desperately since Damon left to solidify our lead off position.  I just don't see Theo including Ells in a package as quickly as he may have last season.  I would rather use guys like Lavarnway, Middlebrooks, Reddick or Kalish, Lowrie and Doubront as bait and keep Jacoby at lead off.

    The Dodgers may also need to take Drew to even things out a bit until his contract expires. 

     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]Lowrie and Middlebrooks should be part of trade bait for Kemp.
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    Hey Softy, why don't you propose the Kemp deal another 50 times! Kemp, Kemp, Kemp! You hate Ellsbury. You hate Ellsbury. You hate Ellsbury. Tell it to us so many times we will go deaf.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    Um, so Ellsbury will revert to mean v RHP but his 2011 aberrant stats vs. LHP are indicative of a major problem?  Let's see:
    - increasing power is typically seen at Ells age (not saying he's instantly a 20+HR guy but you can't legitimately state his historical AB/HR & AB/2B rate is a more accurate predictor of future performance)
    - Overall his v. RHP stats are more important since 2/3 of his future AB will be v. RHP
    - Historically (read larger sample set) he has fairly balanced split stats

    Personally, I'd like a good RH bat with + HR power but I think we can have our cake and eat it too ... keep Ells for the remainder of team control AND get the RH bat.  

     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]I didn't say Lowrie and Middlebrooks as trade. I said as trade bait. One would go, preferrabley Lowrie, and the other wood stay. Both are not needed. Ellsbury should be the 2.5 years of Dodger affordable lead trade bait. Ellsbury and Lowrie or Middlebrooks and Hassan or Brentz and Doubrant or Weiland
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    unless the dodgers are interested in opening a MASH UNIT at their ballpark,
    why in the world would they want lowrie?
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement : unless the dodgers are interested in opening a MASH UNIT at their ballpark, why in the world would they want lowrie?
    Posted by the_yazzer[/QUOTE]

    I was saying the same thing yazer..he bashes Lowrie for bad D and being soft, yet thinks the dodgers will be doing backflips to get him..Wieland has work to do ,Doubront isnt a front line starter..Unless they are completely out of their minds in LA, Ranaudo will be who they would want as a centerpiece IMO..prob Lavarnway, Brentz or Middlebrooks too...3-4 guys IMO..Then we will have issues on the farm..
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]The Sox have tried desperately since Damon left to solidify our lead off position.  I just don't see Theo including Ells in a package as quickly as he may have last season.  I would rather use guys like Lavarnway, Middlebrooks, Reddick or Kalish, Lowrie and Doubront as bait and keep Jacoby at lead off. You think backwards. Now couldn't be a better time to trade Ellsbury. Kemp could leadoff, for crying out loud. He does everything Ellsbury does, except better, and Ellsbury is not the "power" source that Boras has just boasted , particularly against LHP. And one year does not a career OPS make. Scutaro and Crawford could split the duty, as "solidifying leadoff" is a meaningless phrase. How about solidifying a young RH OF'er with power against LHP. Theo seems to ignore that. If Crawford can't do the job at leadoff, what was Theo smoking when he paid 142M for a career year on a high mileage guy who is at his essence a punch and judy hitter with a horrible swing process. He makes Tiger Woods' swing look like Sam Snead. The reality is that Reddick has a better swing. Just hearing Boras' recent quote nonsense is anough to throw up over. Get the deal done for a Kemp like profile and let the Dodgers bask in Ellsbury's control for 2.5 years and great hitting v. LHP. The Dodgers may also need to take Drew to even things out a bit until his contract expires.  No need to take Drew to even out. Kemp's owed about 3.5M for this year, or 2.3M more than Ellsbury. If Lowrie and other 40 man players are dealth, I don't think 1 or 2 M is going to register on the CBT meter. Keep Reddick who, even if he falls back to a marginal plate man, is currently the only OF'er hitting LHP. Tiny sample but the Red Sox get a lot better long term, and better now if they go with Kemp and Reddick/Kalish over Ellsbury and a Theo classic dumpster dive. If Theo has an ounce of sense, he'll ignore what Ellsbury is doing against RHP and what will amount to career high mid-season graph points. Crawford is due back, Ellsbury will fall from the peak against RHP, and the Red Sox have the biggest short and long term void of all in the OF construction.
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    I think you may be a bit too anxious to get rid of Ells.  We could definitely use a RHH RF who can handle lefties but you certainly don't give up your starting CF and first good lead off batter "since Damon" who already hits lefties in return. 

    Your filling one position while opening up another hole it took years to fill.  Stranger things have happened but I don't see Ells in package for Kemp.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE] was saying the same thing yazer..he bashes Lowrie for bad D and being soft, yet thinks the dodgers will be doing backflips to get him. . Show me where I said the Dodgers will do backflaps to get Lowrie. I said "Lowrie or Middlebrooks", you prevaricating pug. Since college, Ellsbury has never hit more than 9 homers in his life. I don't think 10 homers v. RHP is reason to pay 10 to 12M on a team that already has Crawford and needs more than a dumpster dive for an OF that has nothing v. LHP.
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    Middlebrooks trade value >>>>>>>> Lowrie's trade value.  Middlebrooks has 3 extra years of team control, Lowrie (as good as he is vs LHP) has a lengthy injury history.  To consider Lowrie over Middlebrooks would be equivalent to doing backflips to get Lowrie IMO.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE] Since college, Ellsbury has never hit more than 9 homers in his life. I don't think 10 homers v. RHP is reason to pay 10 to 12M on a team that already has Crawford and needs more than a dumpster dive for an OF that has nothing v. LHP.
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    $13M - $16M over 2 years is a great value for the 2nd best leadoff hitter in MLB (According to OBP [.388] and OPS [.884] with a min. of 150 PA's), who has played above average defense in CF this season (although he certainly has room for improvement).  Especially compared to what Kemp will command ($12M+ for 2012 alone).
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    Middlebrooks isn't going anywhere...

    He is on track to be ready for ~2013. The Red Sox have Youkilis under contract through 2012 with an option for 2013. Rarely does a position-handover mesh so perfectly!

    If I had to guess, I'd say the Red Sox use Youkilis' option and have Middlebrooks on the Pawtucket shuttle that year. Full time in 2014.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    I'd rather my leadoff hitter had a .328 OBP against lefties (Ells this year, but .352 career), than having a leadoff hitter who only has a career .324 OBP against RHP's considering the majority of pitchers are right handed (Kemp's career mark).  In fairness Kemp's career OBP against lefties is .402.

    I'm not convinced that Kemp is worth what it would cost to get him in addition to the salary, unless we're talking about a package to play Kemp in RF while keeping Ells.

    Career marks:

    Ells:    .296/.351/.422     3.9 UZR/150 in CF, 23.9 in RF (only 287 innings)
    Kemp: .289/.344/.486     -12.1 UZR/150 in CF, -5.9 in RF (1220 innings)
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]who already hits lefties in return. No OF'er but Reddick (~12 PA) is hitting LHP "in return". Your filling one position while opening up another hole it took years to fill. What is Kemp's OBP? What position does Crawford fill that took "years to fill"? At 142M, what hole does he fill? Scutaro v. LHP  OBP  .351  Crawford v. RHP OBP .310 (Career .345) Kemp v. LHP OBP  .484  8 SB 0 CS Ellsbury v. LHP OBP .328  7 SB 1 CS Reddick v. LHP (tiny sample lights out) One has to have a hole in the head to whine about a leadoff hole. Of course you don't see it happening, and neither does Theo. That's the point! The point is that, both short and long term, it should happen. Frankly, Reddick has a better swing and could leadoff adequately by simply doing what he's been doing. More patience. But even if Reddick's OBP was .300, he has more defensive talent than Ellsbury and a star RH OF"er in and Ellsbury out is the only way to go long term. Theo signed Crawford for no valid reason. If he spends another 12 to 14M on Ellsbury, on top of Crawford, he's the idiot I think he is.
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]



    "at 142M what hole does he fill?"

    answer: THEO'S

    and, yes, based on theo's many bad free agent signings, i think the word IDIOT is appropriate.
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]The Sox have tried desperately since Damon left to solidify our lead off position.  I just don't see Theo including Ells in a package as quickly as he may have last season.  I would rather use guys like Lavarnway, Middlebrooks, Reddick or Kalish, Lowrie and Doubront as bait and keep Jacoby at lead off. You think backwards. Now couldn't be a better time to trade Ellsbury. Kemp could leadoff, for crying out loud. He does everything Ellsbury does, except better, and Ellsbury is not the "power" source that Boras has just boasted , particularly against LHP. And one year does not a career OPS make. Scutaro and Crawford could split the duty, as "solidifying leadoff" is a meaningless phrase. How about solidifying a young RH OF'er with power against LHP. Theo seems to ignore that. If Crawford can't do the job at leadoff, what was Theo smoking when he paid 142M for a career year on a high mileage guy who is at his essence a punch and judy hitter with a horrible swing process. He makes Tiger Woods' swing look like Sam Snead. The reality is that Reddick has a better swing. Just hearing Boras' recent quote nonsense is anough to throw up over. Get the deal done for a Kemp like profile and let the Dodgers bask in Ellsbury's control for 2.5 years and great hitting v. LHP. The Dodgers may also need to take Drew to even things out a bit until his contract expires.  No need to take Drew to even out. Kemp's owed about 3.5M for this year, or 2.3M more than Ellsbury. If Lowrie and other 40 man players are dealth, I don't think 1 or 2 M is going to register on the CBT meter. Keep Reddick who, even if he falls back to a marginal plate man, is currently the only OF'er hitting LHP. Tiny sample but the Red Sox get a lot better long term, and better now if they go with Kemp and Reddick/Kalish over Ellsbury and a Theo classic dumpster dive. If Theo has an ounce of sense, he'll ignore what Ellsbury is doing against RHP and what will amount to career high mid-season graph points. Crawford is due back, Ellsbury will fall from the peak against RHP, and the Red Sox have the biggest short and long term void of all in the OF construction.
    Posted by billbyboy[/QUOTE]

    Ignorance is bliss...
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    Theo signed Crawford for no valid reason. If he spends another 12 to 14M on Ellsbury, on top of Crawford, he's the idiot I think he is.

    You don't have to say anything for me to think that "you are the idiot I know you are".
     
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    Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statem...

    In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Will Middlebrooks:One NL talent evaluator calls him "a [expletive] stud"- Middlebrooks making a powerful statement : Ignorance is bliss...
    Posted by Beantowne[/QUOTE]


    ignorance is also THEO...
     

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